Carrying where alcohol is served?

Carrying where alcohol is served?

This is a discussion on Carrying where alcohol is served? within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; OK....I know some states, including SC, you can't carry where alcohol is served. But in SC they can't serve alcohol on Sunday. Does that mean ...

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Thread: Carrying where alcohol is served?

  1. #1
    Distinguished Member Array REVMAN's Avatar
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    Carrying where alcohol is served?

    OK....I know some states, including SC, you can't carry where alcohol is served. But in SC they can't serve alcohol on Sunday. Does that mean you can carry on Sundays? I'm sure you can't but just something that I thought of today while in a Olive Garden for lunch with my family.
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    Ex Member Array Treo's Avatar
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    That's a good question my non legal opinion would be that on Sunday you're not in a place that serves alcohol. That said, you might really want to run it by a lawyer

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    VIP Member Array NC Bullseye's Avatar
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    Usually the wording is to the effect:
    In any place where alcoholic beverages are sold and consumed.

    They don't say :

    In any place where alcoholic beverages are being sold and consumed.

    It doesn't specify that it's only in effect while the business is actively doing it, only that the business does it.

    The same holds true for educational property. It doesn't have to be when students are present, it's off limits ALL of the time. (this is for NC)

    When in doubt it's best not to.

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    New Member Array LACopper's Avatar
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    I guess it's just the crazy Kalifornian in me, but I didn't know there were still places where you can't serve alcohol on Sunday. What a dumb law.

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    My guess would be, "No!"...that's shaving 'hairs', and I would not experiment.OMOYMV
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    I agree with most of the others, they purposely left it as a period statement so their would be no confusion as to certain days when alcohol was not served or sold such as when school was in session or not, if you make it period, there is no question.

    Just my view, I would definitiely ask though.
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    What I hate are these states that give some percentage of business income derived from sale of alcohol, etc. Who knows that crap before they walk in.

    In FL, CC in a "bar or tavern" is prohibited. In a restuarant that serves alcohol, you cannot sit in the area intended mainly for serving alcohol, such as the bar. Sitting at a table is allowed with CC. We don't have to ask the owner to produce last year's income sheet to see if we can come in.

    So if I want to eat at John Doe's "Bar & Grill," I don't carry. Olive garden? I'm walking in and taking a booth. No problem.

    Since you didn't quote SC's exact wording on its law, I won't offer an opinion as to whether your case is legal or not.
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    In Arizona we could only carry guns where alcohol is served since September of last year but we can't drink at all. Since business owners aren't getting any revenue from CCW holders in the form of alcohol sales, they don't have an incentive not to post signage against us. Most of the places that were off limits before the law took effect are still off limits for that reason.

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    My guess would be that you can't carry there, even on Sunday. Even though they are not serving alcohol at the time, they are still a location that serves alcohol for consumption. Just like a school is still a school (for carrying purposes) even when classes are not being held and no students are present. IANAL
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    Distinguished Member Array BlueNinjaGo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OldVet View Post
    Who knows that crap before they walk in.
    Texans do. Any business who gets more than half of their income from alcohol sales consumed on the premises, must post a certain sign in a highly visible area. No sign = no worries.
    Last edited by BlueNinjaGo; February 1st, 2010 at 11:53 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by OldVet View Post
    Who knows that crap before they walk in.
    You had better know that crap, that CCW permit in your wallet "requires" you to know and obey the law.

    But back on topic, don't walk the fine line of "they don't sell alcohol on Sunday" that is just asking for trouble, but if you really want to test it, then drive 40 mph in a posted 15 mph school zone on a weekend and try to fight your way out of a ticket based on the fact that school is not in sesion.

    One thing I can say they did right in Washington is the wording, state law says "unlawfully to carry in any area off limits to persons under the age of 21", this includes the adult section of restaurants and bars
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    Distinguished Member Array Rugergirl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OldVet View Post
    What I hate are these states that give some percentage of business income derived from sale of alcohol, etc. Who knows that crap before they walk in.

