CCW permit will be useless now?

CCW permit will be useless now?

This is a discussion on CCW permit will be useless now? within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; I am not a lawyer and did not stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night. If you are, or did, maybe you can help ...

Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast
Results 1 to 15 of 40

Thread: CCW permit will be useless now?

  1. #1
    Member Array Northface's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    Tennessee
    Posts
    74

    CCW permit will be useless now?

    I am not a lawyer and did not stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night. If you are, or did, maybe you can help me understand this.

    A young man I know from church has a CCW permit for TN. He and his wife have moved into an apartment in an adjoining state while he is attending graduate school. They both have part-time jobs there. The state recognizes a TN CCW.

    The local sheriff has been told them they will need to get Drivers Licenses for the new state and register their car there. Not a problem.

    He also told them that his TN permit is no longer valid with the new DL and that he cannot apply for a CCW in that state for 6 months.

    Can someone explain this to me? During this lapse, would his permit still be valid in TN and other states that recognize TN CCW?

    Thanks for listening.
    "A gun is a tool, Marion. No better and no worse than any other tool - an axe, a shovel, or anything. A gun is as good or as bad as the man using it. Remember that." --from "Shane" (Alan Ladd) -1953


  2. #2
    Distinguished Member Array bladenbullet's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    englewood, fl
    Posts
    1,751
    Quote Originally Posted by Northface View Post
    I am not a lawyer and did not stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night. If you are, or did, maybe you can help me understand this.

    A young man I know from church has a CCW permit for TN. He and his wife have moved into an apartment in an adjoining state while he is attending graduate school. They both have part-time jobs there. The state recognizes a TN CCW.

    The local sheriff has been told them they will need to get Drivers Licenses for the new state and register their car there. Not a problem.

    He also told them that his TN permit is no longer valid with the new DL and that he cannot apply for a CCW in that state for 6 months.

    Can someone explain this to me? During this lapse, would his permit still be valid in TN and other states that recognize TN CCW?

    Thanks for listening.
    i believe as they are no longer residents of tn they may no longer qualify for the ccw there. unless they can get a non-resident ccw for that state. therefore they would no longer have a ccw to be honored in a reciprocating state. visiting a state and living in a state are 2 different things.

    disclaimer...this statement is all guess and no fact...it just mkes sense in a law kind of way...

  3. #3
    JD
    JD is offline
    Administrator
    Array JD's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Location
    Central Iowa
    Posts
    19,364
    If it's a resident permit, and they are no longer residents...then no it probably won't be valid.

  4. #4
    Member Array chenemf's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Location
    Texas
    Posts
    335
    I'm going way back but when I attended college in NY I remained a resident of Ohio. I kept my Ohio driver's license and my Ohio voter's registration. Of course, I still had an Ohio residence with my parents.

    Does your friend still have a TN residence or did he give this up when he went to school? I'm guessing he did since he and his wife both moved.
    My reading of history convinces me that most bad government results from too much government.
    - Thomas Jefferson

  5. #5
    Moderator
    Array Bark'n's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    West Central Missouri
    Posts
    9,916
    I would consult with an attorney.

    There may be ways around it.

    A lot has to do with if they plan on returning to TN after grad school.

    For example, there are lots of people who maintain a vacation home or second home in another State. They maintain a permanent residence elsewhere where they maintain their drivers license, voter registration and other legal stuff. They are not required to get a State drivers license just because they spend two months during the summer in another State.

    So, if they have a place they can call permanent, say a parent's address in TN, they may be able to legally keep their TN permit, DL & vote in TN.

    May be worth looking into with an attorney.

    Short of that, then, yes, it's going to be a situation where they become a resident of the new State they are attending school in, and they will have to wait the required time to obtain a new ccw permit in their new State.
    -Bark'n
    Semper Fi


    "The gun is the great equalizer... For it is the gun, that allows the meek to repel the monsters; Whom are bigger, stronger and without conscience, prey on those who without one, would surely perish."

  6. #6
    Distinguished Member Array Arko's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    Somewhere near Nashville
    Posts
    1,271
    Indeed, if they are now residents of a state other than TN, they are bound by their new state's rules. Unless, perhaps they can prove they maintain permanent TN residency, but again their new states rules would supersede that point as well.

    TN HCP's are residency based, and TN does not have a non resident permit, so if they appear to have officially moved, their permits become invalid.
    "Don't Tread on Me"

  7. #7
    VIP Member
    Array Hopyard's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Location
    Disappeared
    Posts
    12,105
    All well and good, except I bet they are charging out of state tuition if he is attending a state school, and for that purpose he is still a resident of TN.

    I absolutely detest the ambiguities of the laws and rules related to residence. In point of fact, if he did not own a car, and did not drive, it would be arguable that there has been only a change of domicile and not residence. But since he owns a car, he is effectively compelled to change residence.

    E.g., I moved from NY to go to school in Iowa. Because at the time I did not own a car there was no vehicle registration to change, I kept my NY driver's license, considered myself a NY resident, and was considered an out of state student for at least 3 years.

