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Interesting shoot no shoot at the local Wally World.

5K views 37 replies 26 participants last post by  bladenbullet 
#1 ·
We had an incident at a WalMart here in Maine a couple weeks ago. Crazy lady asks to see a gun at the gun counter and turns it on the clerk. Now imagine some poor guy/gal out on their wally walk and they come around the corner and see this situation. I have run through it a few times and it could have been a very bad outcome for the woman. What do you think would happen to a person who drew down and shot the lady. Some on here indicate that they would not ask questions before shooting.I am sure the action of the clerk would have supplied enough info to give a person with a CCW some indication of whether he was indeed in danger. But what are the chances the lady got some ammo off the shelf and loaded the gun. Interesting real life scenario, have at it folks.

Outcome was security and the local PD managed to subdue her and she was carted off to the loony farm. This occurred on the same day a granny was caught with a gun at the Federal Building. She was looking for the post office and had forgotten to take her gun off when she left home.
 
#2 ·
I would say that it depends a lot on the demeanor of the woman, and whether or not you saw how the whole event unfolded. If I were to walk around the corner and see her with her gun pointed in some ones face then she is probably going to be shot. If I saw her ask for the gun then point it at the sales clerk then I know its not loaded, I would call the police immediately while keeping a very close eye on her and a hand on my gun, if any ammo shows up she's going down.
 
#27 ·
I would say that it depends a lot on the demeanor of the woman, and whether or not you saw how the whole event unfolded. If I were to walk around the corner and see her with her gun pointed in some ones face then she is probably going to be shot. If I saw her ask for the gun then point it at the sales clerk then I know its not loaded, I would call the police immediately while keeping a very close eye on her and a hand on my gun, if any ammo shows up she's going down.

:haha:
 
#3 ·
Most that have taken a gun safety class or those that understand ROE or "use of force" would never shoot to protect another without at leat a "drop the gun", Im sure the salesman would have said the gun was unloaded, but the presence of a CC with his gun drawn might have made a diference.

However, no mater how well meaning it may be of a CC to take action, things would definatly be complicated when the first LE officer shows up.
 
#4 ·
Crazy lady asks to see a gun at the gun counter and turns it on the clerk.
I would say that it depends a lot on the demeanor of the woman, and whether or not you saw how the whole event unfolded.
Exactly.

The LAST thing I'm going to presume is that a crime is in progress, simply due to an apparent customer being handed a gun and then aiming it in the direction of the clerk. I mean, at many gun stores I've been to, this is standard practice by many of the customers on any given day.

Everything depends on what is seen and heard, the supporting circumstances. For example:

  • Did I see the entire exchange, so that I know under what circumstances a gun came to be in the hand of the "customer"?
  • What is the demeanor of each actor, in the scene?
  • What is being said, is it a credible threat?
  • What corroborates the credible threat? Why?
  • Your "take" on it is that the "customer" appeared "crazy." Well, her actions and words either do or don't corroborate the threat.

Without answers to these types of questions, I would absolutely need to await the outcome. Heck, I have personally had a dozen instances of other customers turning gun muzzles in my direction while they perused them at the counter. I've even had a couple different clerks do the same. Did it once myself to a clerk, though immediately caught and corrected the error. A lot of pieces would need to fall into place to assure me it was a crime in progress. As with most violent attacks on others.

Which brings us to the crux: you can't really know a person with a gun is a threat until the crime is occurring. Before then, it can be an incredible leap of faith as to whether you've misinterpreted things or correctly read them. Though, when it's clear, it can be absolutely crystal clear the moment you realize things are going sideways.
 
#5 ·
No way Jose... I would immediately digress behind cover and call 9-1-1. I’m soOoo blessed that problems come to me via email, snail mail or the dreaded phone calls. I sure don’t need to go out of my way to take on more stuff, that I don’t want, nor can I afford. Conversely, I can’t always legislate my actions in that I inherently want to help someone in need. Still, I would air on the side of restraint and be a good observer if at all possible.
 
#8 ·
My WW doesn't have trigger locks but the only ammo available is several paces away and its hunting shot. I'm wondering something, that if the clerk just handed it to her and knew it was unloaded ( yeah sorta iffy) why not just jump the counter grab the gun and beat her with it?
 
#9 ·
Draw, aim, command, "DROP THE GUN NOW!" Anything but compliance has bad consequences. Also, the clerk should be yelling - "It's not loaded, it's not loaded!" And why isn't he grabbing it away from her?

Too many unknown variables to really make a call on this one.
 
#10 ·
We had an incident at a WalMart here in Maine a couple weeks ago. Crazy lady asks to see a gun at the gun counter and turns it on the clerk.
Draw, aim, command, "DROP THE GUN NOW!" Anything but compliance has bad consequences.
Really? For what crime? An unloaded gun is handed to the customer and the muzzle is then "turned on the clerk" (by another person's description). That justifies being drawn on, and then commanded to follow orders else she gets shot?

