Airline travel - Page 2

Airline travel

This is a discussion on Airline travel within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Originally Posted by gdm320 I can, when asked, pick them up and demonstrate they are secure and unloaded to meet their qualifications? I have taken ...

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Thread: Airline travel

  1. #16
    VIP Member Array HKinNY's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gdm320 View Post
    I can, when asked, pick them up and demonstrate they are secure and unloaded to meet their qualifications?
    I have taken my Glock 26 twice out of JKF airport. Yep,NYC. You are required to open the case to show the Port Authority Police that is unloaded. So, I feed a cable lock thru the mag well and out the ejection port. Open the case, they look down,close it up and go to go.

    Last week the TSA people asked to open the suitcase because they saw a shadow from I beleive my shoes. Open suitcase checked the clothes and closed it up. I relocked it . On my way.


  2. #17
    Member Array GHFLRLTD's Avatar
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    Taking Your Pistole For A Plane Ride

    Having traveled a number of times, here's how I go at it:

    1. Review TSA: Traveling with Special Items to understand TSA policies and procedures. Have a copy with you when you reach the airport.
    2. Put the unloaded weapon(s) in a lockable hard-sided case with locks only you have the keys/combination to open. TSA locks are not allowed.
    3. Steps that will make it easier to show that the weapon is unloaded - especially when x-rayed.
      • If the weapon is a:
        • semi-automatic
          • lock the slide open
          • put a cable tie through the barrel and out the breach to show that the chamber is empty
        • revolver, flip the cylinder out
      • Do not put the magazines in this locked case with the gun(s):
        • it invites questions about them being loaded
        • if the gun case is "liberated" from the checked bag by a Criminal Entrepreneur, the lack of magazines frustrates the "Liberator", since the weapon is now initially a single shot one
    4. Check the airline(s) you are flying on:
      • To determine if the ammo
        • MUST be in boxes (plastic reload boxes work)
        • can fly in loaded magazines
      • If loaded magazines are permitted, make sure the pouches fully cover the magazines
      • The round(s) from the chamber(s)/cylinder(s) must be in a box, not loose
    5. Secure and protect magazines (separately from the weapon) and ammunition boxes from possible damage.
    6. Put the lockable hard-sided case with the weapon and the ammo/magazines into a cheap, non-descript bag - with clear labeling outside and inside - for checking in.
      • If possible, develop a way to attach - in a lockable way - the hard-sided case to the piece of luggage it has been placed into.
      • The labeling should be limited to:
        • Your Name
        • Your Cell Phone - if you have one, or your home phone if you do not
        • Your personal email address - if you have one
        • NO ADDRESSES, JOB TITLES, ORGANIZATIONS SHOULD BE INDICATED
    7. Other stuff - like shampoo, mouthwash, toothpaste, etc, could be in this checked bag also.
    8. Have the rules for the airline in hand when you check this non-descript bag at the airport.
    9. Make sure you have the keys/combinations to the lockable hard-sided case with you and you alone (Per Federal Regulations 49CFR § 1540.111 Carriage of weapons, explosives, and incendiaries by individuals - Electronic Code of Federal Regulations:) at all times. You will have to open the lockable hard-side case:
      • to demonstrate to the airline that the weapon(s) are not loaded at check in (a signed form/tag indicating that will go in with the weapon(s))
      • if the TSA wants to see
    10. Have the serial number(s) and descriptions of your weapons on you, so if they "disappear" you can report the loss/theft immediately to the:
      • airline
      • FAA Regional Office
      • ATF Regional Office

    Other things to consider:

    1. Check Handgunlaw.us and/or Pack-N-Go Carry Concealed Trip Planner to determine:
      • If you can possess the weapon at all your stops
      • Where and how you can carry at all your stops
      • What are the deadly force rules in each state you are visiting
    2. Have a copy of the Don Young Transportation Letter on hand - http://www.anjrpc.org/DefendingYourR...s%20letter.pdf. This covers changing modes of travel - car to plane to car - in a single journey.
    George H. Foster
    Orlando, Florida

