When I see a sign on a store that says "no weapons"....... - Page 3

When I see a sign on a store that says "no weapons".......

This is a discussion on When I see a sign on a store that says "no weapons"....... within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; I spent the better part of the first year of my carry looking for posted signs in CO. Did not find a single one, so ...

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  1. #31
    VIP Member Array Sticks's Avatar
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    I spent the better part of the first year of my carry looking for posted signs in CO. Did not find a single one, so I don't even look anymore (READ - I don't even read any of the signage on the doors or windows, unless the door is locked, then I look for the hours of operation).

    The only "No Firearms" signs that I have ever seen have been at the airport security checkpoint, and the main Post Office distribution hub (local stations are not posted - let's not go down that road).

    In the event that I may actually encounter one, I may or may not respect the wishes of the business owner, it all depends on why I am there and how bad I need what is inside.

    If your state is not binding with the signs, then I'd say it is personal choice to respect it or not.

    However, if you go a traveling to another state, it is a REAL GOOD IDEA to spend several hours pouring over their carry laws before you go, especially if that state allows individual cities to set their own laws regarding CC (Nebraska for example).
    Sticks

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  2. #32
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    thanks everyone for your replies

  3. #33
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    It has already been said(more than once) that signage carry different legal weight according to state law. In Ohio the signage has no specific requirements for size, wording or placement. A store or property owner doesn't even need a sign, a verbally warning/notification carries the weight of law. Now it is a misdemeanor and I don't know if it would get your license revoked but it does mean you have broken the law just by entering a premises that is posted.

    After all that,I'll get to the real intent of my post.

    It is a matter of principle for me. I refuse to spend my money where I am not allowed to protect My self and My family. It's their(property owners) right to deny carry and I will respect their decision. However, I always question the signage when I see a new one. I have gotten three(basically) variations of responses from business owners/managers.

    1. "That our policy thank you and good bye." or "It's corporate policy and I can't do anything about it."

    2. "It doesn't apply to CCW licensees."

    3. "The state says I have to post because I sell alcohol."

    1= Not much you can do in these situations except let them know that I will be spending my money elsewhere.

    2 & 3 are because the owner/manager doesn't understand the law(understandable if they do not have a CCW) and is actually perpetrated by the fact that the liquor license package the state(county?) sends out to package license holders includes a sign that references ORC pertaining to it being a felony to carry a firearm on premises. This signage is pre CCW in Ohio and does not specifically mean to deny licensed CCW but the vagueness of the law in the area of posting gives it that possibly unintended meaning(Ohio only precludes licensed carry in bars or restaurants where liquor is sold for consumption on premises).

    I have had business owners immediately remove signs once they realized they were not a legal requirement.
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  4. #34
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    [QUOTE=Bunny;1422373]At the risk fo sounding like a jackaninny or a mall ninja, I AM the weapon. I have teeth, nails, elbows, feet, and a killer right hook. Yes, so is my gun, but I have a ram instrument on my keychain, too. WHAT, exactly, are they calling "weapon?"

    Kinda confusing , EH?? ^^^^^Just the way the lawyers like it!!^^^



    Quote Originally Posted by metallic View Post
    Signage isn't legally binding in Louisiana. I enter and shop like nothing happened. Now, odds are I won't be coming back...
    ^YEP^^^^^

    Quote Originally Posted by richgp100z View Post
    2 stores that have a sign heard me talking to a friend who is a cop and we were talking about no ccw places in my town that we both live in. I said that if I get shot and killed,can my family sue the store for not protecting me from such harm????? The manager heard me talk and asked us both if we were ccwing and we both said yes. I was sitting in my wheelchair because of a amputation of right leg below the knee and he,my police friend showed his badge and city id. I even showed him my ccw permit and drivers license and he called main office and then sign came down 2 minutes later. Moral of incident is,,,,, threaten to sue incase the store or company doesnt have the means of protecting you from robery or shootings. richgp100z

    I posted that in another thread, about in the unlikely event something goes down in a business, I am unarmed because of their request that I unarm, I sustain injuries as a result of their request, I should be able to sue them for being denied my rights, deemed legal by the state.



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  5. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by MJK View Post
    As Cardinalfan says, in MO we can be issued a "ticket" if asked to leave and we refuse. It's considered a misdemeanor, equivalent to a traffic citation.

    The graphic standards for signs in MO are quite specific. Those that don't meet the standards (and very few do) might as well not even exist.

    I follow the laws of my state exactly as they are stated.
    It would probably be worth your while to review MO. Rev. Stat.
    We now have one of the most liberal and fair laws for concealed carry in the country. There are exceptions however.

