Missouri CCW Law amended to allow in more common places? - Page 3

Missouri CCW Law amended to allow in more common places?

This is a discussion on Missouri CCW Law amended to allow in more common places? within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Originally Posted by BukWild Taken from Section 571-107 Endorsement does not authorize conceale Carrying of a concealed firearm in a location specified in subdivisions (1) ...

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Thread: Missouri CCW Law amended to allow in more common places?

  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by BukWild View Post
    Taken from Section 571-107 Endorsement does not authorize conceale

    Carrying of a concealed firearm in a location specified in subdivisions (1) to (17) of subsection 1 of this section by any individual who holds a concealed carry endorsement issued pursuant to sections 571.101 to 571.121 shall not be a criminal act but may subject the person to denial to the premises or removal from the premises. If such person refuses to leave the premises and a peace officer is summoned, such person may be issued a citation for an amount not to exceed one hundred dollars for the first offense. If a second citation for a similar violation occurs within a six-month period, such person shall be fined an amount not to exceed two hundred dollars and his or her endorsement to carry concealed firearms shall be suspended for a period of one year. If a third citation for a similar violation is issued within one year of the first citation, such person shall be fined an amount not to exceed five hundred dollars and shall have his or her concealed carry endorsement revoked and such person shall not be eligible for a concealed carry endorsement for a period of three years.

    So this tells me that I can carry there, but must comply if asked to leave....
    Yes, again with exceptions. You can and will be arrested and detained at sensitive government and some non-government installations including some schools. I have seen it happen. Do you feel lucky?
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  2. #32
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    goab, use this link and go straight to the forums. Try your question there.



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    There are civilians there who helped draft MO ccw laws.
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  3. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by SIGP250 View Post
    Yes, again with exceptions. You can and will be arrested and detained at sensitive government and some non-government installations including some schools. I have seen it happen. Do you feel lucky?
    Understood, no I do not feel lucky! I would not attempt to carry in a Govt building or school, but may carry in a church or hospital or private property with a legal sign....My EDC is concealed at all times, would only be an issue if I had to pull it out, at which time, I will then deal with the consequences....

  4. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by MoMike View Post
    goab, use this link and go straight to the forums. Try your question there.



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    There are civilians there who helped draft MO ccw laws.
    Yes, I may do that.
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  5. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by raytracer View Post
    Not so. 21.750 creates a primacy of state law over local:



    Subsection 3, however, provides for regulation of open carry - and open carry only - on a local level:



    This preemption was a sticking point in getting concealed carry passed in Missouri. Without it, right to carry would be effectively useless, especially in metropolitan areas like Kansas City and St. Louis where you can pass through 3 different jurisdictions just to get groceries.

    Joe

    Joe,

    I spoke with a St. Louis City Sheriff friend today. You are correct. I should not have written before talking with him today. MO law and preemption makes it so that NO other jurisdiction can impose law more stringent than the state law. I will be getting some more information from him to send to two local police detectives who told me the opposite. I should not have written before doing proper research.

    I think there is still some confusion between open carry and concealed carry.

    In the case of the bus driver, the sheriff said that if he has permission to carry concealed from the church, it is perfectly legal. A church bus is not public transportation.
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  6. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by goab View Post
    Now I was taught that you can't carry in certain places in my CCW course namely the list in the law. I got that.

    I was taught no carry in churches (unless ok'd by the pastor and board) and schools. And this concerned me as I'm a school bus driver and a ministry leader at my church.

    Now I got my CHP back in October and my course in early August and there was nothing about carrying on a bus but about 3 weeks later, there it was, subsection 10 on section 1 of MO 571.030.

    (1) Carries concealed upon or about his or her person a knife, a firearm, a blackjack or any other weapon readily capable of lethal use; or

    (8) Carries a firearm or any other weapon readily capable of lethal use into any church or place where people have assembled for worship, or into any election precinct on any election day, or into any building owned or occupied by any agency of the federal government, state government, or political subdivision thereof; or

    (10) Carries a firearm, whether loaded or unloaded, or any other weapon readily capable of lethal use into any school, onto any school bus, or onto the premises of any function or activity sponsored or sanctioned by school officials or the district school board.


    Now I failed to read further until tonight. Section 4 of MO 571.030

    4. Subdivisions (1), (8), and (10) of subsection 1 of this section shall not apply to any person who has a valid concealed carry endorsement issued pursuant to sections 571.101 to 571.121 or a valid permit or endorsement to carry concealed firearms issued by another state or political subdivision of another state.

    Now go read the entire thing here: Section 571-030 Unlawful use of weapons--exceptions--pe

    And tell me what you think, y'all.
    Does it make you legal to carry in the church, polling place, or school with a legal CCW permit? If so, Missouri just became the coolest place to have a CHP
    You've always been legal to carry in a church in Missouri. None of the off-limits places is a criminal offense unless you run afoul of the Fed. which would include schools since you aren't authorized by the state, simply not committing a criminal offense.

