Real Estate - How do you enter vacant properities?

This is a discussion on Real Estate - How do you enter vacant properities? within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Entering the house you should have been in condition YELLOW (you s/b in condition YELLOW all the time). Upon seeing the messes, you should have ...

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Thread: Real Estate - How do you enter vacant properities?

  1. #16
    Senior Member Array KenInColo's Avatar
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    Entering the house you should have been in condition YELLOW (you s/b in condition YELLOW all the time). Upon seeing the messes, you should have gone to condition ORANGE (although you didn't see a person, you saw evidence of a person). Upon seeing the person, where he doesn't belong, he is a threat, you go immediately to condition RED (The Fight trigger. This is your mental trigger. "If that person does "x" I will shoot them." Your pistol may, but not necessarily, be in your hand.)*

    Like the real estate broker said, when it comes to your safety or offending someone, error on the side of caution. Further, it's your property.

    I think that now days, many agencies require first time clients to stop by the office & leave their DL before an agent will show them a property.

    *Col. Jeff Cooper's Gunsite Color Codes for situational awareness

    Click here to see The Color Code

    If your CCW course is good, you will learn this.
    An armed populace are called citizens.
    An unarmed populace are called subjects.

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  3. #17
    New Member Array Joey Diesel's Avatar
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    Guess I still have two more pennies....

    KenInColo,

    Yet more reasons I can't wait to take my CCW course, especially NC's legal definition of the use of deadly force. I have already tried to prepare my mental state as best possible given the tremendous responsibility of carrying a firearm. Even though I have not completed my course, or for that matter even purchased a firearm.....I have begun to look at my life, work, and home through a different vantage point. I would say my perspective is more like the "Yellow" condition you mentioned in your post.

    I pay VERY close attention to my surroundings, proximity to potential renters, visible signs prior to entering any one of my properties, a person movements..[i.e their body language, hands..if I can see them, etc]. Another things that I've started to do [not sure if I'm alone on this one] but whenever I see/hear a report of a violent crime committed in my local area.. I try to analyze it from my perspective as a legally armed citizen...In some cases I think its pretty cut & dry my course of action...and many other situations its not...At least with your "color code" escalation my mind is already alert, and hopefully prepared....

    P.S. Not sure if I mentioned it, but once again thank you and everyone else who has helped me as I continue to ask questions and gather invaluable information. Thanks again...Joey

  4. #18
    Member Array glock45's Avatar
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    I work in Real Estate too and always enter vacant foreclosures with my hand on my gun. Last time, a guy who was sent by the bank to clean the house startled me when he came out of the bedroom. I reached for my gun and the guy said" Whoa! I'm here cleaning the house!".
    I holstered my halfway drawn G30 and we chatted a little. I think the guy got really scared and I was too...
    He did not question me being armed at all. Maybe he has seen more than one barrel in while on the job.

  5. #19
    Senior Member Array KenInColo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Joey Diesel View Post
    KenInColo,

    Yet more reasons I can't wait to take my CCW course, especially NC's legal definition of the use of deadly force. I have already tried to prepare my mental state as best possible given the tremendous responsibility of carrying a firearm. Even though I have not completed my course, or for that matter even purchased a firearm.....I have begun to look at my life, work, and home through a different vantage point. I would say my perspective is more like the "Yellow" condition you mentioned in your post.

    I pay VERY close attention to my surroundings, proximity to potential renters, visible signs prior to entering any one of my properties, a person movements..[i.e their body language, hands..if I can see them, etc]. Another things that I've started to do [not sure if I'm alone on this one] but whenever I see/hear a report of a violent crime committed in my local area.. I try to analyze it from my perspective as a legally armed citizen...In some cases I think its pretty cut & dry my course of action...and many other situations its not...At least with your "color code" escalation my mind is already alert, and hopefully prepared....

    P.S. Not sure if I mentioned it, but once again thank you and everyone else who has helped me as I continue to ask questions and gather invaluable information. Thanks again...Joey
    Joe, you're gonna do good. You're already doing a lot of what you should be doing & you don't even realize it, but you will when all the stuff you have to be aware of is pulled together in the class.

    The next thing is training & repetitive practice, because, in a stressful situation, you will revert to the way you have trained & practiced.

    You will be given drills to do at home with your unloaded handgun. Do them. Do them until it becomes automatic. You will greatly improve your chances of coming out of a bad situation alive.

    Find out about & practice the Gunsite 5 step presentation. This will make you smooth and automatic.
    An armed populace are called citizens.
    An unarmed populace are called subjects.

  6. #20
    Member Array H8SPVMT's Avatar
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    As a locksmith many times a year I'm asked my agents to rekey and sometimes secure, vacant homes, and properties.

    1. I do a parimeter inspection looking for access to the property inspecting the door hardware and windows. I also look into the windows for current indoor conditions such as bugs, animals and living conditions.

    2. When opening a door, I always announce my presence loud and clear. I also listen for noises. My old ears aren't all that good so I will do a careful walk-thru especially for areas like garages where the doos are closed and I can't see into them.