    Several conditions of the preemption of previous legislation specify conditions and exceptions of unlawful use of a firearm, a class D Felony or a class B Felony. Under other conditions, a class A or B Misdemeanor. All are serious offenses that can put you in the slam and also remove your privilege to carry concealed.
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  6. #36
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    i think standing by your principles is worth more than saving a buck or two. when i see a store that's posted, i walk away.

    businesses i no longer give my money to:

    Denny's
    Border's bookstores
    Kay/Jarrod's Jeweler's
    Long John Silver's
    Penn Security Bank & Trust Co.
    PNC Bank
    CVS pharmacies
    Blockbuster videostores

    there are a few more, but you get the idea. some of these are national chains, others are local. can you imagine what would happen to these businesses if every single gun owner stopped giving them their money? in PA alone, there are close to 500, 000 people with a license to carry. that's half a million people! if we all collectively decided to boycott a product or business, it would definitely impact their financial stability. imagine that on a national scale.

    unfortunately, people like the OP don't see things on a larger scale, and only think about the immediate situation, so nothing changes. i do my part; i wish everyone else would do theirs.

  7. #37
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    Much more of my money goes to those "No Guns Allowed" businesses than I would like to admit. For instance,,,the United States Post Office for mailing a christmas package to my neice in Iraq, some APO addy. And then there is the County Court house where I spend several thousand a year in taxes. and even more to get Fish and Game permits. I shal not forget the hundred some dollars to get my fingerprints and paperwork for my CCW permit at the County Sheriff's office. And there's the trip to go into the State DMV to get my permit and photo taken...just a few more dollars in a gun free zone.
    So for those of you that tell about spending no money in a no carry zone, think again. Your own gov't entities are the worst!

  8. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by richgp100z View Post
    2 stores that have a sign heard me talking to a friend who is a cop and we were talking about no ccw places in my town that we both live in. I said that if I get shot and killed,can my family sue the store for not protecting me from such harm????? The manager heard me talk and asked us both if we were ccwing and we both said yes. I was sitting in my wheelchair because of a amputation of right leg below the knee and he,my police friend showed his badge and city id. I even showed him my ccw permit and drivers license and he called main office and then sign came down 2 minutes later. Moral of incident is,,,,, threaten to sue incase the store or company doesnt have the means of protecting you from robery or shootings. richgp100z

    Thanks for the idea. I'll try that one sometime.
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  9. #39
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    Until the government restricts my movement, I go anywhere I wish. I could care less who has a NO GUNS ALLOWED sign. In fact I rarely see them anymore. What's the big fear anyway. Your firearm is concealed. I never understood why some people got in an uproar over those signs. It's not like it's enforced by the low pay clerk at the register. I'd worry more about guns being banned totally.
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  10. #40
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    In spite of all the legal requirements that need to be satisfied in order to make a "guns banned" sign enforceable, the fact is that the owner of a private establishment is trying to use his first amendment rights to deny you your second amendment rights while you are on his property. As law abiding permit holders, who have the responsibility and accountability to the letter of the law, would you use a technicality to excuse your failure to respect the spirit of the law?

    In a polite society, the courteous answer is to comply with the wishes of your host or decline the invitation. However, those of us who call ourselves citizens, who take a pro-active role in the shaping of our culture, will use diplomatic communication to enlighten decision makers that their policy hurts their profit.
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    Tu ne cede malis, sed contra audentior ito.
    ("Do not give in to evil but proceed ever more boldly against it.")
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  11. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by richgp100z View Post
    2 stores that have a sign heard me talking to a friend who is a cop and we were talking about no ccw places in my town that we both live in. I said that if I get shot and killed,can my family sue the store for not protecting me from such harm????? The manager heard me talk and asked us both if we were ccwing and we both said yes. I was sitting in my wheelchair because of a amputation of right leg below the knee and he,my police friend showed his badge and city id. I even showed him my ccw permit and drivers license and he called main office and then sign came down 2 minutes later. Moral of incident is,,,,, threaten to sue incase the store or company doesnt have the means of protecting you from robery or shootings. richgp100z

    Now, this is reasonable and a dang good way of going about it. Good job and you proved to me that common sense still prevails to an extent amoung some gun carrying folks.
    "I dislike death, however, there are some things I dislike more than death. Therefore, there are times when I will not avoid danger" Mencius"

  12. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by jahwarrior72 View Post
    i think standing by your principles is worth more than saving a buck or two. when i see a store that's posted, i walk away.

    businesses i no longer give my money to:

    Denny's
    Border's bookstores
    Kay/Jarrod's Jeweler's
    Long John Silver's
    Penn Security Bank & Trust Co.
    PNC Bank
    CVS pharmacies
    Blockbuster videostores

    there are a few more, but you get the idea. some of these are national chains, others are local. can you imagine what would happen to these businesses if every single gun owner stopped giving them their money? in PA alone, there are close to 500, 000 people with a license to carry. that's half a million people! if we all collectively decided to boycott a product or business, it would definitely impact their financial stability. imagine that on a national scale.

    unfortunately, people like the OP don't see things on a larger scale, and only think about the immediate situation, so nothing changes. i do my part; i wish everyone else would do theirs.