  3. #18
    Distinguished Member Array Squawker's Avatar
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    I've flown with handguns at least a dozen times in the 3.5 years that I've had the permit, and I've never had any difficulty. The process is quick and easy as long as you follow the advice that you've been given here. I fly out of Las Vegas, and mostly have flown to and from Richmond VA, and occasionally BWI. One small bit of advice, logical really, but since I did it wrong my first time. Place your hard sided pistol case on the top of your luggage. I made the mistake of putting it at the bottom first time, and I had to dig through my underwear to pull the case out,

    Airports may vary a little from one to the other. I have never had to go to a TSA table. I check the bag, declare my UNLOADED firearms, I fill out the card, attach it to my pistol case or just put it inside, lock the case and the luggage, and off it goes. I see it again at my destination. I will never take a flight with a New York or New Jersey connection. If I were to get stuck overnight in NYC, I could end up with severe legal problems, possibly jail time, just because my destination airport was closed, or mechanical problems ground the plane. I don't tend to travel to NY or NJ, so I would only run into problems with connections.

    My procedure for travel is the pull the magazines and remove the chambered round. I pull the slide back and lock it open. I then put the magazines and loose rounds into a container- last month I used a sealed envelope. Generally, and as they say, YMMV, the concern is loose rounds rolling around in the luggage. I had no problem either way. Of course, so of the counter agents are, shall we say,less than thorough. At least twice,the agent didn't even look at the guns, and one didn't have me take out the case.

    Relax follow the advice, and enjoy your trip. Be sure to get to the airport earlier than you normally would just in case the process takes longer than expected. The vast majority of the time it will be smooth sailing. But you can always run into a moron. Do print out both the airlines and the TSA regs on flying with hand guns, to be able to show the agent if there is a problem. But most will have handled it before, probably several times. Just look at the demand for Florida and Utah CCW permits, to allow carry in over 30 states. A lot of people travel with their weapon(s).

    Have a great trip!!!!!

  4. #19
    New Member Array cobra34242's Avatar
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    WELLLLLLL !!! I followed everyones advice. Locked the Glock 27 in its own case. Carried NO ammo. Had copies of Continentals rules and regs. Had copies of U.S. Airs rules and reg. (return trip). Had copies of TSA rules and regs. Placed all the paperwork on top of locked box in the suitcase. Went up to the counter and made the declaration. The agent looked at the Glock with the secondary lock thru the breach. I signed and dated the tag. I was escorted to a secure area where another agent took the bag and did whatever. 5 seconds later he said OK, everythings's fine GOOD TO GO. Got on the plane, layover one hour at Newark.....Flew to Scranton Pa.............THEY LOST THE F------ luggage!!! Sooo, here I am in 35 degree weather with 85 degree clothes, waiting to hear from this dumb airline. So much for doing the right thing! Thanx for listening.

  5. #20
    New Member Array cobra34242's Avatar
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    Airline travel

    Aaannnddddd!!! The airline finally delivered my luggage, with everything intact...............missing for 28 hrs. Gotta love it !

  6. #21
    Member Array OngngFreedom's Avatar
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    My first airline trip with a firearm

    My first post at defensivecarry.com, might as well make it a long one.

    Copied from my post at another forum...

    First time travelling with a firearm on an airline. When I first got my Glock 23 earlier this year I also purchased a small, key-locked safe that would have a small footprint in my suitcase and meets the TSA’s requirements: hard-sided, locked, not easily pried open. It came with a cable to anchor it, which I thought was thoughtful, and the case was able to accommodate the pistol and an extra magazine. Unfortunately the case stunk of mothballs so I removed the foam inserts and left them to air out over several days. This helped but the smell never completely went away. I discovered that if I placed the pistol and the magazines “just so” I could squeeze two magazines into it. I then gave myself a brief scare when I couldn’t unlock it. After a bit of tapping, some hitting and very measured, forceful rotation of the key I managed to unlock it and swore I’d never try two magazines in there like that again.

    The time came to try the process out, as I was leaving Nashville and heading to Orlando to attend annual airplane training. Before the flight I studied TSA’s website about firearms and ammunition. At first I thought I’d just put both loaded magazines into the safe. This is allowed by the TSA. I decided not to: 1) because I didn’t want a repeat of the earlier issue, 2) I carry 13+1 (fully loaded magazine plus one round in the chamber) so where is that extra round supposed to go, and 3) although only implied on the TSA’s website I read on various airline websites that they want primers protected. I took out a loaded magazine and looked at the back of the top cartridge and thought “that is one exposed primer:”



    Loaded magazines can be placed in holsters if they are secure. I use a Smart Carry Holster that doesn’t really secure the spare magazine when it isn’t on your body, plus it doesn’t hold two magazines, so that was out. I thought about buying some magazine holsters and looked also at what Cabela’s et al had to offer but wound up saving the box from some practice rounds and put the ammo into that. After emptying the Glock I decided to put one empty magazine back in the well of the gun and stored the extra magazine with it in the safe.

