Is This Legal in WA?

Is This Legal in WA?

This is a discussion on Is This Legal in WA? within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; I saw this console holster mount on another forum and would like to know if it's legal in WA. Some of the other forum members ...

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  1. #1
    Member Array HahnsXD's Avatar
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    Is This Legal in WA?

    I saw this console holster mount on another forum and would like to know if it's legal in WA. Some of the other forum members were saying that it was illegal in their state.
    "You can't stop insane people from doing insane things by passing insane laws."-Penn Jillette


  2. #2
    Distinguished Member Array nutz4utwo's Avatar
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    You must have a valid permit to have any loaded pistol in your vehicle. This includes both an openly carried (as depicted) or concealed pistol while in your vehicle.

    Loaded rifles are never permitted in vehicles in WA.

    read, understand, and follow:
    Chapter 9.41 RCW: Firearms and dangerous weapons

    Carrying a firearm in that way is of dubious value from any perspective. I firmly believe firearms should only be attached to your body in a quality holster or in a safe.
    "a reminder that no law can replace personal responsibility" - Bill Clinton 2010.

  3. #3
    Member Array HahnsXD's Avatar
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    I have my CPL, I was just making sure it's legal to carry it like that, since passengers have access to it, ect..
    "You can't stop insane people from doing insane things by passing insane laws."-Penn Jillette

  4. #4
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    I believe that Washington law requires it to be in "direct control of the permit holder" and not in the control of any passengers. So this would seem to be illegal if there are any passengers in the vehicle.

    FWIW, a LEO from White Salmon told me it was required to have it directly on your body. Now we all know that LEOs aren't always accurate on the laws, but you can figure out what an encounter with this particular officer may end up like...

    IANAL, and YMMV

  5. #5
    Ex Member Array G19inLV's Avatar
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    I don't know about it being legal in Washington, but that looks like a good set up.

    Oh, and by the way, if it is illegal...just stick it in your holster when you get pulled over....

  6. #6
    Member Array aric's Avatar
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    I'm too tired to dig through the RCW tonight so lets assume its perfectly legal. There are still 2 problems with it
    #1: The LEO will see it before he's notified of its presence. This sets the tone of the encounter.

    #2: to avoid #1, you have to move or holster it. there is a good chance this motion will be noticed the LEO. This REALLY sets the tone for the encounter.

  7. #7
    Member Array ocadmirer's Avatar
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    FWIW in most states that I have been in, what isn't on other ppl's person is technically in the possession of the driver. I'm no lawyer though...

  8. #8
    Member Array swatspyder's Avatar
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    Just keep it holstered on your belt. What's the big deal with hitting the belt release and pulling your firearm out?

  9. #9
    pax
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    Senior Member Array pax's Avatar
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    FWIW, a LEO from White Salmon told me it was required to have it directly on your body. Now we all know that LEOs aren't always accurate on the laws, but you can figure out what an encounter with this particular officer may end up like...
    In this particular case, the officer knew what he was talking about. See RCW 9.41.050

    Quote Originally Posted by RCW 9.41.050
    (2)(a) A person shall not carry or place a loaded pistol in any vehicle unless the person has a license to carry a concealed pistol and: (i) The pistol is on the licensee's person, (ii) the licensee is within the vehicle at all times that the pistol is there, or (iii) the licensee is away from the vehicle and the pistol is locked within the vehicle and concealed from view from outside the vehicle.
    There is a letter of opinion from the state AG floating around which opines that firearms carried in a purse or glove compartment would be acceptable under this law. But as far as I know, we have no case law on this point -- and the black-letter law would certainly disallow the set up in your photo if we go by the face of things. In other words, you might later win in court (maybe), but the police would be on very firm ground if they arrested you, confiscated the weapon, and let the courts sort it out. And the prima facie reading of the law isn't favorable.

    Best not to risk it.

    pax
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  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by swatspyder View Post
    Just keep it holstered on your belt. What's the big deal with hitting the belt release and pulling your firearm out?