    A twist on the OP's question would be what if you originated in a state that issues a CCW---and will tie it to a state ID instead of a DL. The laws of most states which require that you change a DL and registration do not specifically apply to anything else. A Texan with a CHL linked to the state id instead of DL could still be a resident of Texas though domiciled temporarily elsewhere.

    Whereas changing DL and registration sort of officially change your status.

    Goofy things happen in this area of life--moving from state to state--or worse, living to some extent in two states. In our complex modern and mobile society the place where you sleep shouldn't be the determinant, nor simply where your car happens to sleep.

    I know there have been very long posts here with detailed legal explanations of the factors that may be considered in determining status for various purposes. Those posts make my point. Things are too complex for ordinary folk.

  8. #8
    Member Array Sand86's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    Earth
    Posts
    34
    Many states have exceptions to the rules concerning changing your drivers license if you are student. I lived, went to school, and worked part time in NC while maintaining a NY drivers license.

  9. #9
    Distinguished Member Array Arko's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    Somewhere near Nashville
    Posts
    1,271
    Quote Originally Posted by Hopyard View Post
    All well and good, except I bet they are charging out of state tuition if he is attending a state school, and for that purpose he is still a resident of TN.

    I absolutely detest the ambiguities of the laws and rules related to residence. In point of fact, if he did not own a car, and did not drive, it would be arguable that there has been only a change of domicile and not residence. But since he owns a car, he is effectively compelled to change residence.

    E.g., I moved from NY to go to school in Iowa. Because at the time I did not own a car there was no vehicle registration to change, I kept my NY driver's license, considered myself a NY resident, and was considered an out of state student for at least 3 years.

    A twist on the OP's question would be what if you originated in a state that issues a CCW---and will tie it to a state ID instead of a DL. The laws of most states which require that you change a DL and registration do not specifically apply to anything else. A Texan with a CHL linked to the state id instead of DL could still be a resident of Texas though domiciled temporarily elsewhere.

    Whereas changing DL and registration sort of officially change your status.

    Goofy things happen in this area of life--moving from state to state--or worse, living to some extent in two states. In our complex modern and mobile society the place where you sleep shouldn't be the determinant, nor simply where your car happens to sleep.

    I know there have been very long posts here with detailed legal explanations of the factors that may be considered in determining status for various purposes. Those posts make my point. Things are too complex for ordinary folk.
    I agree, it IS too complex, and needlessly so. I was just trying to answer as a TN resident.

    Quote Originally Posted by Sand86 View Post
    Many states have exceptions to the rules concerning changing your drivers license if you are student. I lived, went to school, and worked part time in NC while maintaining a NY drivers license.
    Perhaps. The OP did not mention which other state was involved. Some research on THAT state's statues may also help, perhaps also with an attorney's assistance, but again, if he appears to not have dual domiciel with TN, he may be out of luck on TN's side as well.
    "Don't Tread on Me"

  10. #10
    VIP Member
    Array SIGP250's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    MO - Rock Ranch
    Posts
    2,528
    Quote Originally Posted by Northface View Post
    I am not a lawyer and did not stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night. If you are, or did, maybe you can help me understand this.

    A young man I know from church has a CCW permit for TN. He and his wife have moved into an apartment in an adjoining state while he is attending graduate school. They both have part-time jobs there. The state recognizes a TN CCW.

    The local sheriff has been told them they will need to get Drivers Licenses for the new state and register their car there. Not a problem.

    He also told them that his TN permit is no longer valid with the new DL and that he cannot apply for a CCW in that state for 6 months.

    Can someone explain this to me? During this lapse, would his permit still be valid in TN and other states that recognize TN CCW?

    Thanks for listening.
    You did not mention the adjoining state. Each State Attorney has agreement with some but not all other Sate Attorney's for reciprocity.

    I did some checking for you. Your Permit in TN is good for 4 years as long as you reside in TN. As soon as you apply for a Driver License in another state, usually required by another state within 30 to 90 days, your TN CCW becomes invalid.
    If you understand, things are just as they are... If you do not understand, things are just as they are....
    - Zen Saying

  11. #11
    Member Array aric's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    WA state
    Posts
    220
    Quote Originally Posted by bladenbullet View Post
    i believe as they are no longer residents of tn they may no longer qualify for the ccw there. unless they can get a non-resident ccw for that state. therefore they would no longer have a ccw to be honored in a reciprocating state. visiting a state and living in a state are 2 different things.

    disclaimer...this statement is all guess and no fact...it just mkes sense in a law kind of way...
    This is how i see it. Your paperwork has to be completely correct.
    Get a permit in you state or if possible a non-resident in your old state.
    make sure your new state recognize other states non-resisdent permits.

  12. #12
    VIP Member Array tns0038's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    Florida
    Posts
    2,169
    I would retain my original states driver license, and CCL until I qualified in the new one.

    I know of many people who travel most of the year, and retain their home address as their address of record. Some live on Sailboats, motorhome’s, or camper, and travel for years. They get a mail forward company and use that as there official address.

  13. #13
    Member Array Northface's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    Tennessee
    Posts
    74
    Thanks for all the replies. I learned a lot.