    We talk about seeing things on a larger scal. Do you have any idea in your world of the folks who work for those chains or retailers, the folks trying to make a living what that would do to them or do you only care about what matters to you that you can exercise your right to carrying your gun into a store. Just asking since you made your thoughts clear that you are not thinking of anyone but yourself, another American Trait that is being lost in todays society. Then we wonder why our society is crumbling before our eyes.
    "I dislike death, however, there are some things I dislike more than death. Therefore, there are times when I will not avoid danger" Mencius"

  13. #43
    Ex Member Array jahwarrior72's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Guardian View Post
    We talk about seeing things on a larger scal. Do you have any idea in your world of the folks who work for those chains or retailers, the folks trying to make a living what that would do to them or do you only care about what matters to you that you can exercise your right to carrying your gun into a store. Just asking since you made your thoughts clear that you are not thinking of anyone but yourself, another American Trait that is being lost in todays society. Then we wonder why our society is crumbling before our eyes.
    of course i'm only thinking of myself, and my family; why else would i carry a gun? the was a question posed; i answered it, and wrote what i felt was a correct response. i never said it was the correct response.

    other people in this thread, and all over this forum, talk about the restrictions on their rights, and about taking action. in reality, most do nothing, or consider their NRA membership enough. i take action by not patronizing businesses that aren't 2A friendly. if every single person who carried a gun in this country did the same, there would be no such businesses; they'd all adjust their thinking pretty quickly when it started to hurt their wallets.

    i'm not advocating the ruination of people's finacial status; people want to know how to take action, and i gave an option.

    i want to reiterate that i carry a gun for selfish reasons: self-defense. it seems like you're trying to make me sound like i'm a jerk. didn't we stage a little revolt a couple of centuries back, because we didn't want to be taxed without being represented?

    "bloody colonists, and their selfish thinking..."

  14. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by jahwarrior72 View Post
    of course i'm only thinking of myself, and my family; why else would i carry a gun? the was a question posed; i answered it, and wrote what i felt was a correct response. i never said it was the correct response.

    other people in this thread, and all over this forum, talk about the restrictions on their rights, and about taking action. in reality, most do nothing, or consider their NRA membership enough. i take action by not patronizing businesses that aren't 2A friendly. if every single person who carried a gun in this country did the same, there would be no such businesses; they'd all adjust their thinking pretty quickly when it started to hurt their wallets.

    i'm not advocating the ruination of people's finacial status; people want to know how to take action, and i gave an option.

    i want to reiterate that i carry a gun for selfish reasons: self-defense. it seems like you're trying to make me sound like i'm a jerk. didn't we stage a little revolt a couple of centuries back, because we didn't want to be taxed without being represented?

    "bloody colonists, and their selfish thinking..."
    Don't compare apple and oranges. Your not advocating the starting of a country, your advocating putting people out of jobs, what do call it. You can name it anything you want, you put down your thoughts and I said what I thought, they didn't concur with yours.

    I love when people who get called out on being selfish won't admit to it, they come back with some off the wall thinking or quote and try and justify that thinking instead of just saying your dang right I'm selfish and I don't give crap about anyone but myself.
    "I dislike death, however, there are some things I dislike more than death. Therefore, there are times when I will not avoid danger" Mencius"

  15. #45
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    Listen, were not going to agree, that's ok,, but I don't mince words, quit doing that back in my military days. You had good points. My military days taught me to care for more then just myself and while I understand that we have to take care of our own to a point, to advocate putting others out of jobs is selfish just so I can carrying a gun into that store, sorry, that just doesn't cut the cake in my view and I will always state so just as you will always state you will not do business with those stores and advocate if all CCP holders did that like you stated 500,000 holders in PA did that, imagine the impact that would have, yes I do imagine that impact that would have, it would impact thousands of families. All for your right to carry a gun into those stores.

    I didn't call you a Jerk, but advocate putting people on the welfare line so you can carry a weapon into a store for 10 or 15 minutes doesn't fall into my line of being a great guy.

    Hey you have your view and I have mine. We don't have to see eye to eye, we don't have to agree even, but don't bring in the founding of this country and try and rationalize our existance today with this debate, that's lame.
    "I dislike death, however, there are some things I dislike more than death. Therefore, there are times when I will not avoid danger" Mencius"

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