I can not get a consistent answer!

This is a discussion on I can not get a consistent answer! within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; One of my primary reasons for getting my CCH was so I can protect myself while closing a club that served beer and wine. It ...

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Thread: I can not get a consistent answer!

  1. #1
    Member Array jczz's Avatar
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    I can not get a consistent answer!

    One of my primary reasons for getting my CCH was so I can protect myself while closing a club that served beer and wine. It is a non-profit charitable club in NC that offers catering. I am on the board of directors and it is my responsibility to close out the register and lock up after hours. I was told that being on the board of directors that I was allowed, with the permission of the other board members, and then I was told by my issuing sherriffs department that it goes back to section III-E of the law stating, "can not carry in a location where alcohol is consumed or sold".
    Does anyone have any insight on this?

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  3. #2
    New Member Array richardt22's Avatar
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    JCZZ...the law in Texas states that one can't carry in an establishment where over 50% of their profits come from the sale of alcohol. I am not sure about N.C. so you may want to look into this further.

  4. #3
    Member Array jczz's Avatar
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    There is nothing in our law that breaks it down into percentages. For the record, probably 2% of our profit comes from alcohol sales.

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    Distinguished Member Array tinkerinWstuff's Avatar
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    The funny thing about states will laws that prohibit CCW at bars and clubs is that I don't know if any of them differentiate between when the club is open for normal business or afterhours.
    "Run for your life from the man who tells you that money is evil. That sentence is the leper's bell of an approaching looter. So long as men live together on earth and need means to deal with one another-their only substitute, if they abandon money, is the muzzle of a gun."

    Who is John Galt?

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    Member Array calmp9's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jczz View Post
    One of my primary reasons for getting my CCH was so I can protect myself while closing a club that served beer and wine. It is a non-profit charitable club in NC that offers catering. I am on the board of directors and it is my responsibility to close out the register and lock up after hours. I was told that being on the board of directors that I was allowed, with the permission of the other board members, and then I was told by my issuing sherriffs department that it goes back to section III-E of the law stating, "can not carry in a location where alcohol is consumed or sold".
    Does anyone have any insight on this?
    If it's private property and you have the permission of those in charge, you wouldn't even need a concealed carry permit. That's my take on the whole thing, but you might research this some more.
    "[A]rms discourage and keep the invader and plunderer in awe, and preserve order in the world as well as property. . . Horrid mischief would ensue were the law-abiding deprived of the use of them."

    - Thomas Paine, Thoughts On Defensive War, 1775

  7. #6
    Distinguished Member Array tinkerinWstuff's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jczz View Post
    There is nothing in our law that breaks it down into percentages. For the record, probably 2% of our profit comes from alcohol sales.
    You can check here:
    http://www.handgunlaw.us/states/northcarolina.pdf
    for a short summary of NC laws and applicable statute. I would recommend going to a state website and verify.
    "Run for your life from the man who tells you that money is evil. That sentence is the leper's bell of an approaching looter. So long as men live together on earth and need means to deal with one another-their only substitute, if they abandon money, is the muzzle of a gun."

    Who is John Galt?

  8. #7
    Member Array jczz's Avatar
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    Thanks Tinkerin, I checked that site but it did not get specific.

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    Ex Member Array BikerRN's Avatar
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    Surely your club has an attorney it uses for business matters.

    This is a business matter, IMO. Ask them, as they will have more insight in to the law and how it pertains to you.

    Biker

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    I would look into it further. It sounds like the statute the sheriff is citing, applies to patrons, not managers/owners. You may look into having the board make you "head of security", then you may be covered. I would check with the agency that governs the alcoholic beverages, for some clarification. You may have to get an "armed security officer" license to remedy the situation.
    "Texas can make it without the United States, but the United States can't make it without Texas!".... Sam Houston

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  11. #10
    Member Array mfcmb's Avatar
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    In my state the owner of a business and employees/agents he/she authorizes has more leeway to carry firearms than patrons. Might something like this apply to you...?

  12. #11
    Senior Member Array Landric's Avatar
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    NC General Statutes

    14‑269.3. Carrying weapons into assemblies and establishments where alcoholic beverages are sold and consumed.

    (a) It shall be unlawful for any person to carry any gun, rifle, or pistol into any assembly where a fee has been charged for admission thereto, or into any establishment in which alcoholic beverages are sold and consumed. Any person violating the provisions of this section shall be guilty of a Class 1 misdemeanor.

    (b) This section shall not apply to the following:

    (1) A person exempted from the provisions of G.S. 14‑269;

    (2) The owner or lessee of the premises or business establishment;

    (3) A person participating in the event, if he is carrying a gun, rifle, or pistol with the permission of the owner, lessee, or person or organization sponsoring the event; and

    (4) A person registered or hired as a security guard by the owner, lessee, or person or organization sponsoring the event. (1977, c. 1016, s. 1; 1981, c. 412, s. 4, c. 747, s. 66; 1993, c. 539, s. 165; 1994, Ex. Sess., c. 24, s. 14(c).)
    Being on the board of directors might qualify you as an owner or lessee and therefore make you exempt. Otherwise, you might look into the possibility of being on the books as a security guard for the establishment, in which case you would also be exempt.
    -Landric

    "The Engine could still smile...it seemed to scare them" -Felix

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    Senior Member Array boscobeans's Avatar
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    Sounds like you are participating in the event to me. So if you are not the owner or lessee but you do have their OK, number 3 looks good to me.

    "(3) A person participating in the event, if he is carrying a gun, rifle, or pistol with the permission of the owner, lessee, or person or organization sponsoring the event;."

    IMHO
    bosco

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    Quote Originally Posted by Landric View Post
    NC General Statutes



    Being on the board of directors might qualify you as an owner or lessee and therefore make you exempt. Otherwise, you might look into the possibility of being on the books as a security guard for the establishment, in which case you would also be exempt.
    Does NC require security guards to be licensed?

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    Distinguished Member Array tcox4freedom's Avatar
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    DISCLAIMER: I am not a lawyer and do not play one on TV. Legal advice is recommended!

    www.prepaidlegal.com/info/tjcox

    I think in your case, it might be dependent on what venue your working.

    For instance, if you are catering an event at a place that otherwise would NOT allow conceal weapons (school, church, stadium, etc), you will not be able to carry.

    If you are on "private" property and the owners or lessees of that property allow CC, you would might fall into #2.

    I once worked in "Bar" security. I was head of security over three nightclubs in TN. At this time there were NO CWP statues, but I OC'd on the job. The law new I carried and I never had a problem with LEO's.

    I did have a biker threaten to take my weapon but it was just a test of courage the bikers who frequented the place put me through.

  16. #15
    Senior Member Array Landric's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by archer51 View Post
    Does NC require security guards to be licensed?
    At least under some circumstances. I've never worked security in NC, so I really don't know the relevant statutes.
    -Landric

    "The Engine could still smile...it seemed to scare them" -Felix

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