My first traffic stop with a CCW permit

This is a discussion on My first traffic stop with a CCW permit within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; It finally happened, my first traffic stop with a concealed carry permit. It was a short time ago, on a Saturday night about midnight. And ...

Page 1 of 4 1234 LastLast
Results 1 to 15 of 53

Thread: My first traffic stop with a CCW permit

  1. #1
    Member Array JAG45's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    Central Arkansas I-40 heading west
    Posts
    206

    My first traffic stop with a CCW permit

    It finally happened, my first traffic stop with a concealed carry permit. It was a short time ago, on a Saturday night about midnight. And it did not begin very well as we were not really thinking and did everything wrong to start with. I had stopped on the side of the road when this Jeep Cherokee pasted me, and I was not paying much attention to it. It had one of those big carriers on its receiver hitch. No tag light so, at first it looked like it had no license plate to the rear. He turned at the next intersection so I turned on the blue lights and pulled him over. He pulled over on the shoulder but not all the way off the roadway (as far as he could at that location). No traffic at this hour so I let the cruiser block half of the lane. The jeep is occupied two times. Dispatch had some traffic going on, so I had to wait a little to report my location, vehicle description, and reason for stop as required. So the gentleman, a middle aged man (about 6 foot and 190 pounds) starts to get out of the Jeep. I am already on the radio so I can not hit the PA and tell him to stay in the car. This is not good. I watch for a little while longer and debate to call for back up NOW. If someone gets out of the car it is about an 85 to 90% chance that something is wrong. Something is in the car they do not want you to see, or they are getting ready to run or just a drunk that wants to fight. If I call in now I know that the nearest officer in this small town is about 2 minutes away and if I wait he will be heading the other way doubling the response time each minute


    The gentleman is fumbling through his wallet and looking at the back of his vehicle checking his lights and appears a little unsteady on his feet. I watch for a few more seconds, standing with the door open, mike in hand. It is midnight, pitch black, no lights or houses around, no traffic, and just a quarter mile off a main highway. This is all happened in less that 60 seconds from the time the car started to pull over…. How many decisions have I already had to make that will have a huge impact on what is about to happen. Dispatch runs the tag and it comes back clean along with the owner and address, both local. I decide the gentleman is not hostile at this point, and walk up to him no smell of alcohol (good). And tell him why I pulled him over and ask for his license that he now has in his hand. I take his license and never take my eyes off his hands or body as he moves. I tell him to get back in his car and I will be right back with him. There are two cards in my hand but I do not look down to check, I am watching him get back into the jeep and for any other movement in the vehicle.

    I go back the cruiser and run his license, it is clean, and I bet the gentleman has most likely not been stopped in over ten years. Now I check the other card in my hand…. Yes a CCW permit. Dispatch did not say, so it had not shown up on his record yet. I go back up to the jeep and hand him back his paper work, and after making sure it was his wife with him. (Why? With out knowing the relationship between them I would not say any thing in front of the other person about a permit.) I ask are you carrying now. No. I ask why not, and he tries to fumble for a good answer. I then ask who his CCW instructor was, and he names one of our local ones. I tell him the instructor is good one and the one I had for mine. The look of shock and surprise on his face was priceless. I tell him next time he gets stopped to stay in the vehicle and wait for the officer, keep his hands in sight and explain why doing this is best. I apologize for the stop and send them on their way.

    Sorry to take so long, but thought some would enjoy the story and see a little about what it is like on the other side.

  2. Remove Ads

  3. #2
    VIP Member Array grady's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    Near St. Louis, Missouri
    Posts
    2,837
    Next time I get pulled over, I hope it is by you.

    Thanks for the LEO perspective. Very interesting.

  4. #3
    Member Array athos76's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Miramar, FL
    Posts
    221
    Hmm... first one I've read from the other side...

    He didn't handle the stop that well... I would never get out of the vehicle.

    You handled it pretty well...grilling him about why not was golden...
    "carrying a gun is a lot lighter than carrying a cop in your pocket" -MrTwice99

  5. #4
    Senior Moderator
    Array HotGuns's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    Arkansas
    Posts
    14,837
    Hmmm...
    Must have been a new permit.
    Dispatch almost always notifies us when they have the CHL unless its brand new.

    Someone shaky on their feet may be as simple as sitting for awhile and standing up quickly...or not.
    The further a society drifts from the truth, the more it will hate those that speak it...- George Orwell

    AR. CHL Instr. 07/02 FFL
    Like custom guns and stuff? Check this out...
    http://bobbailey1959.wordpress.com/

  6. #5
    VIP Member Array AllAmerican's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    Chesterfield, Kakalaki del Sur
    Posts
    2,403
    Quote Originally Posted by JAG45 View Post
    It finally happened, my first traffic stop with a concealed carry permit. It was a short time ago, on a Saturday night about midnight. And it did not begin very well as we were not really thinking and did everything wrong to start with. I had stopped on the side of the road when this Jeep Cherokee pasted me, and I was not paying much attention to it. It had one of those big carriers on its receiver hitch. No tag light so, at first it looked like it had no license plate to the rear. He turned at the next intersection so I turned on the blue lights and pulled him over. He pulled over on the shoulder but not all the way off the roadway (as far as he could at that location). No traffic at this hour so I let the cruiser block half of the lane. The jeep is occupied two times.
    Just say he has a passenger.

