Going to MI

Going to MI

This is a discussion on Going to MI within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; I will be travelling to MI in a few weeks and wanted some input from the locals. Will be in the Monroe area mostly but ...

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Thread: Going to MI

  1. #1
    Member Array tbeubs17's Avatar
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    Going to MI

    I will be travelling to MI in a few weeks and wanted some input from the locals. Will be in the Monroe area mostly but do plan on visiting Grand Rapids. Any tips on where not to go would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.


  2. #2
    TAC
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    Hi tbeubs17, welcome to Michigan!

    I don't live in Grand Rapids. I'm S.E. of there, in Macomb, Michigan. I have visited Grand Rapids and did not find it particularly threatening. It's nothing like Detroit! I grew up in Detroit, spent the first 30 years of my life there, including the infamous riots of 1967. So I may be a little desensitized to violence compared to the average person.

    The economy is very bad in Michigan overall. Much worse than most states. As usual, be aware of your surroundings, keep your guard up and you should be fine.

    Here are some links I found that may be informative:

    Grand Rapids, MI
    Grand Rapids, Michigan - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    Areas to avoid in Grand Rapids, MI
    areas to avoid in grand rapids - Grand Rapids metro area - Michigan (MI) - Page 2 - City-Data Forum

    Crime Statistics for Grand Rapids, MI
    Grand Rapids Crime Statistics (MI) - CityRating.com

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    Member Array rlkraatz's Avatar
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    Going to MI

    In Michigan you cannot carry in Hospitals, Day Care, School or school property, Colleges, Bars where drink sales are more than 51%, Entertainment facility where 2,500 or more people may be, churches, court or a theatre. You cannot be under the influence while carrying. The only city I would stay out of would be Detroit. Monroe is gun friendly. I use to live there.

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    VIP Member Array Sheldon J's Avatar
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    GR is not a bad area, just use your common sense, but do plan on a stop to Meijer's Gardens, on beltline N there is a nice IMAX theater just a tad further up the road...

    Also there is Bob's a nice gun store just south in Hastings....
    "The sword dose not cause the murder, and the maker of the sword dose not bear sin" Rabbi Solomon ben Isaac 11th century

  5. #5
    Member Array FreedomTrain's Avatar
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    I have been through both places on business and did not find anything that should be alarming to you. As usual, stay alert as you would anywhere else. Have a safe trip.
    "In a moment of crisis you will not rise to the occasion, you will default to your level of training". http://www.FreedomTrainerTarget.com

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    Member Array karlmc10's Avatar
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    If you get a chance go to The Henry Ford. Either the museum or the village. I love them both.You will see and learn things that will amaze you. How about Edison's last exhale saved in a jar for Henry Ford by Edison's son. You will have a blast I assure you. Go downtown to Greektown to eat. Hamtramack for some good Polish food. If I took you on a food tour of "The D" you would go home 20 lbs heavier. Truely a diverse and wonderful area if you are willing to look, but having said that stay on a minimum of yellow at all times. Sometimes yellow and a half. Also, if your spidey senses start tingling listen to them. Don't travel Detroit alone. If you try you will find all kinds of treasures here.

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    Member Array FreedomTrain's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by karlmc10 View Post
    If you get a chance go to The Henry Ford. Either the museum or the village. I love them both.You will see and learn things that will amaze you. How about Edison's last exhale saved in a jar for Henry Ford by Edison's son. You will have a blast I assure you. Go downtown to Greektown to eat. Hamtramack for some good Polish food. If I took you on a food tour of "The D" you would go home 20 lbs heavier. Truely a diverse and wonderful area if you are willing to look, but having said that stay on a minimum of yellow at all times. Sometimes yellow and a half. Also, if your spidey senses start tingling listen to them. Don't travel Detroit alone. If you try you will find all kinds of treasures here.
    That was beautiful man! You must work for the travel board. I have lived here all my life and have been to those places but now it makes me want to go again.
    "In a moment of crisis you will not rise to the occasion, you will default to your level of training". http://www.FreedomTrainerTarget.com

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    Ex Member Array zigziggityzo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rlkraatz View Post
    In Michigan you cannot carry in Hospitals, Day Care, School or school property, Colleges, Bars where drink sales are more than 51%, Entertainment facility where 2,500 or more people may be, churches, court or a theatre. You cannot be under the influence while carrying. The only city I would stay out of would be Detroit. Monroe is gun friendly. I use to live there.
    He's got the concealed carry no-zones pretty much covered.