    "I did some checking for you. Your Permit in TN is good for 4 years as long as you reside in TN. As soon as you apply for a Driver License in another state, usually required by another state within 30 to 90 days, your TN CCW becomes invalid."

    I have also discovered that he cannot apply for a Kentucky permit until he has been an official resident for at least 6 months and that he must also take the KY concealed carry class.

    By then, he will have almost finished grad school and will certainly take a job that is elsewhere. Then the process starts all over again!

    Again, I thank you all.
    "A gun is a tool, Marion. No better and no worse than any other tool - an axe, a shovel, or anything. A gun is as good or as bad as the man using it. Remember that." --from "Shane" (Alan Ladd) -1953

  14. #14
    VIP Member Array MitchellCT's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    I don't post here anymore...Sorry
    Posts
    2,333
    Quote Originally Posted by Northface View Post
    I am not a lawyer and did not stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night. If you are, or did, maybe you can help me understand this.
    I'm a lawyer, but you should probably listen to people who stayed at the Holiday Inn Express last night. Practicing law doesn't mean much round these parts of "da net"

    Quote Originally Posted by Northface View Post
    A young man I know from church has a CCW permit for TN. He and his wife have moved into an apartment in an adjoining state while he is attending graduate school. They both have part-time jobs there. The state recognizes a TN CCW.

    The local sheriff has been told them they will need to get Drivers Licenses for the new state and register their car there. Not a problem.

    He also told them that his TN permit is no longer valid with the new DL and that he cannot apply for a CCW in that state for 6 months.
    The sheriff has No power to compel anyone to change legal residency and is over reaching himself.

    For that matter, what were they doing discussing matters if this nature with the sheriff as if it was the sheriff's business?

    This is one of those cases were people are best advised to leave good enough alone.

    Let me make this very easy: STOP TALKING TO LAW ENFORCEMENT ABOUT THINGS WHICH DO NOT CONCERN THEM.

    IF YOU HAVE A QUESTION OF THIS NATURE, TALK TO A LAWYER WHO'S ADVICE WILL BE CONFIDENTIAL AND WILL AVOID PROBLEMS LIKE THE SHERIFF TRYING TO "HELP YOU STAY LEGAL" AND IN THE PROCESS TELLING YOU THAT YOUR CCW IS GOING TO BE INVALID.

    STOP ASKING THEM TO DO THINGS THEY AREN'T SUPPOSED TO DO, AND STOP GETTING FRUSTRAITED WHEN YOU GET AN ANSWER YOU DON'T WANT FROM THEM.

    TELL YOUR GUY TO BITE THE BULLET, GO TALK TO AN ATTORNEY AND GET A REAL ANSWER BEFORE HE DOES SOMETHING REALLY, REALLY STUPID.

    LIKE TALK TO THE SHERIFF AGAIN.


    Can someone explain this to me? During this lapse, would his permit still be valid in TN and other states that recognize TN CCW?

    Thanks for listening.[/QUOTE]

    See above for explination.

    And stop talking to cops.

  15. #15
    Distinguished Member Array bladenbullet's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    englewood, fl
    Posts
    1,751
    in some states...like florida for example...within so many days of starting a job as a resident of the state you are required to apply for a drivers license...it may be the sheriff was doing them a favor by informing them before something happened and they were caught without having done something as required.
    i had made arrangements with my new job in florida when i moved here to take some time on the first monday i worked (i started on wednesday) to go to the dmv and make whatever arrangements were necessary to get my license and other documentation in order...i was involved in a serious accident on the saturday before and the fact that i didnt have a florida license came up with the sheriffs, the state police and later in court until they were informed i had only started my job and moved into florida less than a week before the accident. i also still maintained my residence in ny as it wasnt sold yet and my family was still there. but i was living and working in florida. apparently its not to be taken lightly and ***** does happen somethimes that can call residency into question.

    i think consulting a lawyer is advisable.

Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast

Sponsored Links

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Similar Threads

  1. The Second Amendment is useless
    By paramedic70002 in forum The Second Amendment & Gun Legislation Discussion
    Replies: 50
    Last Post: May 27th, 2009, 02:08 PM
  2. My concealed permit will now be useless.....
    By ENSANE1970 in forum Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions
    Replies: 41
    Last Post: June 28th, 2006, 11:19 AM
  3. A Useless Feature
    By Euclidean in forum Defensive Carry Guns
    Replies: 30
    Last Post: November 22nd, 2005, 06:10 PM
  4. .17 - useless?
    By P95Carry in forum Defensive Ammunition & Ballistics
    Replies: 10
    Last Post: May 15th, 2005, 01:15 PM
  5. Useless Information
    By Bumper in forum Off Topic & Humor Discussion
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: January 9th, 2005, 06:11 PM

Search tags for this page

dual residency ccw kentucky ohio
,
going out of state for grad school with ohio ccw
,
kentucky ccw permit valid if changing states
,

mississippi ccw

,

mississippi ccw endorsement

,

mississippi ccw permit endorsement

,
mississippi ccw permit waiting
,

ms ccw application

,
ms ccw how to
,
ms.ccw permit endorsments
,
when i move from virginia does my ccw permit become invalid
,
will utah cc permit become useless
Click on a term to search for related topics.