    Dispatch had some traffic going on, so I had to wait a little to report my location, vehicle description, and reason for stop as required. So the gentleman, a middle aged man (about 6 foot and 190 pounds) starts to get out of the Jeep.
    So? They dont teach us what were supposed to do. I got out and talked with an officer last week who thought I was drunk. I drove home with no ticket. I wasnt drunk but I did have a box of doughnuts. True story, not kidding.

    I am already on the radio so I can not hit the PA and tell him to stay in the car. This is not good. I watch for a little while longer and debate to call for back up NOW. If someone gets out of the car it is about an 85 to 90% chance that something is wrong. Something is in the car they do not want you to see, or they are getting ready to run or just a drunk that wants to fight.
    Really? Is that what they taught you in the academy?

    If I call in now I know that the nearest officer in this small town is about 2 minutes away and if I wait he will be heading the other way doubling the response time each minute.
    You got some back up. Good deal.


    The gentleman is fumbling through his wallet and looking at the back of his vehicle checking his lights and appears a little unsteady on his feet.
    He is nervous because of the obvious. You have the power and can screw with him and you know it. The chances of your [edit] going before a judge is minimal. (no I am not putting down the cops-just an observation from the other side)

    I watch for a few more seconds, standing with the door open, mike in hand. It is midnight, pitch black, no lights or houses around, no traffic, and just a quarter mile off a main highway. This is all happened in less that 60 seconds from the time the car started to pull over…. How many decisions have I already had to make that will have a huge impact on what is about to happen. Dispatch runs the tag and it comes back clean along with the owner and address, both local. I decide the gentleman is not hostile at this point, and walk up to him no smell of alcohol (good). And tell him why I pulled him over and ask for his license that he now has in his hand. I take his license and never take my eyes off his hands or body as he moves. I tell him to get back in his car and I will be right back with him. There are two cards in my hand but I do not look down to check, I am watching him get back into the jeep and for any other movement in the vehicle.
    Did he get back in his car? If so, there was some compliance there right?

    I go back the cruiser and run his license, it is clean, and I bet the gentleman has most likely not been stopped in over ten years.
    So at this point he is off the hook right? Or he is getting a ticket for the light?

    Now I check the other card in my hand…. Yes a CCW permit. Dispatch did not say, so it had not shown up on his record yet. I go back up to the jeep and hand him back his paper work, and after making sure it was his wife with him. (Why? With out knowing the relationship between them I would not say any thing in front of the other person about a permit.)
    So he is clean and he has shown you his permit. There is no reason to find out if this is his wife or if he is cheating. Furthermore the next quote I find very interesting.

    I ask are you carrying now. No. I ask why not, and he tries to fumble for a good answer.
    [edit]His license is clean, he is with his wife, he has given you his permit. Are you gonna write him a ticket? If not then send him on his way. You asked him why not? Is that any of your business? You've already said he is not hostile.

    I then ask who his CCW instructor was, and he names one of our local ones. I tell him the instructor is good one and the one I had for mine. The look of shock and surprise on his face was priceless. I tell him next time he gets stopped to stay in the vehicle and wait for the officer, keep his hands in sight and explain why doing this is best. I apologize for the stop and send them on their way.
    You closed the show correctly IMO.

    Sorry to take so long, but thought some would enjoy the story and see a little about what it is like on the other side.
    Indeed I enjoyed the story. I do not want to be mistaken as giving you grief either. I respect and apprciate our law enforcement officers and have two uncles who are officers.

    We can all learn something from this. Great post!
    Last edited by AllAmerican; March 20th, 2009 at 09:58 AM.
    My Music: www.reverbnation.com/dickiefredericks
    New tunes added.
    "The Double Tap Center Mass Boogie. Learn it, know it, love it, shoot it. Good guys should live, bad guys not so much. " - Ted Nugent 09

  7. #6
    Member Array MandM's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Kansas
    Posts
    108
    Great post. It's good to hear about this from the other side of a traffic stop.
    You can't fix stupid. Ron White

  8. #7
    Member Array Red82's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Virginia
    Posts
    370
    He stated a reason for wanting to find out if it is his wife. And it's a wise one. As many of us in the CCW world don't want the fact that we carry to be broadcasted to the world by some officer. I think the way he handled it was great. It could have been possible the the lady he had in his car with him was somebody he worked with who's car was in the shop and he was giving her a ride home, or a family member, THAT's why he asked.

