The draw from alternative carry methods

This is a discussion on The draw from alternative carry methods within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Originally Posted by Phoebe Any helpful hints for improving the draw from a Smart Carry? I'm not sure how you dress, so I'll list a ...

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Thread: The draw from alternative carry methods

  1. #16
    VIP Member Array grady's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phoebe View Post
    Any helpful hints for improving the draw from a Smart Carry?
    I'm not sure how you dress, so I'll list a few things that help my draw.

    1) It is easier to draw cleanly if I wear a t-shirt and tuck it between the SmartCarry and underwear, with or without a cover shirt (or wear a tucked-in shirt, but then I have to watch for printing). To draw, I place my hand on the t-shirt (or tucked-in shirt) just above my beltline, and push down. I flare my fingers forward, and my thumb glides into position. It's much easier for me to cleanly place my thunb on the grip than if I don't have my shirt tucked in.

    If I'm not wearing a tucked-in shirt, I have to be more specific with where I place my thumb, otherwise it might get tangled in my underwear. In that situation, once my hand goes below the belt line, I may have to grab the gun with only my fingers, then pull it up some before I can get my thumb on the grip cleanly. That can delay the draw. Tucking a shirt eliminates the possibility of getting my thumb caught in my underwear.

    2) Looser pants, not snug at the waist, belt not tight either. That won't work for everyone, but if possible, it makes it easier to draw. If pants will hang on the hips somewhat loosely, then one can draw on-handed without using the support hand to pull the pants away from the body.

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  3. #17
    Distinguished Member Array Rugergirl's Avatar
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    Something that hasn't been mentioned, but I feel is worthy of consideration is what could happen if you only have one hand available to draw and fire.
    I normally carry OWB at 3:00 and always practice my draw one handed. Chances are that if I ever need to draw I might have to do so one-handed. I do the same thing when I use the smart carry.
    Basically I do it this way, thumb pointing up, first finger pointing down the other three fingers slightly curled. The thumb comes up under the untucked shirt, first finger is already "indexed" and the other fingers in position to grasp the grip of the gun. If I happen to be carrying my 1911 the thumb is ready to release the safety as the gun comes out of the holster, while the first finger is still indexed along the side of the frame until the gun is pointed at the target.
    I practice this drill regularly(with an unloaded weapon, of course, and hubby has timed me with a stop-watch, best time from start to draw to presenting at the(imaginary) target is 1.4seconds.
    Dry fire practice and draw practice at home is part of my regular defense tactics to train muscle memory.
    Last edited by Rugergirl; September 26th, 2009 at 08:36 AM.
    Disclaimer: The posts made by this member are only the members opinion, not a reflection on anyone else, nor the group, and should not be cause for anyone to get their undergarments wedged in an uncomfortable position.

  4. #18
    Member Array Mountaineer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phoebe View Post
    The problem isn't a need for ultra deep concealment so much as giving me more variety of clothing options.

    Belly band, in particular, works for a lot of my clothes, but I worry about the slow draw.

    Smart Carry is mostly around the house, doing chores, etc, and it's because it's comfy. (If I wear it with regular clothes, I tend to look like I'm packing something other than a gun, lol!)

    I just need options.
    Somehow, I just don't think the smart carry was designed for women.

    Men and women really do have different issues with CC. Rugergirl has some great advice in this thread. I hope you find a solution. When you figure it out, can you please post your results?

    Thanks!
    -M

  5. #19
    VIP Member Array Majorlk's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mountaineer View Post
    Somehow, I just don't think the smart carry was designed for women.
    I imagine it would be interesting watching a lady draw from one wearing a skirt, especially a long one.
    An armed society is a polite society. Manners are good when one may have to back up his acts with his life. - Robert A. Heinlein

  6. #20
    Ex Member Array Ram Rod's Avatar
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    Practice, practice, practice. Use your imagination and ideas as well. Nothing is awkward or off the wall if you can implement it successfully. A lot of time and testing involved...many may have suggestions, but nobody else can do it for you. Start building on what you want, and imagine yourself deploying with the perfect draw. Then work with everything you've put together. Make adjustments, and do it all over again. Good luck with it all.