    I have read about some horror stories that some have had their guns stolen in the bags so I used the cable tether that came with the safe and secured the safe to the back of the suitcase: I wrapped it around one of the square tubes that house the suitcase handle extensions:



    Then I loaded my suitcase with clothes and toiletries with the safe connected to the tether but laying outside and put it in last, which was a good thing as it would be inspected later. I stuffed the ammo box securely between some clothes. Since this was my first time I also decided to carry the cable lock that comes with new Glocks as added insurance in case I got hassled:





    I didn’t install it in the gun but just left it loose in the suitcase. Also as a precaution I printed the TSA firearm policy as well as Southwest’s firearms and ammunition policy and stuffed those in as well.

    Feeling prepared I headed to the airport. I arrived 1 ½ hours early to mitigate any issues that might arise. I walked up to the “full-service” counter after a very short wait (passenger traffic was light) and told the agent I was declaring an unloaded firearm. She asked if this was the first time I’ve ever done this (was it that obvious?!) and I said it was. She produced a small white card with red lettering “Southwest Airlines Firearms Declaration Tag”. I saved the one from the return trip:





    She explained I should fill out as much as I could and she would fill in the rest. PNR# means “Passenger Name Record” and they want you to put your confirmation number there. MCO and BNA are the airport codes. I filled it all in after asking what PNR was and skimmed the back side before signing. I missed one thing on the declaration but it didn’t turn out to be a problem. As I was re-reading it later I was concerned to see that I had declared “1. The firearm(s) chambers are free of ammunition and the magazine clip has been removed (when applicable).” The first part was true but not the second! When I returned to Nashville at the end of my trip I made sure to not place the empty magazine back in the well. The reason I missed that tidbit is because neither the TSA’s nor Southwest’s policies on their websites mentioned anything about this. It was only on the card, so I guess this was a Southwest thing.

    She then asked me to open the safe. I expected her to want to inspect the gun to make sure it was unloaded but she sounded a little anxious when I touched it and said “No, that’s okay” and placed the declaration card in the safe, which I then closed and locked. I asked her for some extra cards so I could show up for the return trip prepared and spend less time. She then pointed me to the TSA baggage x-ray and I told the officer there I had an empty firearm in my baggage and would wait on the bag’s inspection (which the TSA website recommended I do). The officer put my bag at the head of the line while I waited nearby in case they wanted to inspect the safe. If I didn’t I ran the risk of having the bag being denied and not making the trip! Sure enough the officer on the other end of the machine had me hand the first officer my key so they could peek inside the case. I was unable to see what they were doing (I was still at the front of the machine) and by the time I thought to go observe their search they were done and were zipping everything up, handing me back my keys and told me everything was fine. After that everything went normally. From entering the baggage check line to clearing security with my carryon computer briefcase took about 20 minutes.

    In Orlando I waited until getting to my hotel to rearm myself. I placed the safe in the car with the cable strung through one of the LATCH anchors in the back in case I had to disarm going into a building that prohibited legal carry but that never became necessary.

    On the return trip from Orlando the check in went a little differently. The baggage agent wanted to see everything, including opening the ammunition box (even asking if it was the original packaging) and seeing the empty chamber of the pistol. Fortunately I had left the empty mag out of the pistol and had placed one in the case, one loose in the suitcase with that cable lock I didn’t need. This agent wasn’t nervous at all watching me handle the gun. After she was satisfied with the inspection she place the signed declaration card on top of the safe (not inside this time) and hopped over the baggage counter with my suitcase. She asked me to follow her and rolled the suitcase to an unused x-ray machine with two bored-looking TSA officers next to it. Apparently it was there for travelers like me. I thanked her as she returned to her counter while the officer sent it through the machine. After it exited he asked for my keys and also inspected the inside of the safe. The only thing he wanted to do was to press down on the foam around the weapon. He closed and relocked the safe and handed me back the keys, then took a probe with a white circular patch on it and rubbed it all over my suitcase. He removed the patch, placed it in another machine, determined there was nothing suspicious about the whole thing (like drugs, explosives), zipped up the suitcase and told me everything was fine. I went on my way. Once again from that point everything went normally.

