Moving from FL to NC/VA. CCW laws? + Largest Gun Store in the World!

This is a discussion on Moving from FL to NC/VA. CCW laws? + Largest Gun Store in the World! within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; It is time NOW to start working against that commitee chairwoman who last year refused to allow the castle doctrine bill to come up for ...

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Thread: Moving from FL to NC/VA. CCW laws? + Largest Gun Store in the World!

  1. #16
    Member Array hdawson's Avatar
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    Cool

    It is time NOW to start working against that commitee chairwoman who last year refused to allow the castle doctrine bill to come up for debate, inspite of the overwhelming support in the Senate.

    Please post her name and email. Also if known, potential candidates for her house seat. Snail mail addy wouldn't hurt either.

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  3. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by BugDude View Post
    I've never understood the logic of that VA law. You can't CC in a place that sells alcohol for consumption, but you can OC. Doesn't make sense to me, but I comply with it anyway.
    It's not that law -- as in a single written law in the Code.

    Many time two or more written laws and/or court decisions create strange situations.

    In this case, Virginia is an OC State -- in the sense that if you can possess a firearm you can open carry it. This is by default -- i.e., there is no law against it. So, if it is not illegal, it is legal.

    Virginia has no law against firearms in clubs & restaurants that serve. So, if it is not illegal, it is legal.

    Virginia does have a law against CC in in clubs & restaurants that serve.

    Hence the Virginia Tuck.
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    I'm just one root in a grassroots organization. No one should assume that I speak for the VCDL.

    I am neither an attorney-at-law nor I do play one on television or on the internet. No one should assumes my opinion is legal advice.

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  4. #18
    Member Array jbailey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nobody View Post
    True enough. But the stupid part about NC law is that once an intruder is inside your home you can not defend it with deadly force if the intruder is only there to steal your stuff. Hopefully this will all change in November when the libs are sent home. Our current lib controlled congress rarely allows any great pro 2A bills out of committee.
    I'm with you...I don't think that makes sense.

    It seems the intent was to give the non-violent or fleeing intruder a break.

    My personal feeling is that if someone breaks into an occupied dwelling, they should expect to risk being shot on sight.

    Jim
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  5. #19
    Senior Member Array Landric's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BugDude View Post
    I've never understood the logic of that VA law. You can't CC in a place that sells alcohol for consumption, but you can OC. Doesn't make sense to me, but I comply with it anyway.
    Back before VA was a shall issue state (prior to July 1, 1995) it was a may issue state (and it was up to Circuit Court judges who got a permit and who didn't, in some jurisdictions it was easy, in others, impossible to get a pemit). At the time it was legal for permit holders to carry concealed in places that served alcohol. One of the changes made to the law in order to change from may issue to shall issue (and to get it passed) was to prohibit concealed carry in places that serve alcohol. The statute that spells out the requirements for the issuance of a CHP is 18.2-308, which is also the statute that addresses the carrying of concealed weapons in general. It makes no reference one way or another to open carry, so when the changes were made, they only applied to concealed carry, not open carry. There is no Virginia statute that addresses open carry of handguns (other than those defined as "assault weapons") or prohibits weapons or firearms in general in places that serve alcohol. Therefore there was no law to modify to prohibit carry in general in places that serve alcohol. It was probably just an oversite on the part of those who insisted on the change, but its an oversite that has never been "corrected".

    Quote Originally Posted by nobody View Post
    Welcome to North Kakilaki! Moving from FL to NC will be a slap in the face from what you're used to. What the others have said plus we don't have a castle doctrine either!
    Sure we do, it just happens to be a common law concept and not statutory law. With the exception of the "forcible entry" statute, NC doesn't have a written castle doctrine, but the idea that "a man's home is his castle" is a concept as old as the common law its self and it still applies in NC absent a statute to the contrary or one expanding the common law idea.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dean407 View Post
    Moving from FL to north east NC just 1hr from VA.

    I would be going into VA often too.

    I'm on handgunlaw.us now...

    Regarding the NC laws....

    Not allowed - "Assemblies and establishments where admission was charged. 14-269.3"

    So, I could carry in a mall, but it is illegal to carry into the movie theater in the mall because it charges admission?

    What is the point of this?
    Basically that is the commonly accepted understanding. There is some question as to whether one is actually paying admission to the theater since one can enter the building without paying, but has to pay to actually see the movie. That is more of a question for lawyers and would probably have to be a defense at trial if one was caught carrying, but its a defense that might work. On the down side most of the theaters in my part of NC seem to be posted anyway.