    Be aware that "Under the influence" means a .02 BAC when it comes to carrying guns.

    You can openly carry in all of the concealed carry no-zones if you so choose (As in, if you're unsure if the "bar & grill" is more bar than grill, just expose the gun and you're safe).

    This is all assuming you have a Concealed firearm license from your home state.

    If you don't have a Concealed Firearm License, you need a permit to purchase, or a permit to carry to possess a gun in MI (This is new law, as of Jan '09. Before, you HAD to have a concealed license in order to carry at all in MI).

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    New Member Array 99Tango's Avatar
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    You'll do fine in Monroe. Cabella's is nearby in Dundee. I've never been to GR but it has a good reputation. By all means take time to see the Great Lakes and travel north. Avoid Detroit. Buddy's pizza is the best I have ever had. There is one in Dearborn on, I believe, Michigan Ave.

    Don't carry a gun or even a single cartridge into Canada, even by accident.

    Perhaps 20 miles north of Monroe you can access Gross Isle. Do drive around the island, it is very nice. Stay off Belle Isle, period.

    Enjoy. The place is all about cars and the outdoors. It is a bit provincial in that regard. Most folks have a heart of gold and as someone said, you can gain 20 lbs. The food is great.

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    open carry in gun free zones????????????????????

    Quote Originally Posted by zigziggityzo View Post

    You can openly carry in all of the concealed carry no-zones if you so choose (As in, if you're unsure if the "bar & grill" is more bar than grill, just expose the gun and you're safe).
    I am confused. By your statement above you just said I could open carry at schools, colleges, hospitals etc. Can you give me the statute that states that. I would love to carry concealed in church where my parents attend but was refused when I asked. But you are saying that I did not need to ask I could just open carry?

    Looking forward to reading the statute and printing it out so I can. Thanks,
    Eric

    EM1(SS) Retired

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    VIP Member Array TedBeau's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tbeubs17 View Post
    I will be travelling to MI in a few weeks and wanted some input from the locals. Will be in the Monroe area mostly but do plan on visiting Grand Rapids. Any tips on where not to go would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.
    The Michigan Coalition of Responsible Gun Owners maintains a list of No Gun Allowed businesses on their web site. The list is searchable and sortable by city or county. Very handy since you don't want to give your business to a proponent of victum disarmament.

    MCRGO - Do Not Patronize while Armed

  12. #12
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    Open carry in gun free zones, sorry long post.

    The following opinion is presented on-line for informational use only and does not replace the official version. (Mich Dept of Attorney General Web Site - www.ag.state.mi.us)

    STATE OF MICHIGAN

    JENNIFER M. GRANHOLM, ATTORNEY GENERAL



    CONCEALED WEAPONS:

    FIREARMS:

    LAW ENFORCEMENT:

    PEACE OFFICERS:


    Reserve police officer carrying exposed pistol in gun-free zones established by Concealed Pistol Licensing Act

    Reserve police officer carrying exposed pistol in gun-free zones established by Michigan Penal Code.

    A uniformed reserve police officer acting as an unpaid volunteer for a local police agency may carry an exposed, holstered pistol within the gun-free zones established by the Concealed Pistol Licensing Act; and if the officer is either a fully authorized "peace officer" or, alternatively, possesses a valid concealed pistol license issued under the Concealed Pistol Licensing Act, he or she may also carry an exposed, holstered pistol within the gun-free zones established by the Michigan Penal Code.