    With that said, I don't have a problem calling the Local PD to check out a home either if I feel threatened. Clearing a home is a hard task and requires force. That equates to work, NOT MY JOB!

    I have been in some hairy situations, man with a shot gun holded up and such (one fella had newspapers taped over all the windows). Both times the local police took care of the situation and spared me the dramma!

    Try opening a door (as in a repo), knowing there are other people on the inside that do not want you in their homes, you won't want that excitement ever again!
    Certified Glock Armorer

  7. #21
    Ex Member Array Deanimator's Avatar
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    1. I go armed everywhere that it's legal to do so.
    2. You may wish to treat this as a trip into bear country. Make a lot of noise. The thieves and vagrants will flee rather than confront you. Anybody who doesn't flee you is a potential threat. Be ready to confront it, with deadly force if necessary.

    A couple of weeks ago, I accompanied an attorney friend on a trip through various neighborhoods on the east side of Cleveland to identify (but not enter) a number of properties owned by an out of state client, and take pictures. I had a DSLR, so I took the pictures. I also have an Ohio CHL and carried my Browning High Power. There were no problems.

    Earlier this year, I took a similar trip with my friend to enter and inspect an apartment from which the deadbeat inhabitants were being evicted (money for new flatscreen TVs and dope, but not rent;the place smelled like Cheech and Chong were living there). Again, I took a bunch of pictures. We returned later after they left. I was armed both times, and there were no problems during either visit.

  8. #22
    New Member Array Joey Diesel's Avatar
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    Running out of pennies :-)

    KenInColo, Deanimator, and glock45

    Thanks again for the comments/suggestions/pointers/advice. Initially I thought I was the only one out there [High Point,NC] that faces new challenges daily, with residential real estate.


    Can’t remember who mentioned this, but I think I read earlier that a few of you enter "your" property(s) "armed". This may sound like a silly question, but I'm going to ask anyway, what does that look like? I mean is it just your hand on your weapon? Do you resemble a police officer clearing a house room by room...back against the wall….weapon at their/your side?

    Second, with this approach does/did this factor into your holster selection, and/or IWB or OWB?

    KenInColo
    You mentioned "Gunsite 5 step Presentation" Can you shed more light on that subject? Is this a particular course, book, etc? I like to learn as much I as can on that topic as well.

    Thanks again!!!!!
    Joey

  9. #23
    Senior Member Array KenInColo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Joey Diesel View Post
    KenInColo, Deanimator, and glock45

    Thanks again for the comments/suggestions/pointers/advice. Initially I thought I was the only one out there [High Point,NC] that faces new challenges daily, with residential real estate.


    Can’t remember who mentioned this, but I think I read earlier that a few of you enter "your" property(s) "armed". This may sound like a silly question, but I'm going to ask anyway, what does that look like? I mean is it just your hand on your weapon? Do you resemble a police officer clearing a house room by room...back against the wall….weapon at their/your side?

    Second, with this approach does/did this factor into your holster selection, and/or IWB or OWB?

    KenInColo
    You mentioned "Gunsite 5 step Presentation" Can you shed more light on that subject? Is this a particular course, book, etc? I like to learn as much I as can on that topic as well.

    Thanks again!!!!!
    Joey
    Joey, Never try to "clear" a house, certainly not buy yourself; certainly not without training. The only time you should go after anyone in a house clearing situation is if you know for certain that a loved one is, at that very moment, being assaulted & is in certain danger for their lives and waiting for help would be too late to save a life.

    Even a unit of two cops will call the SWAT team to clear a house.

    By no means, do it the way you see in TV & movies! I'm not gonna tell you all they mistakes the make on TV & movies but there are a bunch. All they care about is getting good camera shots & close-ups of the hero.

    Get trained Joe
    An armed populace are called citizens.
    An unarmed populace are called subjects.

  10. #24
    Member Array torontogunguy's Avatar
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    I never would have found myself in that situation to begin with; but having found myself in the situation I would have backed off FAST. Very fast. While increasing distance I would have drawn (actually - to be honest - I think I would have had my gun in my hand in my pocket to begin with) to low ready and hollered something to the effect of "STOP. GET DOWN ON THE GROUND OR YOU ARE DEAD." You get the idea. The bad guy was trespassing on YOUR property, you felt your life threatended obviously. To be completely honest? If this scumbag didn't follow my instructions pretty damn fast or bolt for the door I would have shot him in the nuts from low ready. Period.

    It is better to be judged by 12 than carried by 6. Let this be a lesson to you to get some training under your belt and NEVER EVER find yourself in this position again if you can avoid it.

    Your first mistake was not announcing yourself and making noise? Hmmm. Methinks that is a double edged sword as it gives the bad guy time to get himself ready for you.

    Like I say - in fear of your life. Surprised. Bad guy not responding to loud verbal commands and approaching you as you are retreating? Sorry guys, I would have taken the shot to stop the advance.

    But that's just me.

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