VA: Mall food court off limits for CCW if any restaurant serves alcohol?

VA: Mall food court off limits for CCW if any restaurant serves alcohol?

This is a discussion on VA: Mall food court off limits for CCW if any restaurant serves alcohol? within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; In Virginia, unless you're a priliviged commonwealth attorney, you can't CCW in a restaurant or club that serves alcohol, even if you're not drinking (though ...

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Thread: VA: Mall food court off limits for CCW if any restaurant serves alcohol?

  1. #1
    Member Array cz2075bd's Avatar
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    VA: Mall food court off limits for CCW if any restaurant serves alcohol?

    In Virginia, unless you're a priliviged commonwealth attorney, you can't CCW in a restaurant or club that serves alcohol, even if you're not drinking (though ironically open carry is totally legal in restaurants & clubs even while drinking).

    My question is about a shopping mall food court. There are a few dozen walk-up fast food restaurants on the perimeter and a large common seating area in the middle. Most do not serve alcohol but a few do, for consumption within the food court.

    Is it legal to CCW in this food court?

    Thanks in advance!
    Last edited by cz2075bd; November 10th, 2009 at 11:57 AM. Reason: typo
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  2. #2
    JD
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    While I'm not a lawyer I will suggest the following:

    1: Contact the VA Attn. General and ask for his input on the matter.
    2: Carrying concealed within the perimeter of an establishment licensed to sell such beverages is illegal. The common area of the food court most likely is not owned operated by the licensed establishment. I would not consider it to be a "special" space and accommodation, if the establishment that serves has it's own seating area, that I would consider to be a special space and accommodation.





    J3. No person shall carry a concealed handgun onto the premises of any restaurant or club as defined in 4.1-100 for which a license to sell and serve alcoholic beverages for on-premises consumption has been granted by the Virginia Alcoholic Beverage Control Board under Title 4.1 of the Code of Virginia; however, nothing herein shall prohibit any sworn law-enforcement officer or any retired law-enforcement officer who meets the definition of a "qualified retired law-enforcement officer" pursuant to 18 U.S.C. 926C and is carrying the identification required by such statute from carrying a concealed handgun on the premises of such restaurant or club or any owner or event sponsor or his employees from carrying a concealed handgun while on duty at such restaurant or club if such person has a concealed handgun permit.
    _____________________
    4.1-100
    Definitions:

    "Restaurant" means, for a beer, or wine and beer license or a limited mixed beverage restaurant license, any establishment provided with special space and accommodation, where, in consideration of payment, meals or other foods prepared on the premises are regularly sold.
    But I would prefer you going with number 1.

  3. #3
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    Malls

    Very fine line here. If the privileges of the ABC license allow for the consumption of alcohol within any portion of the food court, a customer could not carry a concealed weapon into or within that food court. However, if the privileges of the license are restricted to a specific, well-defined area within the food court, the prohibition to carry a concealed weapon would apply only to that well-defined area. So long as no other ABC licensee was also operating within the food court, it is my opinion it would be legal for a customer to carry a concealed weapon within the "non-licensed" area of the food court.

    You can check the licensee here: Licensee Search Form

    One last thing, a lot of malls in Virginia do not allow firearms on property, make sure you are even allowed to be in the mall with ccw.
    I'm your worst nightmare, a liberal with a gun.

  4. #4
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    The VA AG will not give an opinion to a lowly citizen. Maybe your Delegate or Senator could get an opinion...
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  5. #5
    Distinguished Member Array REVMAN's Avatar
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    Not sure of the answer to your question....but I've never seen a mall that allowed alcohol in the food court area. That's a new one for me.
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    Great question, I would be curious to know the answer. Not aware of alot of food courts around here with beer stands, but I know in the old Waterside marketplace in Norfolk they used to have vendors who served draft beers. Then again I think it was posted no firearms as well because of the nightclubs upstairs.

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    The new governor just needs to get rid of this stupid feel good law.
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    VIP Member Array NCHornet's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by REVMAN View Post
    Not sure of the answer to your question....but I've never seen a mall that allowed alcohol in the food court area. That's a new one for me.
    +1 must be some mall!!!!!

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    You need to have the Florida law on that. No 50% of business crap. No CW in a bar or tavern, as its business is "primarily" the sell of alcohol. If a restaurant sells alcohol for consumption, you cannot sit at the bar, but can sit at a table in the food areas.
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  10. #10
    New Member Array VA_Rob's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JD View Post
    While I'm not a lawyer I will suggest the following:

    1: Contact the VA Attn. General and ask for his input on the matter.
    2: Carrying concealed within the perimeter of an establishment licensed to sell such beverages is illegal. The common area of the food court most likely is not owned operated by the licensed establishment. I would not consider it to be a "special" space and accommodation, if the establishment that serves has it's own seating area, that I would consider to be a special space and accommodation.

    _____________________


    But I would prefer you going with number 1.
    That information was either misquoted or has since been revised. Today, in 2014, the Virginia code reads:

    "J3. No person who carries a concealed handgun onto the premises of any restaurant or club as defined in 4.1-100 for which a license to sell and serve alcoholic beverages for on-premises consumption has been granted by the Virginia Alcoholic Beverage Control Board under Title 4.1 of the Code of Virginia may consume an alcoholic beverage while on the premises. A person who carries a concealed handgun onto the premises of such a restaurant or club and consumes alcoholic beverages is guilty of a Class 2 misdemeanor. However, nothing in this subsection shall apply to a federal, state, or local law-enforcement officer. "

    Huge difference.

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    Quote Originally Posted by VA_Rob View Post
    That information was either misquoted or has since been revised. Today, in 2014, the Virginia code reads:

    "J3. No person who carries a concealed handgun onto the premises of any restaurant or club as defined in 4.1-100 for which a license to sell and serve alcoholic beverages for on-premises consumption has been granted by the Virginia Alcoholic Beverage Control Board under Title 4.1 of the Code of Virginia may consume an alcoholic beverage while on the premises. A person who carries a concealed handgun onto the premises of such a restaurant or club and consumes alcoholic beverages is guilty of a Class 2 misdemeanor. However, nothing in this subsection shall apply to a federal, state, or local law-enforcement officer. "

    Huge difference.

    At the time of the posting the replies were correct. Original post was Nov. 10, 2009.
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    Senior Member Array 19Kvet's Avatar
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    This is what sometimes happens when an old thread is resurrected in a search for answers- I'm sure someone was looking for an answer to VA restaurant carry.

    I remember the VA tuck well.
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  13. #13
    Distinguished Member Array CDW4ME's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by VA_Rob View Post
    That information was either misquoted or has since been revised. Today, in 2014, the Virginia code reads:.
    It is a 2009 thread.
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  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by REVMAN View Post
    Not sure of the answer to your question....but I've never seen a mall that allowed alcohol in the food court area. That's a new one for me.
    +that

  15. #15
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    The mall in my area doesn't have alcohol. Or legally carried guns inside. I stay away from there unless I want chicken teriyaki.

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