    Opinion No. 7113

    June 28, 2002

    Honorable Gary C. Peters
    State Senator
    The Capitol
    Lansing, MI

    Honorable Mary Ann Middaugh
    State Representative
    The Capitol
    Lansing, MI

    Honorable Larry Julian
    State Representative
    The Capitol
    Lansing, MI

    You have asked whether a uniformed reserve police officer acting as an unpaid volunteer for a local police agency may carry an exposed, holstered pistol within a "gun-free zone" established by the Concealed Pistol Licensing Act.

    Your inquiry is governed by the interplay between two separate but related statutes, both of which regulate the possession of firearms.

    The Concealed Pistol Licensing Act, 1927 PA 372, MCL 28.421 et seq, regulates the possession and carrying of concealed pistols. The Act prohibits persons from carrying a concealed pistol unless they have been licensed in accordance with the provisions of that Act. Amendatory 2000 PA 381 made significant changes to the Act. Section 5b(7) sets forth specific qualifications a person must possess in order to receive a license to carry a concealed pistol and further provides that a county concealed weapon licensing board "shall issue a license" to an applicant who meets those requirements. The Act also provides that a person who is issued a license under the Act may carry a concealed pistol "anywhere in this state" except in certain designated classes of locations listed in section 5o of the Act. Those exceptions, commonly referred to as "gun free zones," include the following:

    a) A school or school property . . . .

    b) A public or private day care center, public or private child caring agency, or public or private child placing agency.

    c) A sports arena or stadium.

    d) A dining room, lounge, or bar area of a premises licensed under the Michigan liquor control code of 1998 . . . . This subdivision shall not apply to an owner or employee of the premises.

    e) Any property or facility owned or operated by a church, synagogue, mosque, temple, or other place of worship, unless the presiding official or officials of the church, synagogue, mosque, temple, or other place of worship permit the carrying of concealed pistol on that property or facility.

    f) An entertainment facility [that has a seating capacity of 2,500 or more] . . . .

    g) A hospital.

    h) A dormitory or classroom of a community college, college, or university. [Section 5o(1).]

    Section 12a of the Act expressly exempts certain persons from the requirements of the Act, including:

    (a) A peace officer of a duly authorized police agency of the United States or of this state or a political subdivision of this state, who is regularly employed and paid by the United States or this state or a subdivision of this state, except a township constable. [Emphasis added.]

    Under the express terms of this section, a police officer or reserve police officer is exempt from the requirements of the Concealed Pistol Licensing Act, including the prohibition against carrying a concealed weapon in a "gun free zone," but only if the officer (1) possesses the full authority of a peace officer, and not merely special or limited law enforcement authority; and (2) is regularly employed and paid for those services. See OAG, 2001-2002, No 7098, p 74 (January 11, 2002). Your inquiry does not specify whether the uniformed reserve officer in question possesses the full authority of a peace officer. You do, however, specify that the officer in question serves as an unpaid volunteer. Because the exemption contained in section 12a(a) is limited to officers who are "regularly employed," an unpaid volunteer officer is not exempt from the provisions of the Concealed Pistol Licensing Act and is, therefore, prohibited from carrying a concealed pistol in a designated "gun free zone." OAG No 7098, supra.

    A plain reading of section 5o(1) of the Concealed Pistol Licensing Act discloses, however, that its prohibition applies only to the carrying of pistols that are "concealed." A holstered pistol carried openly and in plain view is not "concealed" and therefore does not violate the prohibition contained in that section. See, e.g., OAG, 1951-1952, No 1388, p 228 (April 18, 1951) ("Should they be so directed by their superior officers, auxiliary police while on duty may carry weapons openly, the prohibition in the Penal Code applying only to 'concealed' weapons."), Cf., People v Johnnie W. Jones, 12 Mich App 293, 296; 162 NW2d 847 (1968); and People v Kincade, 61 Mich App 498, 502; 233 NW2d 54 (1975).

