Would force have been ok to us here?
This is a discussion on Would force have been ok to us here? within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Originally Posted by tiwee
When they are covering the group, it is not imminent for an individual. At that point, they are going to shoot ...
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February 18th, 2010 11:24 AM
I have to disagree with you here. I believe it is imminent for EVERY INDIVIDUAL.
Originally Posted by tiwee
Are you willing to wait until he pulls the trigger when the gun is pointed at the person next to you? What if the gun is pointed at you when he decides to start the killing?
By the time the focus narrows to one individual it is too late. Whether it is you or someone else.
"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants."
February 18th, 2010 11:27 AM
Tough call. It's so easy to say shoot when you're not there. I honestly can't answer until I'm in that situation. I (or anyone else) can talk the talk, but when it comes right down to it--at that time, in that incident, under those situations--will we walk the walk?
You'll never really know until it happens.
Retired USAF E-8. Curmudgeon at large. Lighten up and enjoy life because:
Paranoia strikes deep, into your life it will creep. It starts when you're always afraid...
Buffalo Springfield - For What It's Worth
February 18th, 2010 11:33 AM
who are you?...jack bauer?...each episode is one hour of the day so youre gonna need to make it last longer than that...
Originally Posted by Tye_Defender
February 18th, 2010 11:56 AM
I just hope none of us are ever in that situation. If it does come, I hope all of our proposed courses of action are successful.
February 18th, 2010 12:03 PM
Or the other could be enraged and kill everyone else after you. Or the guy you hit could keep firing and hit innocents. Or someone may see you draw and scream and totally destroy your element of surprise......
Originally Posted by Tye_Defender
Against the odds that bank robbers generally dont kill.
I also found the comment about 'controlling' the situation unrealistic and scary. Once you fire....you have no more control over that situation....you just introduced more variables.
Fortune favors the bold.
Freedom doesn't mean safe, it means free.
The thing about "defense" is that it has practically nothing to do with guns. (As passed on by CCW9MM)
February 18th, 2010 12:03 PM
It's a decision that must be made on an individual basis. If someone was carrying but didn't act and I got killed, I wouldn't blame them (well, I'd be dead but that's beside the fact). The blame lies soley with the bad guys.
Each individual has to size up the situation and what actions they are willing to take depending on so many different factors, there's no way to say what someone should do until they are in that situation.
One thing that always sticks in my mind is a Subway (the sub store) robbery here many year ago where the security tape showed the clerk did everything the two robbers asked, gave them the money and totally cooperated with them. The robbers left the store, a half second later one of them walked back in shot and killed the clerk. This image has stuck in my mind every since it happened more than a decade ago. Because of this, I would like to think I'd draw and shoot, but in all actuality I can't say I would even draw if actually in that situation. It would depend on too many factors going on at that instant (including fear) that there's no way say what I'd do.
February 18th, 2010 12:05 PM
It sounds like you saw Rob Pincus on tv the other night. What you said was almost verbatum what he said. lol. I do agree as well!
Originally Posted by 21bubba
S&W M&P 9C
COLT DET. SPEC.
"If you find yourself in a fair fight, your tactics suck", Author un-known
February 18th, 2010 12:35 PM
After viewing the pics a few times IMHO there is not enough solid information for me to voice an opinion.
If he was brandishing a gun and I am able to get to cover unnoticed. I would wait him out with my gun drawn.
Member:USCCA, NRA, GOA, WVCDL
U.S. Navy vet 1955-1959, USS Dashiell DD 659. Glock 19, Ruger LCP, Ruger .357 Mag.
When you are at the end of your rope, tie a knot and hang on.
February 18th, 2010 12:48 PM
Small side trip here guys. It all depends on your state's laws. Here in Oklahoma it's not against the law to carry in a bank. The manager/owner can put up no gun signs but legally those mean just about squat.
Originally Posted by Jsanchez
However if you carried into a bank that had a no gun sign and opened fire on a robber, you might open yourself up to a civil liability suit from the bank for breaking their policies, however legal action from the state is highly unlikely. At least regarding your carrying into the establishment.
WARNING: This post may contain material offensive to those who lack wit, humor, common sense and/or supporting factual or anecdotal evidence. All statements and assertions contained herein may be subject to literary devices not limited to: irony, metaphor, allusion and dripping sarcasm.
February 18th, 2010 01:05 PM
Davensquirt's response is the ONLY smart move in these situations: The chances of these A-holes actually executing everyone in the bank is very slim, but the chances of you getting injured/killed while "protecting" the bank's money is HUGE.
Originally Posted by Davensquirt
And heaven forbid if the shoot-out that you began results in an innocent party's death; whether it's from your own bullets, or from one of the POS cockroach's weapons.
February 18th, 2010 01:08 PM
By what is seen in photos I think I would wait to see what happened. With two armed BGs I would be outgunned.
So I would wait to see if they start shooting, then get involved if I could.
Hopefully, I wouldn't be shot first and would have time to be effective.
Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other"
February 18th, 2010 01:47 PM
Whenever I go to the bank I am very SA.
I check out the parking lot with a quick scan.
Upon entering the bank I take a second or so and scan everyone and everything, looking for anything out of norm.
While doing business at counter or offices I keep a eye on door if possible and stay SA.
When leaving bank again scan parking lot and leave promptly.
As to CC in bank it is allowed in Texas.
As to defensive shooting and this video it is hard to know what should have been done or could have been done.
As someone else said, anyone pulled a gun is threatening others lives and in some way should be dealt with.
NOT LIVING IN FEAR, JUST READY!!!
I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness,
nor the arrow for its swiftness,
nor the warrior for his glory.
I love only that which they defend.
February 18th, 2010 01:59 PM
Sorry, but who is Rob Pincus?
Originally Posted by joecs1
February 18th, 2010 02:06 PM
February 18th, 2010 02:15 PM
My initial thought is based on my years of military training, take the threat out immediately. However, my actions in a setting like that will be dependent upon the many variables that can occur in this situation.
There's no way I'll know exactly what I'll do until I'm presented with that situation. I only hope a combination of what I've been trained mixed with good ole common sense would get me through this scenario unscathed.
Reading everyone's posts on this forum regarding "what we would do" scenarios is great food for thought. I love seeing things from other peoples perspective.
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