  7. #21
    Senior Member Array EvilMonk's Avatar
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    I don't think it's been brought up yet, so...

    There are quite a few companies that produce IWB holsters specifically for women. They are based on the fact that women's waistlines, figures, and clothing options are vastly different from men's. One example: Kellogg Custom Leather

    Anyhoo, I have a SmartCarry holster, but given that my only compact carry is a G30, well, saying that it is a compact is a little misleading. Fortunately I am a big guy, so I can get away with a lot, but that gun is WIDE! In the SC holster, it looks a little...umm...funny.

    I guess you might just have to either keep trying new positions with it, and just try to get used to whichever way feels the most comfortable.

    Hope that helps!
    That which does not kill us leaves us broken and bleeding...

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  8. #22
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    One option would be to travel (maybe on vacation) to visit one of the many fine custom holster makers in person and have a holster custom fitted to you.

    Being able to meet a custom holster maker in person allows him the opportunity to examine your body style and where on your body you would like to carry your gun. These people are artists and sometimes need the benefit of their eye to know exactly how something is going to work or fit the person in order to know how to modify one of their existing holster designs to meet your needs.

    Now, not all holster makers will offer this kind of service, but I think many of them do. They take pride in their craftsmanship and want to make their product work for the customer.
    -Bark'n
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    "The gun is the great equalizer... For it is the gun, that allows the meek to repel the monsters; Whom are bigger, stronger and without conscience, prey on those who without one, would surely perish."

  9. #23
    Member Array Phoebe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mountaineer View Post
    Somehow, I just don't think the smart carry was designed for women.

    Men and women really do have different issues with CC. Rugergirl has some great advice in this thread. I hope you find a solution. When you figure it out, can you please post your results?

    Thanks!
    -M
    Rugergirl said she mostly carries OWB, which would almost never work for me. My guess is that I might be able to do that a few times/year.

    The SC is great when I'm in sweats or yoga pants, doing stuff around my house and not terribly worried about concealment.

    As a CC method, so far, you may be right. I haven't found clothing it works with. It makes me look like I have something else going on down there.

    EvilMonk, at least that custom is low ride. I don't understand why some women's holsters are high ride. (Guess it could work with a really long waisted woman....but mostly men have way more torso.)

  10. #24
    Member Array Mountaineer's Avatar
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    Part of the problem with your IWB options may be that women and men wear their belts differently. Have you thought of using an OWB holster and quality gun belt alone? (not in the belt-loops) Then you have more freedom about where the holster in the right position. It would also be more stable than a belly band, and may be easier to draw.

    A leather belt might interfere with breathing, so maybe you want elastic, or perhaps create a shoulder rig, that holds an OWB in the right position. Who knows, you may just end up creating the best women's holster.
    Last edited by Mountaineer; September 26th, 2009 at 03:01 PM. Reason: clearification...

  11. #25
    Member Array Phoebe's Avatar
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    Mountaineer, I don't typically wear belts. It's a big part of the problem. That and pants with belt loops on women's clothing, will not accommodate much belt thickness...sometimes as little as 1/2"

    I can't go OWB. I'd almost never have an appropriate cover garment. For me, OWB is for OC, range, etc.

    As for interfering with breathing....I'm the kind of female who wears heels. Comfort has never been priority 1.

    In my ideal world, guns and holsters defy the laws of physics.
    In my world, small guns in big calibers, have no perceivable recoil.
    And in my world, a good holster IWB shouldn't need a belt.

    Sadly, I haven't figured out what planet I need to move to in order to have these new laws of physics!

  12. #26
    Member Array Mountaineer's Avatar
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    I don't know about bending the laws of physics...

    You may have seen this, it sounds similar to how you carry the bellyband
    Women & Guns :: View topic - Bra Holster.. any advice appreciated

    I think that person posts here also.