    This, however, does not end the analysis of your question. The carrying of firearms in public is also restricted by the Michigan Penal Code, 1931 PA 328, MCL 750.1 et seq. Section 234d of the Penal Code identifies certain "gun free zones" similar to those enumerated in section 5o of the Concealed Pistol Licensing Act; within those specified zones, the possession of firearms is strictly prohibited, subject to limited exceptions. Specifically, section 234d(1) of the Penal Code provides that:

    (1) Except as provided in subsection (2), a person shall not possess a firearm on the premises of any of the following:

    (a) A depository financial institution or a subsidiary or affiliate of a depository financial institution.

    (b) A church or other house of religious worship.

    (c) A court.

    (d) A theatre.

    (e) A sports arena.

    (f) A day care center.

    (g) A hospital.

    (h) An establishment licensed under the Michigan liquor control act, Act No. 8 of the Public Acts of the Extra Session of 1933, being sections 436.1 to 436.58 of the Michigan Compiled Laws.

    This language is significantly broader than that employed by section 5o of the Concealed Pistol Licensing Act. By its express terms, section 234d(1) of the Penal Code applies to firearms generally, not merely to pistols, and applies to firearms whether concealed or not. Subsection (2) of this provision creates several specific exceptions to this prohibition, two of which are germane to your inquiry. It provides, in pertinent part that:

    (2) This section does not apply to any of the following:

    * * *

    (b) A peace officer.

    (c) A person licensed by this state or another state to carry a concealed weapon.

    Similarly, section 237a(4) of the Penal Code prohibits possession of a firearm in a weapon free school zone, a term defined in section 237a(6)(d) as "school property and a vehicle used by a school to transport students to or from school property." Like section 234d(2), the prohibition against possessing firearms in a school zone does not apply to a peace officer or to a person licensed to carry a concealed weapon. Section 237a(5).

    If a reserve officer qualifies as a peace officer, then the officer is exempt from the prohibition contained in sections 234d(1) and 237a(4) of the Penal Code concerning the possession of firearms on specified premises. If not, sections 234d(2)(c) and 237a(5)(c) of the Penal Code also exempt "[a] person licensed by this state or another state to carry a concealed weapon." A license issued by a county concealed weapon licensing board under section 5b(7) of the Concealed Pistol Licensing Act clearly satisfies the latter exemption. Thus, possession of such a license would enable a reserve police officer to carry an exposed, holstered pistol in the "gun free zones" described in sections 234d and 237a of the Penal Code.

    It is my opinion, therefore, that a uniformed reserve police officer acting as an unpaid volunteer for a local police agency may carry an exposed, holstered pistol within the gun-free zones established by the Concealed Pistol Licensing Act; and if the officer is either a fully authorized "peace officer" or, alternatively, possesses a valid concealed pistol license issued under the Concealed Pistol Licensing Act, he or she may also carry an exposed, holstered pistol within the gun-free zones established by the Michigan Penal Code.

    JENNIFER M. GRANHOLM
    Attorney General

    The more I read this the more confuse I am becoming. I think the previous poster might be correct but I am not sure I want to be a trial case. As the gun free zones appear to apply to concealed carry and if I have a CPL (concealed pistol license) I can carry there but not concealed only open. Boy sure would be nice to get a license MI lawyers input.
    Eric

    EM1(SS) Retired

    For freedom is never free someone else just picks up tab.

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  13. #13
    Ex Member Array zigziggityzo's Avatar
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    You are correct. You may Openly Carry at church. (As with all private property, you may be asked to leave for any reason whatsoever, or face a trespass charge) As this is a concealed carry sub-forum, I can leave this conversation for the OC Forum. See you over there!

  14. #14
    VIP Member Array Sheldon J's Avatar
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    FYI the Ford Museum and the ford's Greenfield village will take you two days to go through, but very worth the time, N Dundee is only 23 miles from the state line....
    "The sword dose not cause the murder, and the maker of the sword dose not bear sin" Rabbi Solomon ben Isaac 11th century

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    Senior Member Array community's Avatar
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    DO NOT GO INTO DETROIT. dangerous. too many crooks, druggies, homeless, and crupted politicians.

    Grand Rapids is a nice area. My son is a Deputy Sheriff for Kent County (Grand Rapids is in Kent County).
    Save a Greyhound. Adopt one.

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