    I think you asking him about if he had it on him and saying that he should was great. Hopefully it'll make him realize he should be carrying always.
    Protection is a responsibility not just a right.

  9. #8
    Member Array LUV45ACP's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    Central Oklahoma
    Posts
    30
    AllAmerican, if I may I think I will address some of your questions, as a former LEO I followed his entire train of thought. When you are in harness (my Dad called police work being "in harness") you think "cop" all the time. It's how you talk, think, and in the case of JAG45, write.

    Occupied two times denotes that there are only two people in the car. It is a very precise statement.

    "So? They dont teach us what were supposed to do. I got out and talked with an officer last week who thought I was drunk. I drove home with no ticket. I wasnt drunk but I did have a box of doughnuts. True story, not kidding."


    Any time I made a traffic stop after dark, my awareness in the situation always went up from code yellow to almost, but not quite code red. I worked in small towns where a lot of the time I was the only officer on duty for the whole county. Any external movement from the vehicle will make a LEO extra alert--ESPECIALLY after dark.

    The gentleman is fumbling through his wallet and looking at the back of his vehicle checking his lights and appears a little unsteady on his feet.

    He is nervous because of the obvious. You have the power and can screw with him and you know it. The chances of your power trip going before a judge is minimal. (no I am not putting down the cops-just an observation from the other side)

    I am sorry you have had a bad experience with power trips. A lot of the time people mistake taking control of a situation as a power trip, and in a way, it is, but not for a sadistic reason. In the academy I was taught that I was to be in complete control of every traffic stop, from start to finish. Having that control allows the officer to do his job and establish dominance over the other person. Ths is a safety thing. If I don't have control of a 1-on-1 situation then the person being contacted can gain the upper hand and possibly start something. I can tell you from experience from when I was a pup in harness that the first couple of times things got physical could have been avoided if I had been in control.

    So at this point he is off the hook right? Or he is getting a ticket for the light?

    The decision hasn't been made yet. Routine checks have to be made and while they are being made you observe the subject to gather further evidence of either intoxication/under influence and/or to observe body language.

    So he is clean and he has shown you his permit. There is no reason to find out if this is his wife or if he is cheating. Furthermore the next quote I find very interesting.

    From the tone of this he didn't want to possibly shock the passenger. I was out on a date (way before I was married) and we went to a nice place to eat. I got up to go to the restroom and when I got back she was upset. I hadn't told her I was carrying and she didn't like the fact that I was. This officer was trying to keep this gentleman from a possibly strained stiuation. It had nothing to do with infidelity.

    Power trip... His license is clean, he is with his wife, he has given you his permit. Are you gonna write him a ticket? If not then send him on his way. You asked him why not? Is that any of your business? You've already said he is not hostile.

    If I wrote a citation, I didn't give a lecture. If I wrote a warning, I used it as an instructional visit so they wouldn't put themselves in that situation again. This sounded as if he was pointing out that if you have the permit, carry the weapon. Otherwise, why bother. To me it sounded as if he was responding as a fellow CCW holder at that point, not a LEO.

    I know you said that you weren't trying to give grief, but that is how it came across to me and I felt that I needed to clarify a few points. If you took the story to several different active or former LEO's they would probably all tell you the same thing. One more fact I just thought of in the narrative:

    45 said that the stop happened about midnight. After 10:30PM on just about any given night 1 in 3 vehicles you meet are more than likely being driven by someone under the influence. Just something to think about.

    I enjoyed the narrative. When I got out of LE it was just as the CCW permits were being issued in this state. Our policy on the dept where I was working at that time was that if you contacted someone carry concealed, you took possession of the weapon until everything was sorted out. Now that it is more common for folks to have a CCW (or SDA as the are called in OK) that is not the policy.

    Sorry to get up on a soap box, but I felt the need to share. I apologize for sounding preachy, but there is a reason for everything a LEO does in the course of his duties and it all goes back to a simple thought--I am going home at the end of this shift.

    Just keep that in mind, and stay safe.
    To ban guns because criminals use them is to tell the law-abiding that their rights and liberties depend not on their own conduct, but on the conduct of the guilty and the lawless.
    Lysander Spooner (1808 1887)

  10. #9
    Moderator
    Array RETSUPT99's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Location
    Central Florida
    Posts
    44,499
    For a moment I thought you were the one getting pulled over. I started reading and got to the part about flipping on the blue light...I stopped and began reading over...thinking I had missed something...

    Thanks for the different perspective.
    The last Blood Moon Tetrad for this millennium starts in April 2014 and ends in September 2015...according to NASA.