Just wondering about the logic and justifiability, here.
 
#13 ·
So pointing a firearm at another person can be considered assault.

Was this woman simply being careless or was she actively trying to intimidate the clerk with the gun?

They have trigger locks on everything at WW here and the employees don't even have the keys. I would guess the manager has them locked up somewhere.
 
#15 ·
Forget what the actual outcome was and go off the beaten path for a moment.

If you walked in on this and know the clerk handed her the gun. You would more than likely believe the gun was empty. But in my twisted analytical mind I would wonder, could these two be acting in concert to rip off the store? Did the clerk load the gun for her before the incident started in case they were cornered?

Often enough an insider helps in some way with the outsider playing the role as the bad guy and the insider just doing their job. Everything isn't always as it seems.
 
#17 ·
Crazy lady asks to see a gun at the gun counter and turns it on the clerk.
I have never been in a WM that didn't have the action padlocked open on every gun in the display case.

You go on ahead and play batman if you want let us know how that works out for you
 
#18 ·
WM incident

One cannot assume that the gun is unloaded just because they lock up the ammo (that is, when they have it). Without previous knowledge, you just came around the corner and saw a woman holding a gun on a clerk, what would you think? I would make tracks in the opposite direction and call the LEOs. Then observe at a safe distance.

A few years ago, a man walked into a Sports Authority style store in the lower level of the mall. He went to the gun counter and asked to see a .357. So, the clerk hands him a Colt Python Hunter. The man reaches into his pocket, has ammo, and loads the gun. He pointed at the clerk and said he'll take it. The clerk of course, called 911. He walked out and was nearly a quarter mile away when the local cops found him. Then He pointed it at 2 cops who shot him 9 times.
The dude wanted to commit suicide by cops

BTW, that store stopped selling firearms at that location the next week.
 
#20 ·
First off witch wally was it in maine? our local wally here in Palmyra has ammo on the shelve I think it may be just shotgun rounds but I thought it may be rifle as well? But in any event the lady could have brought a pocket full of ammo for all we know. Hard call it would be one of those that I would have to be there
 
#21 ·
We had an incident at a WalMart here in Maine a couple weeks ago. Crazy lady asks to see a gun at the gun counter and turns it on the clerk. Now imagine some poor guy/gal out on their wally walk and they come around the corner and see this situation. I have run through it a few times and it could have been a very bad outcome for the woman. What do you think would happen to a person who drew down and shot the lady. Some on here indicate that they would not ask questions before shooting.I am sure the action of the clerk would have supplied enough info to give a person with a CCW some indication of whether he was indeed in danger. But what are the chances the lady got some ammo off the shelf and loaded the gun. Interesting real life scenario, have at it folks.
Outcome was security and the local PD managed to subdue her and she was carted off to the loony farm. This occurred on the same day a granny was caught with a gun at the Federal Building. She was looking for the post office and had forgotten to take her gun off when she left home.
Wow where did this take place? I live in Maine myself I'm quite curious as to where this took place. Now with the scenario if I could I would try to subdue the person with means other than lethal force as much as possible. Probably try to take the gun away and if I had to some strikes to the hands and arms with my carry light should do the trick real fast. Shooting is a absolute last resort for me. I don't really want to take a human life. Glad it turned out ok though. :bier:
 
#26 ·
Wow where did this take place? I live in Maine myself I'm quite curious as to where this took place.

Well it was either Augusta or Waterville, I know the old lady with the gun was in Augusta but I can't remember if the other was also in Augusta, I am leaning towards Waterville.
 
#23 ·
Well.... if she's yelling "on the floor sucker" , or "I'll shoot".... that may be a clue. LMAO.
 
#25 ·
Let me clarify the lady was using the gun as a weapon on the clerk, it was not an incidental pointing, and she is actually crazy. I would imagine the clerk would have immediately told you the gun was empty and he/she was probably not acting very scared. Obviously if you saw the whole thing go down you would know what was up. I agree that it is imperative that an assessment of the situation be made before anyone gets shot.
 
#28 ·
I'm gonna think some moron has no firearms safety training,and watch to see whats happening,If Lady is yelling robbery commands etc then I may intervene,might be a really good idea to call the po po and be a good witness
 
#29 ·
Im going to jump into the bat mobile and do NOTHING, but call 911 a get to a safe spot.
 
#32 ·
Why isn't chocolate considered a vegetable, if chocolate comes from cocoa
beans, and all beans are a vegetable?
Beans are not veggies. Beans are legumes, and IIRC they are sometimes included in the Meats and Protiens food group.
 
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