You won't believe this one!

You won't believe this one!

This is a discussion on You won't believe this one! within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Most encounters with LEOs when you are carrying with a permit are uneventful, this one.....not so much . Read on..... CalCCW - View Single Post ...

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Thread: You won't believe this one!

  1. #1
    Member Array Keith92555's Avatar
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    You won't believe this one!

    Most encounters with LEOs when you are carrying with a permit are uneventful, this one.....not so much . Read on.....

    CalCCW - View Single Post - 1st LEO encounter

    Last Saturday am, pulled over in Glendora by CHP, informed officer as I was handing over license and CCW, next thing I know my son and I are standing on the sidewalk (after I was frisked) and within minutes we have four units lined up. They can't decide what to do...insistent that I can not carry "loaded", the supervisor (fourth unit to show up) states he is "very uncomfortable" with the fact that I have two loaded weapons, one in the map pocket of the driver's door....but 45 minutes later (after numerous cell phone and radio conversations, out of my hearing range) they unload my guns, put them in the trunk, and tell me to "make sure I can carry loaded".
    Missed my daughter's soccer game, and watched my 11 year old son cry (thinking they were going to arrest me, as they stated they "have every right to do"). Luckily, I kept my cool, but I was also very clear that I was licensed to carry LOADED.
    SBCSD called the CHP office a few days later to ensure them of the fact that I can carry loaded. Very uncomfortable situation with an OK ending.
    I don't know about you but I think this guy deserves a medal for patience and tolerance. I would have been smoking hot and probably would have gotten myself arrested. I have a verrrrrrrrrrrry difficult time dealing with incompetence.


  2. #2
    Senior Member Array Plop's Avatar
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    Wow, that's horrible! I agree, I would have had a hard time dealing with those officers, especially with my child going through that.

    Chalk it up to one of the many reasons I won't ever live in Kahlifornia!
    "In America, freedom and justice have always come from the ballot box, the jury box, and when that fails, the cartridge box."
    -- Steve Symms, US Senator from Idaho, 1990

  3. #3
    Member Array jimtem's Avatar
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    I am shocked by the fact that many police officers do not know the law. I have 2 friends that are police officers and I occasionally ask them specific questions about the law and they never have and answer. I know that cops are not lawyers or judges but it seems like this stuff is basic.

  4. #4
    Ex Member Array Treo's Avatar
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    I have never understood why people that post on these boards feel the need to hand the police information that they can use to make your life miserable. I have met very few police officers that were pro carry. The majority I have met have gone out of their way to discourage it, generally W/ the attitude that it makes their job harder. I’ve had them tell me I’m required to inform on contact (false). That I need a permit to carry a firearm in my vehicle (False) and that I need a permit to leave my home W/ a firearm (false).

    As a general rule I find the less information I give the police the better it works for me If they ask if I’m armed I tell them but not before.

    And if that makes me an evil cop basher so be it

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by Treo View Post
    I have never understood why people that post on these boards feel the need to hand the police information that they can use to make your life miserable. I have met very few police officers that were pro carry. The majority I have met have gone out of their way to discourage it, generally W/ the attitude that it makes their job harder. I’ve had them tell me I’m required to inform on contact (false). That I need a permit to carry a firearm in my vehicle (False) and that I need a permit to leave my home W/ a firearm (false).

    As a general rule I find the less information I give the police the better it works for me If they ask if I’m armed I tell them but not before.

    And if that makes me an evil cop basher so be it
    If all these instances are from Colorado, it just means there could be something lacking in the training of the LEO's...

    I guess, it depends what part of the country you live in... Here in TX, you must notify on a traffic stop...I would say the majority of LEO's are pro-carry...All of them I know are and I worked for the 3rd largest sheriff's dept. in the country...
    "Texas can make it without the United States, but the United States can't make it without Texas!".... Sam Houston

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    Member Array Erik M's Avatar
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    Praying for you poor souls in the south blok of the kali republik.
    I say we take off and nuke the entire site from orbit

  7. #7
    Member Array Keith92555's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TX-JB View Post
    If all these instances are from Colorado, it just means there could be something lacking in the training of the LEO's...

    I guess, it depends what part of the country you live in... Here in TX, you must notify on a traffic stop...I would say the majority of LEO's are pro-carry...All of them I know are and I worked for the 3rd largest sheriff's dept. in the country...
    True. In California it is not a requirement but the Sheriff of a specific county can make notification on contact with LEO a condition of issuance. I would have to say that the contact in the OP is very rare (like I said, MOST are uneventful). Just goes to show that even if you think you are GTG you can run into something TOTALLY off the wall. I also agree that most LEOs are pro-carry, ESPECIALLY those who participate on pro-carry forum.

  8. #8
    Distinguished Member Array Pro2A's Avatar
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    Sounds like harassment to me. If they could have arrested him they would have.