    That!
    Having a pistol out in the open like that has multiple issues besides LEO's. From a practical standpoint, why would you want it to be seen from outside your vehicle? When you park, you must holster it, which also can be observed. Assuming you keep your doors locked when driving, it still is left out in the open, which is not in your control. Bad idea all around.

  11. #11
    Member Array Fred's Avatar
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    I've never quite understood the need to "show it off". It's certainly a tactical blunder to reveal your capability, so it has to be something else. It's just what is that something else?

    Every time I see somebody OC I realize how easy it would be to take them down. Very few CC holders in my experience stray too far from condition white so the unrestricted access to the gun (as in LEO) is not the issue. Fortunately I'm one of the good guys, so I just grin and pass on. I certainly don't want to be identified with them.

    I carry multiple weapons at times and have made a decision that an out of nowhere warning shot COM is far superior than walking around with all my Aces showing. Do what you want though it's still a mostly free country.
    For the stength of the pack is the wolf, and the strength of the wolf is the pack. - R. Kipling

    Romans 1:22 Claiming to be wise, they became fools [professing to be smart, they made simpletons of themselves].

  12. #12
    Member Array HardCorps79's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pax View Post
    In this particular case, the officer knew what he was talking about. See RCW 9.41.050
    Beat me to it. I'm moving out that way, so I've been researching WA laws. This will be an adjustment for me. I currently have holsters mounted to the seats of my vehicles, as they're easier to draw than from IWB, etc. (In MO no permit is required for vehicle carry and there's no restriction on loaded rifles/shotguns either).

    But the way the WA law reads it would seem you have to have the pistol concealed on your person.

    And PAX, would love to meet you when we get out that way. My wife has been browsing your site and loves it.

    Semper Fi
    NRA Certified Instructor (6 years)
    Former LEO/DOD Contractor
    Active Duty Marine (Martial Arts Instructor)
    Glock 17, Kel-Tec P-11, S&W Model 60, various rifles

  13. #13
    Member Array jackg's Avatar
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    Question I like it

    First, can you tell me where you found that little beauty and what it costs, if you don't mind?
    Second, I live in Michigan and have a "CPL". The device you're showing would be legal for me because according to the law the gun is concealed in the entire car. If you don't have a "CPL" then you must keep the gun and the ammo in separate, locked places. For example I could lock the gun in my glove compartment and lock the ammo in the trunk and be good to go.
    Jack
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  14. #14
    Member Array puffer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pax View Post
    In this particular case, the officer knew what he was talking about. See RCW 9.41.050

    Best not to risk it.

    pax
    Pax said it ALL.

    BTW, as an ex LEO, Legal or not ( which IMHO, it is NOT), you would NOT BE HAPPY with my RESPONCE.

    Puffer

  15. #15
    Member Array ak56's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pax View Post
    In this particular case, the officer knew what he was talking about. See RCW 9.41.050

    Originally Posted by RCW 9.41.050
    (2)(a) A person shall not carry or place a loaded pistol in any vehicle unless the person has a license to carry a concealed pistol and: (i) The pistol is on the licensee's person, (ii) the licensee is within the vehicle at all times that the pistol is there, or (iii) the licensee is away from the vehicle and the pistol is locked within the vehicle and concealed from view from outside the vehicle.

    pax
    I'm going to have to go out on a limb and disagree with pax on her reading of 9.41.050.
    The way that 9.41.050 is written, the 'and' is before the colon which precedes the enumerated list of (i), (ii) and (iii). The 'or' applies to all of the items in the list, so to be legal, you must comply with (a) and any one of (i),(ii) or(iii). As long as you have (a) a license to carry a concealed pistol and (ii) the licensee is within the vehicle at all times that the pistol is there, you are legal. Not necessary to have it on your person.

    Having said that, I would not carry in the way shown for several reasons, one of which is the moment you step out of the vehicle, if there are no other license holders in the vehicle, you would be in violation unless you took it with you. Also, if I have to leave the vehicle in a hurry, I want the gun to automatically leave with me.

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