I sent an email to one of the Missouri attorneys that worked on the Missouri self-defense laws and CCW. I asked what a ballpark price would be for legal defense in a defensive shooting. He said expect to pay $20,000 probably more. Pretty scary.
That whole "actually doing this kind of thing for real" deal is worthless when compared to the vast training and practical experience people get from the internet, reading magazines, talking to a lawyer at a CCW class, having coffee with a cop or being sued once or twice.
So...
I'll jump on the bandwagon for once.
Talk to the cops. Tell them the whole story. You don't need a lawyer. The police & court will understand if you make incriminating or inconsistant statements due to stress...
Though I'm pretty sure MitchellCT is trolling, I'll go ahead and bite.
I'm not an attorney but my wife is. Not only does she agree with the video, long before she ever saw it, she made it clear that there would be Hell to pay if I ever talked to a cop without a lawyer.
A co-worker of hers, now an attorney, is also a former cop. He agrees with the video 100%. There is virtually nothing you can do for yourself that is good by talking to the police, while there is a mountain of bad you can do.
I took a class on criminal justice taught by a former assistant District Attorney. She told us that you're an idiot if you ever talk to police, and that a substantial number of her convictions came simply by using the suspect's own words given freely to police.
Lastly, I would argue that by talking to the police, you are throwing away a Constitutional right as precious as the 2nd amendment.
When you call 911, or when police respond to the scene, your Miranda rights have not yet attached; Miranda applies to custodial statements. This can start before the officer formally places you under arrest and handcuffs you. If you have any doubts about the situation, ask if you can leave. If the officer says “no, then you are in custody and your Miranda rights apply. If you don’t ask, your Miranda rights would still apply if a reasonable person in your shoes would not think he or she could leave. Of course, you could also ask if you are under arrest, but “can I leave” may be less confrontational and cover a broader range of situations.
Sadly many people that the only time you need to exercise your rights are if you are guilty and have something to hide. What if that friend whom you believed you could trust hid his stash under your car seat during a traffic stop? Are you absolutely sure the cop will believe that you are a fine upstanding person and would never do such a thing?
A friend lost his car because of a small amount of drugs were found in it at a random roadside check where he "had nothing to hide" He had purchased the
car to resale it as he has done many times in the past. Being a good citizen cost him this time.
Obviously the OP didn't actually watch the video or he'd know the advice is don't talk to the police period
Originally Posted by Justice Robert H. Jackson "Any lawyer worth his salt will tell the suspect in no uncertain terms to make no statement to police under any circumstances."
I did watch the video... and there is a time and a place to talk to the police. At some point, if you are involved in defending yourself, you and your lawyer will decide when, where, how and why.... that is the point of the video.
Do not make incorrect assumptions about whether I watched it or not or if my advise to watch and "not talk to cops without a lawyer in incorrect advise. Hopefully, you will excercise better judgement if you are ever in this situation.
Every situation is different... keep you mouth shut and call your lawyer FIRST... then develop a game plan to make a statement (if any)... does that make you happy and make sense?
CCH permit or not... it's up to the DA to determine if the facts lead to a trial of you or if the shooting (your self defense) was justified. It is that plain and simple.
This is one of those type of No Win threads, that allow everyone to voice their opinion, but nothing changes in the end. I myself am of the Cop persuasion, but I have to tell you, I will be very guarded with my comments, as they can be taken out of context. Also, I will never submit to a lie detector test. I was sitting in the office of a Warden when a Special Agent came in prior to administering a test, and actually discussed how the Warden wanted the test to slant. I was floored.
Good reminder to me and other former and friends of cops who may babble off the record and try to help them out. I viewed and listened to it and then reminded a couple of gun buddies, one of whom is like a teenaged boy who was once a dollar-a-year volunteer and a security guard...decades ago before liability and lawsuits ended most of this. The Ayoob files also remind us that bad things happen to good people, like this latest one who was sued and lost $60,000 over two or more years, as read in this latest gun magazine.
Back in in 1999, after being a witness during a bar shooting, I was half drunk and excited when I started scribbling a statement, upon pages inside a cop's small notebook, while sitting inside a police cruiser. I thought that I was right at that time but got some things wrong...as I found out while sitting on a witness stand about two years later, after being presented with copies of those scribbled notebook pages by the shooter's lawyer for the defense.
I was sitting in the office of a Warden when a Special Agent came in prior to administering a test, and actually discussed how the Warden wanted the test to slant. I was floored.
Did you do anything about it or did you hide behind the "thin blue line"?
Originally Posted by ep1953 Among the things I will say is that I feared for my life and I'm too upset to say anymore at this time. I have no doubt that both statements will be true.
What will you do when the DA presents this post to a jury and says it's proof you were looking for a reason all along?
" Ladies and Gentleman of the jury, the defendant says he had no choice. He said "I feared for my life" the exact statement he posted on the internet 3 years ago that he was going to make when he got his chance to shoot someone down in cold blood"
For those who fall in the NEVER cooperate with the police camp, does that apply to any and all official contact with the police? I'm not talking about nodding; smiling and saying "hi" in the line at Burger King (although I know there are a couple of you who are against that as well). I'm talking about official contact. If a police officer knocks on your door or contacts you in a public place to talk to you about an incident in which you are no way a suspect, does your refusal to talk/cooperate extend to that situation as well? Or are you strictly referring to contacts where you feel that you might be a suspect (justifiably or not) in some criminal activity?
Thanks,
Gonzo
I am still learning about self defense shootings, and i agree its not a good idea to talk to cops but a self-defense shooting aftermath can be difficult to control , there will be alot of confusion and hard feelings so its better to say nothing at all like your in total shock.
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