When you see the sign "no firearms" on businesses.... - Page 6

When you see the sign "no firearms" on businesses....

This is a discussion on When you see the sign "no firearms" on businesses.... within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Originally Posted by 9MMare I understand the distinction. However, it also translates into: I'm not breaking the law/rules unless I get caught. I understand the ...

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Thread: When you see the sign "no firearms" on businesses....

  1. #76
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    Quote Originally Posted by 9MMare View Post
    I understand the distinction. However, it also translates into: I'm not breaking the law/rules unless I get caught.

    I understand the letter of the law. I also see the hypocrisy.
    With all due respect - and I am sorry for asking – but are you going on strong medicines or what? In states like FL, where that type of “no guns” signs (not talking about fed buildings etc) have not weight, you are not breaking the law when ignoring them, because THERE IS NOT A LAW which says that you have to respect them. That is the reason because you are not doing anything illegal until the store owner ask you to leave and you refuse to do it. “Forbidden” and “illegal” can be two totally different things sometimes, and this is one of them. If you want to continue arguing about this matter please post the law that says that it is illegal in for example FL to ignore the “no guns” signs that a store owner hangs up; and if you cannot do it, then ...
    "The Second Amendment: America's Original Homeland Security"


  2. #77
    Member Array MoHawk's Avatar
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    I either ignore them or refuse to give them my business.
    Freedom itself was attacked this morning by a faceless coward, and freedom will be defended

  3. #78
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    as a chl instructor in tx i tell students if they have to leave a firearm in a car/truck remove the mag and keep it with you. no law saying no ammo. and if someone is watching you and steals your firearm it is not a full mag gun just a single shot and most theives are to stupid and lazy to find a mag for the gun..as for carrying you firearm on you with a sign just remmber the better you keep concealed the less likley anyone would know anyway. i am sure if push came to shove and you had to defend someone it nay change there minds.. good luck and keep it concealed...

  4. #79
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    Quote Originally Posted by cammo girl View Post
    Do you bring in ammo clips, or must they be removed as well?

    And, what do you do with the firearm? Do you keep a lockbox in your truck/car, put it in the trunk, hide under seat, etc. Looking for clever ideas.

    Or, can you just unload it? Not really looking for legal advice, just wondering how people approach this issue.

    (yes I am new to cc, thanks for the help)
    Please, review the state’s law there you live to make sure that you do not get in trouble when CCing or OCing. Never trust to 100% the information that you find on the Internet; inclusive the info in this forum or other like it. Good luck
    "The Second Amendment: America's Original Homeland Security"

  5. #80
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    no gun signs

    So for those who are saying they would "ignore" a business sign>>> what does this prove? It is not that much of a burden to secure the gun in your car or just shop elsewhere. Someone here stated about "using" or having to defend someone inside of one of those businesses.... holy Moses!! Can you imagine the LEGAL ramifications that would accompany that situation... ie, you ignore a "no guns" sign then USE your gun inside....wow! Good luck with that,,,and buy a lot of soap on the rope too.

  6. #81
    New Member Array CenterTree's Avatar
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    no gun signage

    Remember, these businesses are PRIVATE property (albeit they seem public to us). As much as we may NOT like the signage and the meaning behind them, we still should show respect and not give anti-gun people any MORE reasons to form a taller wall against us. Just think,,, if you saw a NO SMOKING sign at a restaurant would you boldly walk in with a cig in your mouth?? Doing so would give smokers a bad rap. Just food for thought here.

  7. #82
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    Quote Originally Posted by CenterTree View Post
    So for those who are saying they would "ignore" a business sign>>> what does this prove? It is not that much of a burden to secure the gun in your car or just shop elsewhere. Someone here stated about "using" or having to defend someone inside of one of those businesses.... holy Moses!! Can you imagine the LEGAL ramifications that would accompany that situation... ie, you ignore a "no guns" sign then USE your gun inside....wow! Good luck with that,,,and buy a lot of soap on the rope too.
    I do not know the answer to your question, I guess that it depends of the state there you are; here in FL those signs have not weight. But in any case, I rather deal with the legal consequences you are talking about than ending killed by a psycho. Your life, your choice.
    "The Second Amendment: America's Original Homeland Security"

  8. #83
    VIP Member Array 9MMare's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GM View Post
    I do not know the answer to your question, I guess that it depends of the state there you are; here in FL those signs have not weight. But in any case, I rather deal with the legal consequences you are talking about than ending killed by a psycho. Your life, your choice.

    Why did the business owner/company post the signs? Because they didnt want guns in their business.

    Do I agree with them? Not in most instances. Is it my business? No, it's theirs. Carrying on their premises is disrespectul of their wishes and rights as a property owner. And pretty much everyone here is complaining about how they are disrespectful of ours.

    Hypocrisy.
    Fortune favors the bold.

    Freedom doesn't mean safe, it means free.

    The thing about "defense" is that it has practically nothing to do with guns. (As passed on by CCW9MM)

  9. #84
    Member Array FknRa's Avatar
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    I do not carry on schools or in federal buildings.

    concealed is concealed and I accept the consequences of my actions.
    To those that paid for my freedom,
    I WILL NEVER FORGET.

