What!? No reciprocity?! - Page 2

What!? No reciprocity?!

This is a discussion on What!? No reciprocity?! within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Any Resident permit is good in AZ....

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Thread: What!? No reciprocity?!

  1. #16
    Member Array jmiked's Avatar
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    Any Resident permit is good in AZ.
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  2. #17
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    Array Bark'n's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tankdriver View Post
    TN recognizes anyones permit, and because of that, last time I counted, TN is honored by more states than any other....
    I think Missouri may be tied with TN.

    Missouri is honored by 35 states.

    The problem is, Missouri will not issue a non-resident permit to people from other states.

    Missouri honors all other permits including non-resident permits from other states.
    -Bark'n
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    "The gun is the great equalizer... For it is the gun, that allows the meek to repel the monsters; Whom are bigger, stronger and without conscience, prey on those who without one, would surely perish."

  3. #18
    VIP Member Array Pikachu711's Avatar
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    Pardon my ignorance, but I thought that there was a law somewhere in effect that other states honored other LEO's when traveling through the visiting state. Even DC! Was I wrong or what?
    "Gun control is being able to hit your target."
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  4. #19
    Member Array dlclarkii's Avatar
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    It's called state rights and it's why we had a war in 1863. But I wish CCW was recongized by interstate commerce.

    How would you like living in eastern PA and surrounded by states that do not reconize my PA permit? It sucks.


    Quote Originally Posted by Pikachu711 View Post
    Pardon my ignorance, but I thought that there was a law somewhere in effect that other states honored other LEO's when traveling through the visiting state. Even DC! Was I wrong or what?
    Yes, there was a recent law passed, (LESOA?) that all states must allow LEOs to CCW.

  5. #20
    VIP Member Array Pikachu711's Avatar
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    I would hope that this was the case. There are more than a few circumstances that might require a LEO to travel to another state for official reasons. Pick up a prisoner on a extradition warrant, etc. Makes sense under the circumstances.
    "Gun control is being able to hit your target."
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  6. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pikachu711 View Post
    Pardon my ignorance, but I thought that there was a law somewhere in effect that other states honored other LEO's when traveling through the visiting state. Even DC! Was I wrong or what?
    From what I have read in past articles from Mas Ayoob is that off duty LEO's are not covered in areas such as DC or states like IL, WI, and places which do not allow CCW.

    However, he did say that if you are conducting official police business then you are covered. IIRC, He recommended that LEO's who were on vacation or visiting to call ahead to an agency and ask to do a ride along or something in an official capacity while you are visiting in that state and you would be covered the entire time while in that state.

    Now, do not take this as gospel, as I am not an LEO so the article I was reading did not apply to me and it was over 10 years ago. But as a lethal force instructor, Ayoob has traveled extensively across the country and again, IIRC he said that should cover LEO's when travelling.

    I am willing to stand corrected if anyone can offer a more definitive explanation.

    Quote Originally Posted by dlclarkii View Post
    It's called state rights and it's why we had a war in 1863. But I wish CCW was recongized by interstate commerce.

    How would you like living in eastern PA and surrounded by states that do not reconize my PA permit? It sucks.




    Yes, there was a recent law passed, (LESOA?) that all states must allow LEOs to CCW.
    It is my understanding that LEOSA has some stipulations in it that does not apply to every LEO.

    I believe there are some requirements for some LEO's in order to carry under LEOSA.
    -Bark'n
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    "The gun is the great equalizer... For it is the gun, that allows the meek to repel the monsters; Whom are bigger, stronger and without conscience, prey on those who without one, would surely perish."

  7. #22
    VIP Member Array Pikachu711's Avatar
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    Are there any current LEO's that are members of this forum that can provide a current standing on this law?
    "Gun control is being able to hit your target."
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  8. #23
    Distinguished Member Array mathewsman's Avatar
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    i agree if a state doesn't honor my permit i wont go there
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  9. #24
    VIP Member Array Pikachu711's Avatar
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    Honoring My Permit

    Quote Originally Posted by mathewsman View Post
    i agree if a state doesn't honor my permit i wont go there
    I'm of the same mindset. As much as I know that this will make me sound somewhat narrow minded I'm inclined not to visit a state that won't honor my permit.

    Although, I live in Nevada which borders California. I have to visit San Diego once in a while to keep my fresh seafood taste satisfied. I'm willing to make this one exception to the rule. California will never change their gun laws.
    "Gun control is being able to hit your target."
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  10. #25
    Senior Member Array tankdriver's Avatar
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    A friend of mine who is a Shelby County Sheriff Dept Detective had to go to NJ a couple years ago to pick up a prisoner. He drove up unannounced. They told him next time, he better let them know the day he was coming, or they would arrest him for carrying.
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  11. #26
    Member Array dlclarkii's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tankdriver View Post
    A friend of mine who is a Shelby County Sheriff Dept Detective had to go to NJ a couple years ago to pick up a prisoner. He drove up unannounced. They told him next time, he better let them know the day he was coming, or they would arrest him for carrying.
    That is absurd

  12. #27
    Senior Member Array usmc3169's Avatar
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    My understanding of LEOSA is thus:
    LEO's are always on duty - as such they are permitted to carry a concealed fire arm in all 50 states and washington DC as long as they are currently qualified on that particular gun and it is one of their duty weapons.
    "All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing."

  13. #28
    Senior Member Array usmc3169's Avatar
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    "If a person is covered by the LEOSA, then "notwithstanding any other provision of the law of any State or any political subdivision thereof," he or she may carry a concealed firearm in any state or political subdivision thereof. See Title 18, USC, Section 921, which defines "state" to also include the District of Columbia, Puerto Rico and U.S. Possessions. Thus, the LEOSA-qualified person does not generally require a state-issued permit for carrying concealed firearms.

    However, there are two types of state laws that are not overridden by the federal law, these being "the laws of any State that (1) permit private persons or entities to prohibit or restrict the possession of concealed firearms on their property; or (2) prohibit or restrict the possession of firearms on any State or local government property, installation, building, base, or park." This does not mean that LEOSA-qualified persons are prohibited from carrying concealed firearms in such areas, but only that they must obey whatever state laws apply on those two points. They are free to disregard all other state and local laws that govern the carrying of concealed firearms.

    The LEOSA overrides state and local laws, but not other federal laws. Thus, LEOSA-qualified individuals must continue to obey federal laws and agency policies that restrict the carrying of concealed firearms in certain federal buildings and lands.

    Whether or not a person is covered by the LEOSA depends entirely on whether or not he or she meets the definitions in the federal law for either "qualified law enforcement officer" or "qualified retired law enforcement officer." It does not matter whether or not a given individual is defined as a "law enforcement officer" under the law of his state; only the definition in the federal law applies."
    "All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing."

  14. #29
    Distinguished Member Array Rexster's Avatar
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    Reciprocity and the LEOSA are separate animals. One relates to non-LE-related carry permits, and the second concerns LEOs only. Yet a third animal is a state honoring carry permits/licenses from other states, in the absence of reciprocity; in other words, doing the right thing because it is the right thing to do.

    There are plenty of anecdotes relating to failure to honor the LEOSA, and it is usually due to ignorance/lack of education. On the one end are LEOs who sleep through the legal updates during in-service training, and may not know that the LEOSA exists. On the other end are LEOs who push the limits, intentionally or not, an example being federal facilities where EVERYONE must disarm, except for the ones actually guarding the facility.

  15. #30
    Senior Member Array usmc3169's Avatar
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    good point Rexster - way to bring the discussion back on topic!
    "All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing."

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