To inform or not to inform, that is the question

This is a discussion on To inform or not to inform, that is the question within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; I will outright lie if asked by the police if I'm carrying. No duty to inform in my state. CRS 18-12 -204 states that I ...

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Thread: To inform or not to inform, that is the question

  1. #31
    Ex Member Array Treo's Avatar
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    I will outright lie if asked by the police if I'm carrying. No duty to inform in my state.
    CRS 18-12 -204 states that I must surrender my permit upon request. I think lying to a cop is a very bad idea. What happens when he asks you to step out of the vehicle after you said you weren't carrying? I promise you are going to get patted down once you come out of the car, and when he finds out you lied to him he is going to crawl up you behind W/ a microscope and find a reason to put you in jail.

    Let me tell you a story (deanimator may remember it from THR.org) I got pulled over twice in two weeks( actually it was two months) by a Trooper Heyward of the CSP bith times he was pretty professional. both times he didn't play any "gotcha games" and both times he let me go W/ a warning. Both times I was armed. the difference is the second time he asked me if I had a weapon and went absolutey bananas when I said yes. He stood outside my car and screamed at me that I was required to inform on contact (false). The only variable in both stops was the fact he knew I was armed during the second one. That's the night I decided never to inform on my own (unless legally required).
    Last edited by Treo; November 29th, 2009 at 07:46 PM. Reason: added correction

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  3. #32
    Member Array Bm7b5's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ImChad View Post
    I don't believe this is the case here.
    I'm not saying you should notify, rather that lying when asked may be illegal. For Indiana, I would expect such a law to be contained here. I couldn't find anything saying that lying to a police officer is illegal though, so maybe it isn't in Indiana. I would generally advise against it anyway. Probably better to say nothing than lie.
    A traffic ticket is formal recognition of a lapse in situational awareness.

  4. #33
    Ex Member Array Deanimator's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ImChad View Post
    I don't believe this is the case here.
    You're almost certainly wrong.

    You have a right not to answer questions. You almost never have a right to lie to the police during official business under any circumstances.

    Barring some WRITTEN agreement for transactional immunity, remaining silent is never obstruction. Lying is almost always obstruction, among other things.

    If you consider the cops' questions inappropriate, don't answer them.

    "Officer, am I free to leave?"
    "No? Then I will have nothing further to say without my lawyer present."
    Keep your mouth shut and don't talk yourself into legit criminal charges that couldn't be made until you started talking.

  5. #34
    Distinguished Member Array PastorPack's Avatar
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    I choose to inform. No big deal, I just hand over the permit with my DL. I do feel first and foremost that it is a courtesy to the LEO. They are public servants who do a very dangerous job. To me it is he same as giving them the courtesy of addressing them by their title (officer or deputy).

    Every traffic stop is a potential problem for them and if I can let them know that I'm a good guy then all the better.

    The exception to this would be if I am traveling in an area known to be antagonistic to CC, such as San Fransisco or Los Angeles.
    God is love (1 John 4:8)

  6. #35
    Ex Member Array Deanimator's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PastorPack View Post
    I choose to inform. No big deal, I just hand over the permit with my DL. I do feel first and foremost that it is a courtesy to the LEO.
    My "courtesy" to the LEO is to obey the law.

    Imaginary "requirements" usually just keep expanding.

    In Ohio we HAVE to notify. So people have invented the "courtesy" of informing when you're NOT carrying. Naturally, there are now cops who think you HAVE to inform when NOT carrying. Law enforcement is already too intrusive in our day to day lives. Why open the door to even more of the same?

    If it's not required by law, there are no commonly agreed upon rules. My interactions with the police are solely in accordance with LAW, not imaginary "courtesies". Anything else is totally uncontrolled and undefined and I'm not playing.

  7. #36
    Ex Member Array Treo's Avatar
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    The exception to this would be if I am traveling in an area known to be antagonistic to CC, such as San Fransisco or Los Angeles.
    Wouldn't you be more interested in letting the cops in those jurisdictions know your a good guy?