    Have you read the section holster section of cornered cat? Pax has a pretty good writeup there.

    Everyone says you have to "dress around the gun". Maybe, you could find a holster that really works, make sure to wear it when you go shopping. That would give you an excuse to add to the wardrobe.

    Home This is more of an underarm carry design.

    Also, I believe there are some "shirt" holsters. Don't know if you've tried that. Also, it occurred to me that you might be able to take a sports-bra and sew a pocket in underarm position, similar to the above holster design. Might give you an alternative.

    You didn't say what you carry.

  13. #27
    Distinguished Member Array Rugergirl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mountaineer View Post
    I don't know about bending the laws of physics...

    You may have seen this, it sounds similar to how you carry the bellyband
    Women & Guns :: View topic - Bra Holster.. any advice appreciated

    I think that person posts here also.

    Have you read the section holster section of cornered cat? Pax has a pretty good writeup there.

    Everyone says you have to "dress around the gun". Maybe, you could find a holster that really works, make sure to wear it when you go shopping. That would give you an excuse to add to the wardrobe.

    Home This is more of an underarm carry design.

    Also, I believe there are some "shirt" holsters. Don't know if you've tried that. Also, it occurred to me that you might be able to take a sports-bra and sew a pocket in underarm position, similar to the above holster design. Might give you an alternative.

    You didn't say what you carry.
    I'm sure your intentions were good and honorably but OMG !!!
    After I looked at the link I unloaded the .44 and slipped it into the bra to give it a try.
    My sides are in pain from laughing and hubby hasn't made it up off the floor yet.
    Thanks for the daily humor
    Disclaimer: The posts made by this member are only the members opinion, not a reflection on anyone else, nor the group, and should not be cause for anyone to get their undergarments wedged in an uncomfortable position.

  14. #28
    VIP Member Array Majorlk's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rugergirl View Post
    I'm sure your intentions were good and honorably but OMG !!!
    After I looked at the link I unloaded the .44 and slipped it into the bra to give it a try.
    My sides are in pain from laughing and hubby hasn't made it up off the floor yet.
    Thanks for the daily humor
    There's an old gag about the gun moll packing a pair of 38s, but I guess that wouldn't be appropriate.

    I have known a couple of ladies that could make a M29 disappear, though.
    An armed society is a polite society. Manners are good when one may have to back up his acts with his life. - Robert A. Heinlein

  15. #29
    pax
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    Majorlk ~

    Actually, wearing a skirt is one of the times that a SmartCarry works very well for women. The draw from it while wearing a skirt is exactly the same as the draw while wearing trousers (reach down through the waistband), and it's a very comfortable and discreet option.

    While wearing pants, though, it doesn't work well for most women. Some can get away with it, typically those who prefer loose pleated slacks rather than snug jeans.

    pax
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  16. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by DaveH View Post
    How's from the right kidney area (not over the spine) SOB?

    Funning aside, that's a suggestion I need to try.

    I had "Never SOB" (meaning over the spine) because of the high injury potential drummed into my head so long I never considered a 4 or 5 o'clock carry w/ a IWB/SOB.

    Got to love this forum. Always something to learn here.
    Dave...
    I use this...
    FIST, INC.

    The picture is not really telling the story here...the gun looks too big and the guy looks too small (maybe I'm too big)...
    Anyway my Glock-36 sits about 3 inches right of the spine (sitting over the right kidney) and requires a 'palm out' draw.

    I was just at a weekend course and demonstrated how that draw actually covered less of the body while drawing than a 'palm in' draw did from the same spot...those looking, agreed.
    I know of three other individuals who also have the Glock-36 and use the same holster position with a 'palm out' draw...so I'm not alone on this issue.
    Bottom line, it works for me.
    Lately though, I have also tried experimenting with an OWB holster and have found it to be more comfortable than I thought. So now I may have two great way to carry.

    Hope this helps...

    ret
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