  7. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by MountainPacker View Post
    You've always been legal to carry in a church in Missouri. None of the off-limits places is a criminal offense unless you run afoul of the Fed. which would include schools since you aren't authorized by the state, simply not committing a criminal offense.
    Here remains one of my sticking points.

    RSMO Section 571.030

    (8) Carries a firearm or any other weapon readily capable of lethal use into any church or place where people have assembled for worship, or into any election precinct on any election day, or into any building owned or occupied by any agency of the federal government, state government, or political subdivision thereof; or

    The written law published by the MO attorney general is clearly not the same as what the local sheriff who issued my CCW permit tells me. He says it is OK. What would a judge and jury say if a shooting incident were to take place? How would lawyers turn this around?
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  8. #38
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    Kansas did the thing , no carry in churches, schools, etc. Then the Legislature got wise ... it was too confusing and easy to mistakenly carry in a prohibited place. So, they changed it all.... and essentially now it is, you can carry 'anywhere' that is not prohibited by Federal law or if it's 'posted' with an approved AG 'no carry' sign.

    Sounds like ya'all need the same clarification.

  9. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eagleks View Post
    Kansas did the thing , no carry in churches, schools, etc. Then the Legislature got wise ... it was too confusing and easy to mistakenly carry in a prohibited place. So, they changed it all.... and essentially now it is, you can carry 'anywhere' that is not prohibited by Federal law or if it's 'posted' with an approved AG 'no carry' sign.

    Sounds like ya'all need the same clarification.
    Missouri was I believe the 42rd state to revise its gun law from permit to endorsement or CCW.
    After learning from the mistakes of several other states, Missouri took a bold stance and enacted one of the best concealed carry gun laws in the country.
    Kansas has a newer law. It seems each progressive state learns from the another.
    Incidentally, Missouri and Kansas now have equal reciprocity so that is a big plus.

    Welcome Kansas!
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  10. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by SIGP250 View Post
    Yes, Missouri very much has the Castle Doctrine in place. For those who may not know what this means, It essentially extends your private vehicle as your domain, the same as your private dwelling place.

    This in no way however makes it legal for you to as much enter a parking lot where firearms are prohibited, government buildings, airports, schools, etc., except with exceptions.
    My apologies, my mentioning of it was due to CardinalFans bringing up the subject that the new amendments to the law says that you all don't have to retreat inside your homes, I was merely pointing out that your Castle Doctrine already gave you all that right, this amendment didn't just do that.
    "I dislike death, however, there are some things I dislike more than death. Therefore, there are times when I will not avoid danger" Mencius"

  11. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by Guardian View Post
    My apologies, my mentioning of it was due to CardinalFans bringing up the subject that the new amendments to the law says that you all don't have to retreat inside your homes, I was merely pointing out that your Castle Doctrine already gave you all that right, this amendment didn't just do that.
    Please do not feel you need to apologize. I don't know everything. I don't know of any new amendments.

    I am though a Cardinal fan and helped design the fine new ball park they play in.

    I burned my Rams Sweat shirt on Christmas day. The greatest show on turf turned to a bunch of over paid clowns on field.

    We also fired the Blues coach I don't know if this was the right thing to do.
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  12. #42
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    Firing Murray was absolutely the right thing to do, no doubt. To clarify, we in Missouri did not fire ON Murray, we simply fired him from his coaching duties. :)

  13. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by silo View Post
    Firing Murray was absolutely the right thing to do, no doubt. To clarify, we in Missouri did not fire ON Murray, we simply fired him from his coaching duties. :)
    We shall see. I don't hope because hoping only leads to hopelessness.

    Hey, speaking of stuff that we are all passionate about how about that Obama. Didn't he look a little like Tiger Woods on the golf course while on his 4 million dollar 10 day Haywain vacation while 15 million American people are out of work.

    I wonder if he wants to take a $35 million dollar ride to the space station next. He has be just about every where here on earth so far.
    If you understand, things are just as they are... If you do not understand, things are just as they are....
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  14. #44
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    Are you saying Bush never went on vacation (oh, wasn't it 1/3 of the time he was in office?) while people were out of work? I'm confused.

    Wrong forum, nonetheless.

  15. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by MountainPacker View Post
    You've always been legal to carry in a church in Missouri. None of the off-limits places is a criminal offense unless you run afoul of the Fed. which would include schools since you aren't authorized by the state, simply not committing a criminal offense.
    i do believe that tresspassing if you didnt leave is a criminal offense..

    so basically if somone saw your weapon..... one could be asked to leave. if not then you would be arrested for tresspassing....... this my friend is a criminal offense. at least i would think it was
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