February 11th, 2010 10:06 AM
About Statute 930 Possession of firearms and dangerous weapons in Federal facility
Before all of you crucify me please let me say that I know that CCing in Federal buildings is illegal, and for that reason I WILL NEVER DO IT! Ok, just to make sure … I AM NOT ASKING IF I AM ALLOWED TO CONCEAL A FIREARM ON A GOVERNMENT PROPERTY. Here is my question: when reading the statute about it I am not sure that I know how to correctly interpret a subsection; Statute 930 Possession of firearms and dangerous weapons in Federal facilities, Subsection (d) (3), at http://www.joebrower.com/RKBA/RKBA_F...FFRRG_2000.pdf, (almost at the end of Title 18 chapter 44, which is the first one).
§ 930. Possession of firearms and dangerous weapons in Federal facilities
(a) Except as provided in subsection (d), whoever knowingly possesses or causes to be present a firearm or other dangerous weapon in a Federal facility (other than a Federal court facility), or attempts to do so, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than 1 year, or both.
(b) Whoever, with intent that a firearm or other dangerous weapon be used in the commission of a crime, knowingly possesses or causes to be present such firearm or dangerous weapon in a Federal facility, or attempts to do so, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than 5 years, or both.
(c) A person who kills or attempts to kill any person in the course of a violation of subsection (a) or (b), or in the course of an attack on a Federal facility involving the use of a firearm or other dangerous weapon, shall be punished as provided in sections 1111, 1112, and 1113.
(d) Subsection (a) shall not apply to -
(1) the lawful performance of official duties by an officer, agent, or employee of the United States, a State, or a political subdivision thereof, who is authorized by law to engage in or supervise the prevention, detection, investigation, or prosecution of any violation of law;
(2) the possession of a firearm or other dangerous weapon by a Federal official
or a member of the Armed Forces if such possession is authorized by law; or
(3) the lawful carrying of firearms or other dangerous weapons in a Federal facility incident to hunting or other lawful purposes.
I am not referring to officers, agents, etc., authorized by law. Does this subsection imply that if the firearm or weapon is “incident to hunting or other lawful purposes” then the individual will not be prosecuted?
"The Second Amendment: America's Original Homeland Security"
February 11th, 2010 11:54 AM
"Federal facility" include lands not just buildings.
There is legal hunting of some "Federal facility."
OMHO, that's all this is talking about.
To the best of my knowledge RKBA, self-protection, etc has not (yet) been found to be a "other lawful purpose" except where spelled out in statute or regulation -- e.g. such as NFS and soon to be NPS, to name a couple.
I'm just one root in a grassroots organization. No one should assume that I speak for the VCDL.
I am neither an attorney-at-law nor I do play one on television or on the internet. No one should assumes my opinion is legal advice.
Veni, Vidi, Velcro
February 11th, 2010 02:52 PM
"Federal Facility" does not include lands.
Originally Posted by DaveH
As far as the RKBA etc. being "other lawful purpose", I agree, from all the previous threads on the subject, nobody seems to have found any definitive evidence that it qualifies.
18 CFR 930 (g) As used in this section:
(1) The term “Federal facility” means a building or part thereof
owned or leased by the Federal Government, where Federal employees are regularly present for the purpose of performing their official duties.
February 11th, 2010 03:14 PM
It means that if you are bringing in a .22lr pistol with a suppressor on it because the Federal Judge walked into his office one morning, and saw a big racoon on his desk eating his M&M's, and told his clerk to call "Rat Rambos" and have that thing killed and the building exterminated NOW...
You'd be cool.
February 11th, 2010 03:20 PM
Is there a definition or list somewhere of what does qualify as "other lawful purpose"? That would answer a lot of questions.
February 11th, 2010 04:01 PM
"Other lawful purpose" means that one has to have a relatively specific purpose, like hunting. A vague desire for the ability to defend one's self against an unknown and highly speculative threat is probably not going to hold up in a U.S.District Court (though I think it should, particularly in light of recent statutory changes and the Heller case - I'm talking practical effect, not "should").
The definition of "federal facilities" means ONLY buildings where federal employees (not concessionaires or contractors) regularly do whatever it is they do for the Government. An outhouse in a park is not a "federal facility", but the ranger station is.
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Nothing I say as "user" should be taken as either advertising for attorney services or legal advice. Legal questions should be presented to a competent attorney licensed to practice in the relevant state.
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