    Come to think of it don't you have a Clergy card? that would really let them know you're a good guy

  8. #37
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    Talking MI 15 and Walter Mitty

    I have had two interactions with LEO's in a five year period, one a Teller County Deputy, the other a Colorado State Police Officer. I could not discern whether my CWP had a positive or negative "effect" or "impact" on the officer when I provided same.

    My reason for provided the CWP was merely to communicate information, specifically, that when I received the CWP I had successfully passed the state requirements to hold the permit. Nothing more, nothing less. I was merely communicating data. I had no reason to believe, or to care, whether they supported civilian carry of a weapon or not. That was not my intent or my goal.

    Two interactions are not statistically meaningful, and no conclusion can be derived from my two interactions with LEO's. As I've stated before, it is merely personal opinion, and those two interactions have formed part of the basis for my personal opinion.

    Likewise, since I am not a psychiatrist nor a psychologist I cannot analyze the logic, rational, or irrationality of the actions or lack thereto of others, whether they have overtones of the MI 15 secrecy and decoder rings or Water Mitty, and to be honest, don't want to. I could care less.........

    This entire thread is an exercise in personal opinion, nothing more and nothing less, so let's recognize that and leave psychoanalysis to others elsewhere perhaps more suited to form an opinion that is meaningful and useful.

    Just my $.02.

    Come to think of it don't you have a Clergy card? that would really let them know you're a good guy
    That's funny. I might start wearing a Cleric's Collar...........



    It's not about slippery slopes either. Just a statement of fact, volunteered.

  9. #38
    VIP Member Array tokerblue's Avatar
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    CT does not require you to inform. There is absolutely no way that I'm volunteering any information to the PO that I don't have to. They're not my friend and are not there to help me during a traffic stop. I will give them the courtesy of being polite.

  10. #39
    Ex Member Array Treo's Avatar
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    My reason for provided the CWP was merely to communicate information, specifically, that when I received the CWP I had successfully passed the state requirements to hold the permit. Nothing more, nothing less. I was merely communicating data.
    Is there anything you wish the police to discern from this data? What does it tell them about you that on the day your background check was done you passed?
    As I've stated before, it is merely personal opinion,
    I'm glad you're willing to express your personal opinion here so willingly. We'll all get to know and respect you and your opinions more quickly.

  11. #40
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    Is there anything you wish the police to discern from this data? What does it tell them about you that on the day your background check was done you passed?
    That I am not a convicted felon, or sexual predator, or a wife abuser, or an interstellar alien............on that day.........

    I'm glad you're willing to express your personal opinion here so willingly. We'll all get to know and respect you and your opinions more quickly.
    Since you're at all of your 126th post and burning bridges as fast as ya'll can pour gasoline, I don't really care if ya'll get to know me or not. Just my .02.

    Dial tone.............

  12. #41
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    My opinion is that everyone needs to chill out a bit.
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  13. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by ImChad View Post
    I'm curious about this. "I have no problem informing as a 'courtesy' to another firearms owner"
    Do you tell other people you spot carrying that you're armed?
    No, but thanks for asking.
    I was only referring to the LEO as a 'firearm owner'. In FL, one should not be spotting anyone else as a firearms owner as OC is not allowed.
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  14. #43
    Senior Member Array puncho's Avatar
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    If I'm asked a question I will answer. If my DL is asked for It will accompany my CWP.

  15. #44
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    Ohio is funny because I have to inform if Im carrying, but dont have to if Im not.
    I figure I'll just inform either way so some twitchy LEO doesnt have to guess and make it easy on both of us.

    If the law didnt require me to inform if I were carrying, then Id probably just not inform at all since the LEO wouldnt expect me to either way.

    :)

  16. #45
    Ex Member Array Treo's Avatar
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    Since you're at all of your 126th post and burning bridges as fast as ya'll can pour gasoline,
    I don't think I'm burning bridges and I certainly haven't been informed so by a moderator . I think I'm positing an opinion that runs contrary to the prevailing group think and it appears to offend you

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