    In FL, CC in a "bar or tavern" is prohibited. In a restuarant that serves alcohol, you cannot sit in the area intended mainly for serving alcohol, such as the bar. Sitting at a table is allowed with CC. We don't have to ask the owner to produce last year's income sheet to see if we can come in.

    So if I want to eat at John Doe's "Bar & Grill," I don't carry. Olive garden? I'm walking in and taking a booth. No problem.

    Since you didn't quote SC's exact wording on its law, I won't offer an opinion as to whether your case is legal or not.
    Worse yet is Michigan law that does not specify a percent, only that alcohol sales(consumed on the premises, by the glass) are not the PRIMARY source of income. Now does the local bowling alley, for example sell more alcohol, than they do food, or lane rentals, or entertainment. Does Hooter's sell more food, or alcohol or merchandise? No percentage to go by just the primary source of income, try figuring that one out on your own. If in doubt, don't carry. And in Michigan the legal limit for DUI is 0.08 while the legal limit for carrying is 0.02 blood alcohol by percent.
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    Distinguished Member Array BlueNinjaGo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mic View Post
    then drive 40 mph in a posted 15 mph school zone on a weekend and try to fight your way out of a ticket based on the fact that school is not in session.
    I do it all the time. We have either signs with times posted or signs with flashing lights. It's usually 30 minutes before and after school starts, and 30 minutes before and after school lets out. No need to have a slow driving area when kids are in the classroom.

    Lights aren't flashing then it's not considered a school zone. If the lights are flashing on a holiday when school is not in session, then it's not a school zone. I double checked with my LEO buddy and he agreed. If a cop gives you a ticket then a judge will throw it out.


    But to the original point, don't push it. Ask a few LEO's and/or lawyers for more reliable feedback.

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    Quote Originally Posted by LACopper View Post
    I guess it's just the crazy Kalifornian in me, but I didn't know there were still places where you can't serve alcohol on Sunday. What a dumb law.
    These are blue laws. They're usually regulated by the local municipalities, but I guess SC is different.

    They're not as common as they were about 20 years ago, but they do still exist.
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    For everyones' info here the SC statute in question:
    SECTION 16‑23‑465. Additional penalty for unlawfully carrying pistol or firearm into business selling alcoholic liquors, beers or wines for on‑premises consumption.
    In addition to the penalties provided for by Sections 16‑11‑330 and 16‑23‑460 and by Article 1 of Chapter 23 of Title 16, a person convicted of carrying a pistol or firearm into a business which sells alcoholic liquor, beer, or wine for consumption on the premises is guilty of a misdemeanor and, upon conviction, must be fined not more than two thousand dollars or imprisoned not more than three years, or both.

    That seems pretty cut and dried. They "sell" alcohol for comsumption, at least 6 out of 7 days a week. The law doesn't state "except on Sundays.) I'm no lawyer, so I don't know if there has been any other previous cases on this in SC court to determine how that law applies if the establishment is not actively "selling" alcohol at the time (Sundays).

    So if "most post a certain sign in a highly visible area," in Texas, but not all, then there's still room for doubt. Then eeback to my original complaint: How doe John Doe know what % of income is from sale of alcohol? Too much gray.

    And Mic, here in FL, school zone speeds only apply when lights are blinking or at certain times when kids are going to/from school, not during holidays, weekends, summer, etc. I lived in WA and they don't apply when school is not in session.

    I do know the laws here (FL), and it states "bars and taverns" are prohibited from CC specifically. My complaint is that in other states the CCer should be required to know how much of business' income is alcohol based. Like Rugergirl said, how much of a bowling centers income is alcohol based? Their accountant might know, but the guy on the street?
    Retired USAF E-8. Lighten up and enjoy life because:
    Paranoia strikes deep, into your heart it will creep. It starts when you're always afraid... Buffalo Springfield - For What It's Worth

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