    One has to remember that NC didn't have any legal concealed carry for non-LEOs (and LEOs were limited to their jurisdiction) before December 1st, 1995. All of these laws pre-date carry in NC and none of them were changed with shall-issue CHP was made law. The CHP law its self isn't restrictive, its the laws that pre-date it that create all the no-carry locations. The intent of the admission law was for sporting events, concerts, and such, but people smarter than me see to think it also applies to threaters. I don't know of any case law on the issue.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dean407 View Post
    Hmm...this one stands out: "Where notice of carrying a concealed handgun is prohibited by the posting of a conspicuous notice or
    statement. 14-415.11(c)"

    Sooooooo...here in FL (as I understand it) if an establishment has a sign, it's simply their policy and they have the right to ask you to leave, etc...if caught carrying a handgun BUT it isn't ILLEGAL.

    In NC it seems, if an establishment has a sign and you carry- you are breaking the law. That really sucks.
    Yep, carrying into a place that is posted is illegal, and the charge is carrying a concealed gun. A conviction for such will probably bar one from getting a permit in the future and a second offense is a felony.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dean407 View Post
    No carry in State parks in NC. Another bummer.
    Or any other state property (except rest areas on highways), or where state employees work (if it isn't state property and therefore already prohibited).

    Quote Originally Posted by Dean407 View Post
    MUST INFORM Police Officer...well, that's not a big deal.
    Generally no, but make sure that you do it right away if you are "officially contacted" by LE. I know of a guy who has been charged twice for failure to notify because in one instance he waited until the officer finished his initial contact speech (in which the officer asked him if he had any weapons) before he notified the officer he was legally carrying a handgun concealed. The officer contended that he should have spoken up as soon as the officer made it to his window instead of being polite and waiting for the officer to finish talking. His weapon was seized as evidence (it was his only handgun, so he had to go buy another while waiting for his case to be resolved). The charge was eventually dismissed by the ADA, but he didn't get his handgun back until he filed a formal complaint with the department, which originally refused to return the weapon.

    In the second case he was involved in a traffic crash (he was rear ended). He was out of his vehicle when the police arrived and his handgun was in the unlocked glove box of his car. He was shaken by the wreck and didn't think to tell the officer who was working the crash that he had a permit and the gun was in the car. When the officer ran his DL and a warrant check he discovered the permit. The officer then asked him if he had a weapon and he told the officer that it was in his car. Keep in mind that at no time was this gentleman inside his vehicle in the presense of the police (which in my understanding of the law means he was not in possession of a concealed handgun and therefore didn't need to notify). He was charged again with failure to notify and his handgun was again seized as evidence. When last I talked to him the case was still pending and his handgun was still in police custody.

    I'm not one of those people that thinks one needs a reason to carry a handgun, but if someone needed a reason, this gentleman has one. He is a cab driver and he started carrying after he was robbed and shot in the same city where the above incidents occured.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dean407 View Post
    How does the overall legal system treat people with CCW in NC? The system overall seems to be on the side of CCW folks here in FL.
    It really depends on the jurisdiction. In most of NC its no big deal, in some of the bigger cities it can be an issue (see above). Both of the above incidents I described happened in the same central NC city (I am sure some of our NC members can guess where).
    -Landric

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  6. #20
    VIP Member Array chiefjason's Avatar
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    Landric, Gotta be Durham! What do I win?

    Here in the foothills of WNC, CCP holders and even OC'ers are treated well. But this is gun country.

    Deborah Ross is the committee chair that is holding up the Castle Doctrine. The main part I would like to see is the no civil suit clause in a justified shooting.

    This is an interesting read too.

    http://www.jus.state.nc.us/NCJA/ncfirearmslaws.pdf

    Some of these laws are being fought for change. Keep you eyes open for this and email your reps when they come up. The state parks, restaurants, and castle doctrine where all up last year. The Castle doctrine is the only one standing for the short session. Need to find out when that starts, or if it already has.

  7. #21
    Senior Member Array Landric's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chiefjason View Post
    Landric, Gotta be Durham! What do I win?
    Yep, you got it, your prize is knowing yet another reason to not to visit the BullS**t City.
    -Landric

    "The Engine could still smile...it seemed to scare them" -Felix

  8. #22
    Member Array Spike32's Avatar
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    The restaurant carry law that our idiot democratic governor vetoed twice will be signed into law by our new Republican Governor this year, so you should be able to carry concealed in a restaurant that serves alcohol sometime next year in Virginia.
    You'll rock, with a 357 Glock

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