This is a discussion on Another Anti-Question. within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; I think the question of the company being more restrictive than the state comes down to this:
It's not "illegal" for you to carry at ...
May 9th, 2006 01:32 PM
I think the question of the company being more restrictive than the state comes down to this:
It's not "illegal" for you to carry at work but it is illegal to carry someplace that the state forbids. Your work can ask you to leave or fire you but you wouldn't be thrown in jail for it.
Companies don't make laws - just policies.
"If you so much as bunny hop I'll cut your heart out!" Billy Bob Thornton in The Last Real Cowboys
"I carry a gun for the same reason that I carry health insurance and a cell phone - be prepared."
May 9th, 2006 01:44 PM
Sounds like the military solution: If it's not specifically and expressly with extreme detail...forbidden then it's allowed. OR the short version: Always easier to beg forgiveness for something you already did than to beg permission for something you wanna do....
Former Army Infantry Captain; 25 yrs as an NRA Certified Instructor; Avid practitioner of the martial art: KLIK-PAO.
May 10th, 2006 12:41 AM
Typically, with the many companies I have worked for in the past, both in NH and in MA, "workplace" encompassed all of the property said buisness operated on or owned. The parking lot or any parking area not specifically located on a public road was subject to "workplace" jargon.
If your handgun was seen in your car out in the parking area, I would assume that some spineless wimp could take you to the unemployment line over it. Depending on how important the job is to you, the "don't ask, don't tell" policy may be right up your alley.
Just be prepared to stand up for your rights and morals over the money if push comes to shove.
"You've never lived until you've almost died. For those who fight for it, life has a flavor the protected will never know" - T.R.
<----My LT was unhappy that I did not have my PASS-Tag at that fire. But I found the body so he said he would overlook it. :)
May 10th, 2006 01:24 PM
That's unreal. Not even New York City has gone that far (yet). Do they really enforce that? Have you actually seen the wording of that law? I know a lot of places have a blade length limit, which can get stupid, but I don'r recall ever hearing of a couny wide ban.
Originally Posted by jahwarrior72
EOD - Initial success or total failure
May 14th, 2006 12:25 AM
Two things that I thought I would add. First, the company does not need a warrant to search your car. If they felt like paying the costs of repair and maybe a civil suit (although I don't know how that would work out being that you could be and probably are parked on their property), they can search every single inch of your car.
You are probably wondering hey, how can they violate my 4th amendment rights? The answer is because you 4th amendment rights only protect you against the government and its agents. In other words, if anyone searched your home, car, garage, garbadge can, etc. and they don't work for the government, your 4th amendment rights have not been violated. The 4th Amendment only gives you protection from government, not private entities like your employer. If you work for the government of course then the 4th Amendment does apply.
Second thing I thought I would add is that companies own private property. For the most part, just like you at home, companies can make their own rules about things like behavior, dress, chewing gum, surfing the net, and guns that they want. Obvious exceptions are harrassment and the like. That is how companies can make rules and policies more stringent than what state law allows. Violating those policies could take you from honored and welcomed guest to trespasser, depending on the attitude of the employer.
May 14th, 2006 12:30 AM
Don't ask, Don't tell.
May 14th, 2006 12:50 AM
Cali-da is right on about the 4th amendment and the property rights issue. I'd also like to add that a good deal of an employer's right to control you comes from two sources:
1. Contractual business relationships where you may have agreed to let them perform a search.
2. The "at will" nature of most employment these days. "at will" means that they can fire you for any non-prohibited reason. This means that while your employer may recogize your right to refuse a search they may also fire you for not cooperating.
May 15th, 2006 06:58 PM
Keep it quiet if you carry in your car. It could cause problems if you get the job. I would not even question it.
Listen, Think and React.....Nuff Said.....
May 15th, 2006 07:20 PM
Interpretation is everything. I had posted earlier about my workplace which states "dangerous or illegal firearms are prohibited".
Since my weapons are not illegal, and only people employing weapons can be dangerous (other than a malfunctioning piece) i chose to interpret this company policy in my favor.
"We must remember that one man is much
the same as another, and that he is best
who is trained in the severest school."
~Thucydides, History of the Peloponnesian War
May 16th, 2006 11:43 AM
Originally Posted by Ride4TheBrand
Good call on that. I'll check the wording of my place's rules as well. It doesn't stop me now because I give a crap about my safety, but potentially being able to keep my job if I'm "made" is even better.
May 17th, 2006 12:38 PM
You could have some real fun with that wording.
Let's see, you can jam a pencil/pen in somebody's eye killing him or her.
A CD broken can make an excellent jabbing weapon. Rolled up newspaper can be a good club, not to mention the hot coffee which can be thrown and scauld somebody.
I wonder if these companies ever though of those "weapons".
“The highest obligation and privilege of citizenship is that of bearing arms”. General George Patton—US Army
Vis et Veneratio
"So this is how democracy dies: to thunderous applause." Actress Natalie Portman as Padme in Star Wars Revenge of the Sith
May 18th, 2006 12:21 AM
about leaving it in the car her in kaliforniastan they cant seaarch your car . non a job site the plant we were working at brought dog in to the parking lot and sniffed every ones car and found some guys had pot in there car and a coupl with meth but the da couldnt procicute though this was befor 911 so i dont know about now although im greatly oposed to drugs think upholding personal property rights was good just my .02 think dont ask dont tell is a fine position to take
May 20th, 2006 03:18 AM
I'd rather be fired for carrying that be attacked on the job and be defenseless. I carry and my employers doesn't know. There is nothing in the employee manual about weapons. I can find another minimum wage job in this town tomorrow if need be. That is all that is around here.
07/02 FFL/SOT since 2006
Probably the only home based FFL that doesn't do transfers.
May 20th, 2006 10:04 AM
Do not talk about guns or carrying at work!Do not give cause to
employer to want to check your vehicle.Do not trust anyone at work!
Other than that I would keep it in my vehicle have been for years safely.
May 22nd, 2006 04:48 PM
Just a thought. I have worked for companies with no gun anywhere policies. I deeply regret ever taking the job. The policy makers have zero regard for any and all of your rights. I hated every hour spent there. Owner, and pres were biggest jerks I have ever met.
What ever you have to do to go home.
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