    As with all statements I've made and All that I will make, please check your local laws to verify accuracy. (and if i'm wrong let me know as I like to be right in the future) After all I'm just some goofball posting on an internet forum.

  10. #85
    Senior Member Array Joshua M. Smith's Avatar
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    In Indiana, the signs can be ignored as there is no law about posting them.

    If a business catches you carrying and they don't want you to do so, they can ask you to leave and remove the pistol or don't come back. If you do not, you are in violation of trespass law - nothing more or less.

    Josh

  11. #86
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    Quote Originally Posted by mlr1m View Post
    To say property owners or anyone else gets their rights from the citizens of a state or the government is scary. These were rights they were born with but later stripped away by the government while we stood by and just watched or in some cases cheered. If their rights can be taken from them are yours safe?
    Believe me, I am all for the concept of property rights... I think they [would] lay the foundation for many good things. But to willingly participate in a society which doesn't value absolute property rights is not exactly the same as having God given rights "stripped away by the government...", is it?

    It is better described as a mutually beneficial agreement. As someone mentioned previously, a few (9MMare, for example) are attempting to have their cake, and eat it too -- they want to enjoy the benefits of the particular society they participate in, but also want to claim the rights that were ceded as the cost of membership in society. You can't have it both ways. The logical solution would be to restructure society around absolute property rights.

    Quote Originally Posted by 9MMare View Post
    Goodness, do you hear yourself? It is indeed trespassing....a law completely enforceable if you are caught & dont leave. The fact that you conceal the weapon only means that you are able to hide the fact you are doing so.
    You could carry a howitzer past a sign and it simply could not be construed as 'trespassing' until you are asked to leave. If a property owner does not screen people for firearms before he admits them to his property, he does so because he is well aware that it will have a negative affect on his business. The choice is his and I do not pity him for choosing money over principles.

    Quote Originally Posted by 9MMare View Post
    Please....do what you want but dont deny it and place your choices above the property owners'. It's disrespectful.

    I make no attempt to stand taller...I'm not the one snickering and pretending I dont see signs...or declaring my rights more important than someone elses...as many here in this thread do.
    You keep repeating the mantra that a property owner's rights are being violated when an unenforceable sign is ignored. This is not the case. In the majority of states, a property owner has no more right to ban guns with a sign than he has to ban Buddhists. The right doesn't exist in most states, and if we agree to live in such a society then we have nothing to complain about.

  12. #87
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    Quote Originally Posted by 9MMare View Post
    Why did the business owner/company post the signs? Because they didnt want guns in their business.

    Do I agree with them? Not in most instances. Is it my business? No, it's theirs. Carrying on their premises is disrespectul of their wishes and rights as a property owner. And pretty much everyone here is complaining about how they are disrespectful of ours.

    Hypocrisy.
    You talk about laws that do not exist, and when I ask you to please post them so we other can read them you ignore it. However, you still continue arguing and talking about hypocrisy. You have a very interesting ways of interpreting our Constitution. I am out of this one.
    "The Second Amendment: America's Original Homeland Security"

  13. #88
    Senior Member Array camsdaddy's Avatar
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    Though I respect the business owners opinion. I am under the understanding that her in Ga the signs carry no weight. I do however believe my wallet and my firearm go together. I choose to spend money with those who agree with me. I choose to frequent places that have the same values as I do. If you dont want my firearm in your store that is fine but you dont want my business. I dont carry in courthouses etc but thats only because thats the only legal brothel in town where a guy can legally get raped.

  14. #89
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    Quote Originally Posted by OlJim View Post
    For those of you who say you disregard the "No Firearms Allowed" signs, would you also disregard the "No Shoes, No Shirt, No Service" or "No Animals except Service Animals" signs. How about a "NO Hunting" or "No Trespassing" sign? How about "Not an exit or "Stop"?
    Do you disregard all signs or do you pick and choose? It's not a question of legality it's a question of common courtesy.




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    Completely different, as all the examples you set involve things readily seen or known by others. Anyone can see you have an animal with you (assuming it isn't a concealed mouse or the like) or can see you are hunting or entering onto a piece of land, etc.

    A concealed firearm is not, by definition, readily seen by others, and the owner of the business would have to intrude into your privacy to determine it's presence. Merely entering into an open business conveys no such right to the business owner.

    Matt
    Battle Plan (n) - a list of things that aren't going to happen if you are attacked.
    Blame it on Sixto - now that is a viable plan.

  15. #90
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    Property owners' rights have limits.

    For example, the owner of a business may not say "No wheelchairs" or "No Whites". Why not? Because the law of the land does not give them the power to do so, or in some cases expressly forbids it.

    Now in Florida, the state has licensed me to carry a firearm concealed on or about my person. The law in Florida which permits me to do so also does not provide any force of law to a "no firearms" sign. In fact, the law excludes such postings by leaving them off the prohibited places list.

    So the law has limited the property owner's rights, and when I exercise my right to carry a firearm on my person as defined under the law I am not infringing the property owner's rights when I do so, since the state has already abrogated that "right".

    Matt
    Battle Plan (n) - a list of things that aren't going to happen if you are attacked.
    Blame it on Sixto - now that is a viable plan.

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