    ***********************************
    Certified Glock Armorer
    NRA Life Member[/B]

  11. #10
    Moderator
    Array Bark'n's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    West Central Missouri
    Posts
    9,917
    Very good story. Handled great!
    -Bark'n
    Semper Fi


    "The gun is the great equalizer... For it is the gun, that allows the meek to repel the monsters; Whom are bigger, stronger and without conscience, prey on those who without one, would surely perish."

  12. #11
    Member Array hcrum87hc's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    South Carolina
    Posts
    90
    I also enjoyed the story. It's interesting to see this situation from the other side. Thanks for sharing.
    "But blessed is the man who trusts in the LORD, whose confidence is in him."-Jeremiah 17:7

  13. #12
    Senior Member Array Plop's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Utah
    Posts
    1,013
    Great insight, thanks for sharing.
    "In America, freedom and justice have always come from the ballot box, the jury box, and when that fails, the cartridge box."
    -- Steve Symms, US Senator from Idaho, 1990

  14. #13
    Distinguished Member Array Rugergirl's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Michigan
    Posts
    1,954
    As a non LEO, it looks to me that your "customer" did everything wrong, forcing you to have to adapt to the situation at hand and not follow the way I would think you were trained.
    I meet with my local Weapons Review Board for my CPL this afternoon and I already have a plan in place for if and when I'm involved in a traffic stop.
    CPL and DL in hand, verbal statement that I have a CPL, I am carrying and where my handgun is located, followed with the statement."what do YOU want me to do"? hands visible at all times and interior lights on if it is dark.
    Doing it this way shows my respect for all LEO's and the risks you take on the job, and letting the officer involved keep control of the situation and proceed the way they feel safest.
    Disclaimer: The posts made by this member are only the members opinion, not a reflection on anyone else, nor the group, and should not be cause for anyone to get their undergarments wedged in an uncomfortable position.

  15. #14
    VIP Member
    Array archer51's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    VA
    Posts
    21,137
    Thanks for sharing the different perspective. Nice to be able to see a stop from the opposite side. Glad it all worked out for both of you. I'm a firm believer of not exiting my vehicle unless asked to do so, and keeping my hands in view. In my current vehicle my hands can't be seen until you come up beside the vehicle, My truck has a shell on it, glass front and rear, then the back window, hard enough to see out, let alone into.

  16. #15
    Senior Member Array psychophipps's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    Texas, in the RGV
    Posts
    747
    Quote Originally Posted by Rugergirl View Post
    CPL and DL in hand, verbal statement that I have a CPL, I am carrying and where my handgun is located, followed with the statement."what do YOU want me to do"? hands visible at all times and interior lights on if it is dark.
    Doing it this way shows my respect for all LEO's and the risks you take on the job, and letting the officer involved keep control of the situation and proceed the way they feel safest.
    In my state I don't have to announce that I have a permit or that I carry, but I made sure I did out of respect for the officer who pulled me over. I also added that I know that I don't have to tell them, just to clarify that I'm trying to do everything I can to keep the situation safe for all parties involved. Nothing worse than finding out the hard way that a potential suspect has had a weapon on them the entire time during your stop, I imagine.
    I keep my wallet in my right front pocket so it's pretty much impossible for me to dig out my DL and CHL without looking like something is up in the car. I just kept my hands on the wheel at 2 and 10, and told my wife to keep her hands on her knitting needles and to make no sudden movements. It was daytime but I also would have turned the interior lights on if they were necessary.

    The baby carrier in the back with my sleeping son probably helped...

Page 1 of 4 1234 LastLast

Links

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Similar Threads

  1. My first traffic stop since CHL
    By SenileDavid in forum Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions
    Replies: 20
    Last Post: July 21st, 2010, 03:40 PM
  2. First Traffic Stop
    By TheChief94 in forum Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions
    Replies: 8
    Last Post: June 6th, 2010, 02:49 PM
  3. Traffic Stop
    By PatrioticRick in forum Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions
    Replies: 16
    Last Post: January 1st, 2010, 05:45 AM
  4. Interesting Traffic Stop - First LEO contact with permit
    By broknindarkagain in forum Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions
    Replies: 131
    Last Post: October 30th, 2008, 11:53 AM
  5. Traffic stop by LEO - offer up CCW Permit?
    By Junkyard Dawwg in forum Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions
    Replies: 64
    Last Post: June 5th, 2008, 11:56 AM

Search tags for this page

arkansas ccw permit traffic stops
,
arkansas ccw traffic stop
,
carry permits and traffic stops
,

ccw and traffic stops

,
ccw ma traffic stop requirements
,

ccw traffic stop

,

massachusetts ccw traffic stop

,
problems with ccl license in traffic in minor traffic stops
,

traffic stop concealed carry permit

,
traffic stop concealed license
,

traffic stop with ccw permit

,
trafficstopwithccw
Click on a term to search for related topics.