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    VIP Member Array gottabkiddin's Avatar
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    We don't need to inform in Ga, but I think I would just to show respect for the situation. If the LEO turns out to be Barney Fife, I'll deal with the guff because in the end I know I'll be leaving with my pistols and heading on my way. Nothing that a call to the station and some conversations with the chain of command can't address.

    IMO, you meet all kinds of folks in our travels, some can be snots, but some are good folks and worth the effort.

    GBK
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  10. #10
    Member Array FLSquirrelHunter's Avatar
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    Bothers me that they are state patrol, not just someone who wasn't interested in things outside some smaller jurisdiction

    the premise ("congrats, yes, you have the sherriff's permission to carry an unloaded firearm for self-defense") is really close in principle to what ticked Mr Heller off

    so, only CI gang members are authorized to carry 'loaded' firearms?

    my guess is that there was one under-informed officer who made the stop and three more cars who wanted to save face by intimidating

  11. #11
    Senior Member Array jem102's Avatar
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    Thumbs up

    Quote Originally Posted by FLSquirrelHunter View Post
    Bothers me that they are state patrol, not just someone who wasn't interested in things outside some smaller jurisdiction

    the premise ("congrats, yes, you have the sherriff's permission to carry an unloaded firearm for self-defense") is really close in principle to what ticked Mr Heller off

    so, only CI gang members are authorized to carry 'loaded' firearms?

    my guess is that there was one under-informed officer who made the stop and three more cars who wanted to save face by intimidating
    +1, I believe you are on to something there.
    Who is John Galt?

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    When power is up for grabs; personal liberty is usually one of the first casualties…

  12. #12
    Ex Member Array Treo's Avatar
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    If all these instances are from Colorado, it just means there could be something lacking in the training of the LEO's
    They are and training cops isn’t my job


    I worked for the 3rd largest sheriff's dept. in the country...
    There ya have it

    Sounds like harassment to me. If they could have arrested him they would have.
    One of the reasons I don’t answer questions I’m not required to answer. I’m required to present DL/ REG/POI I’m required to present permit on demand. Beyond that the cop doesn’t need to know where I’m headed to tonight, doesn’t need where I came from to night and doesn’t need to know if I have any: guns, bombs, bazookas, drugs, samurai. Swords, needles or anything else that he needs to know about in my vehicle tonight. That question always gets a resounding “Officer I do not consent to any searches. Am I free to go?”

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    As a former LEO from California I can attest that much of this has to do with the convoluted permitting process. Each county within the state can establish their own stipulations for the permit holders. It’s utterly ridiculous and creates the exact situation you experienced. The LEO’s simply can’t keep up with whom is allowed to do what. This is especially the case with CHP officers who may be transferred throughout the State.
    Regards,
    Dan
    “Monsters are real and so are ghosts. They live inside of us, and sometimes they win.”
    ~ Stephen King

  14. #14
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    Yo Treo...

    Do you really think that the officer cares where you are going,what you are doing or how many shoes you have in your closet?

    He dosent. As he speaks to you, he is interviewing you and that is the way that officers evaluate you. Some officers do the small talk thing, to set you at ease,they may even ask you the same question a few different ways to see how you respond.

    Beleive it or not, it works well to sort out the good guys from the riff-raff.

    The guy that was stopped by the cops didnt get mad and refuse to answer questions, he kept his calm and insisted that he was in the right. The cops,being less than 100 percent on the subject, callled their sources to see if he was correct. Because he acted rationally and spoke well, they let him go. I'd bet that if he acted the jerk or just clammed up and refused to answer the questions, they would have arrested him and let his laywer and the attorneys settle the matter. Is it a perfect solution? We know that it's not. Is it a training issue? It is. At least that issue has been brought to their attention and it is very possible that the training issue may be acted upon so that everyone is clear with it the next time out.

    Even though he may have been technically right, it could have cost him a small fortune and probably taken a long time, maybe even years to get the point across after he sued them for harrasment.

    Sometimes just a little bit of communication goes a long way in a situation like this.

    Should you have to communicate? Not really. You can assert your right to say nothing and it may work or it may complicate things.

    Thats the reality of it and its your call.
    I would rather stand against the cannons of the wicked than against the prayers of the righteous.


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  15. #15
    Senior Member Array Rotorblade's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Saber View Post
    As a former LEO from California I can attest that much of this has to do with the convoluted permitting process. Each county within the state can establish their own stipulations for the permit holders. It’s utterly ridiculous and creates the exact situation you experienced. The LEO’s simply can’t keep up with whom is allowed to do what. This is especially the case with CHP officers who may be transferred throughout the State.
    Regards,
    Dan
    100% correct.
    The permits don't even look the same from county to county,,
    But.....there is no excuse for a California LEO not knowing that a citizen does has the "right" to carry a loaded concealed firearm with a permit. There are enough permits out here now where it is much more likely for an LEO to run across someone who has one and they need to know how to handle things.

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