    I’ll probably continue to travel with the extra cable lock just in case I encounter a really unconvinced agent but I’m sure I’ll never need it.

    --EDIT-- I just remembered that when returning to Nashville the TSA officer, after finishing his inspection, placed a small, circular sticker on the destination/claim tag of the suitcase. Unfortunately I didn't save the bag tag when I got to Nashville.

  7. #22
    VIP Member Array Majorlk's Avatar
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    One comment on the "smelly" foam ...

    Throw it in the drier (just air tumble with no heat) and a dryer sheet and let it run for 30 minutes or so. The smell will be gone.
    An armed society is a polite society. Manners are good when one may have to back up his acts with his life. - Robert A. Heinlein

  8. #23
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    I live in Tampa and it has the best airport in the country. You should be cool here.
    I always recommend to print out the airline regulations since you may get the counter agent who's on his first day. I know the TSA is good because I see guns checked here all the time.

  9. #24
    Senior Member Array gdm320's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Guns and more View Post
    I live in Tampa and it has the best airport in the country.
    +10 to that. Tampa International is bar none the airport that I have had the overall best experience in when it comes to literally every aspect of the airport experience.
    "Bravery is the capacity to perform properly even when scared half to death." -- General Omar Bradley

  10. #25
    Member Array GHFLRLTD's Avatar
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    OnGngFreedom's Experience

    I thought about buying some magazine holsters and looked also at what Cabela’s et al had to offer but wound up saving the box from some practice rounds and put the ammo into that.
    Good report. I use some Leatherman (Mag Pouches)

    Leatherman

    to both carry and store my mags for flying for my Beretta 9000s. At $5.00 a piece, they are cheap, and might fit your Glock. I put them in bolt containers that you can get at Home Depot that provide additional protection.

    As to ammunition, I got a plastic reload box holding 50 rounds for about 3 dollars at a gun show, and I use that.
    George H. Foster
    Orlando, Florida

  11. #26
    Senior Member Array cwblanco's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by xikle View Post
    Last time I flew I was able to breeze right through checkin because the ticket agent knew exactly what to do.
    It was the opposite for me. While leaving the airport in Houston, the new clerk yelled out down the line "Hey, this guy has a gun -- what am I supposed to do?"

    Geez!
    Live every day so that you can, with a clear conscience, look all men in their eyes and tell them to go to hell.

  12. #27
    Member Array JSBaker's Avatar
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    I just flew from Indianapolis to Spokane, Washington with a checked Glock 27.

    It was the most pleasant interaction I have ever had with any airport personnel. The TSA workers on both ends were amazingly polite and helpful.

    While I'm at it, the new Indianapolis airport is the nicest I've flown in--both the facility and the staff.

  13. #28
    Senior Member Array swinokur's Avatar
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    --EDIT-- I just remembered that when returning to Nashville the TSA officer, after finishing his inspection, placed a small, circular sticker on the destination/claim tag of the suitcase. Unfortunately I didn't save the bag tag when I got to Nashville.
    Putting any kind of external marker on your baggage tag is against TSA regulations. United Airlines tried to do this to me and I made them remove it. It's not open to negotiation either. It comes off or I ask for a supervisor.

  14. #29
    VIP Member Array HKinNY's Avatar
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    I threaded the additional cable lock thru the mag well and out the ejection port so there is no question that the firearm is unloaded. No need to handle it and all.

  15. #30
    Member Array OngngFreedom's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by swinokur View Post
    Putting any kind of external marker on your baggage tag is against TSA regulations. United Airlines tried to do this to me and I made them remove it. It's not open to negotiation either. It comes off or I ask for a supervisor.
    I kick myself for not saving that sticker. I don't remember what it was but it was relatively non-descript. I got the impression they may have done that to show the bag was checked for explosive residue. I know marking the bag by TSA or the airline is verboten, but to be honest with you I was a bit intimidated by the whole process to ask.

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