Do you trust OTHER people W/ guns?

This is a discussion on Do you trust OTHER people W/ guns? within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Nope, I do not trust anyone until they prove they are safe....I hope they treat me the same way....

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Thread: Do you trust OTHER people W/ guns?

  1. #76
    Member Array partsscout's Avatar
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    Nope, I do not trust anyone until they prove they are safe....I hope they treat me the same way.

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  3. #77
    Senior Member Array dldeuce's Avatar
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    Wow, what a surprise! Nothing like a good dose of defensivecarry.com hypocrisy huh?

  4. #78
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    Depends on what is happening and how someone else is handling their gun.

    Yes, I would like a no permit needed system. Bad guys carry without a permit
    anyway.

  5. #79
    Ex Member Array Treo's Avatar
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    Let’s take the permit question out of the mix for a second.
    One of the best examples I can think of it this most gun shows don’t allow loaded weapons inside, every time the topic comes up someone (and sometimes it’s me) says that they ignore the rule for themselves but understand why it’s in place it applies to those other idiots who don’t know not to draw their CCW to check a holster

  6. #80
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    Treo, for some of us guns are banned at shows per state law, charge admission, public building, take your pick. But then I don't shop at gun shows. I shop at local stores that let me carry. And clear a weapon to check a holster or anything else. I would not spend my money at a gun shop that denied my right to carry. I'm in more danger driving there than any idiot at a store will put me in. And if they make me that nervous I can just walk out. I don't have to be present while they take advantage of their right in a reckless manner.
    I prefer to live dangerously free than safely caged!

    "Our houses are protected by the good Lord and a gun. And you might meet 'em both if you show up here not welcome son." Josh Thompson "Way Out Here"

  7. #81
    VIP Member Array 9MMare's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Treo View Post
    Letís take the permit question out of the mix for a second.
    One of the best examples I can think of it this most gun shows donít allow loaded weapons inside, every time the topic comes up someone (and sometimes itís me) says that they ignore the rule for themselves but understand why itís in place it applies to those other idiots who donít know not to draw their CCW to check a holster
    I'll take a stab at it. Going about normal daily life...I dont see people's guns and they arent using them or even thinking about them for the most part. The guns are 'not in play.'

    When I go to the range, I am often concerned when I see how people are handling their guns...often not according to the 4 rules for instance. With many guns being handled all the time, the odds of an accident go up proportionally, just like the difference between driving along a side street and trying to negotiate rush hour traffic when many fools are zipping in and out of lanes.

    I see a gun show as similar if people are carrying. Lots of chatting, showing off guns, trying holsters, bringing them out, putting them away, and very few 'safe' directions in which to point a gun when you bring it out to drop the magazine, etc. (Just for a few examples). Lots of distractions, lots of opportunities to forget if a gun is loaded or unloaded. Lots of guns in play, so the odds of accidents goes up. If loaded guns were allowed, I would need to seriously consider how often I attended.

    Another questionable venue for me is sporting events and stadiums. People have too often demonstrated severely poor judgement and restraint in such environs. I think it's perfectly fine for a venue to decide to search people and forbid guns if they choose. And this would give me the choice of attending such an event.

    So for me....I'm all for no permits, but believe that there are reasonable instances where restricting guns (or loaded guns) exists.

    btw....try comparing a 'fender bender' to a 'negligent discharge' and an injury accident with being shot. How many of us have experienced those vehicle incidents in our lifetimes?
    Fortune favors the bold.

    Freedom doesn't mean safe, it means free.

    The thing about "defense" is that it has practically nothing to do with guns. (As passed on by CCW9MM)

  8. #82
    Senior Member Array Avenger's Avatar
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    Ok, here the thing, I trust everyone. I trust everyone with the basics. I trust that person wont run me off the road, even though sometimes that person may be drunk and just might try and kill me. Or the stranger standing in line behind me at the bank, I dont know if he is going to pull out a sawed-off shotgun out of his long trench coat and try and rob the place. But I trust that he wont, he is a normal everyday, run of the mill guy just like me.

    However, throw in firearms. Now this trust gets a bit leery. Its a judgment call. If someone enters my home with a firearm, and I see it, I am probably going to say something and my alert level just went up. I wont make him disarm or anything. My friends all carry, now I trust them, but I dont know their friends who they bring out shooting with us. I trust the fact they know what they are doing, but I am more aware of what exactly that is. I watch them, and I am ready. However, when we go shooting, since I am the senior instructor at my place of work, I am the range SO and I take charge of everyone.

    If I am walking down the street or in the mall or something and someone looses control of his firearm, probably due to a bad holsters set up or something, and his firearm drops to the ground. I wont pick it up, but I would say something like "you might want to get that set-up fixed. Here is my card, come to my class." and move on. People carry, I trust them. I trust the would be BG to use proper firearm handling techniques when he is robbing the gas station. But as soon as he puts my life or my familys lives in danger, or anyone else puts them or I in danger.... boom. Trust issue over.

  9. #83
    VIP Member Array ccw9mm's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Treo View Post
    Letís take the permit question out of the mix for a second.
    So, that changes the scenario to:

    "Irrespective of CHL licensing, do you trust other people, people that you donít know or people that do things that, while legal, you disagree with , with a gun?"


    A relatively pointless bureaucratic licensing program has little to do with stupidity and safety, aside from its basic nature, that is.

    I would like to think that I'll always consider unsafe actions unsafe, and incredibly stupid actions what they are, and that it won't matter if I later find out that person was or wasn't licensed to carry a deadly weapon. Safe is safe. Stupid is stupid. So long as people aren't engaging in what most any child can understand as unsafe and ill-advised behaviors, then I generally don't have a problem with it.

    Many have said it well already, and I am in agreement. Basically, that: the moment the lives of others are put at risk due to the actions or stupidity of someone, then "others" will have much to say about it and whether it continues.

    A basic level of courtesy, respect and trust is afforded to anyone. Being human justifies that, I feel. However, that only goes so far. A permissions process by governing bureaucrats doesn't change that a bit. People earn the degree of comfort and trust from others, via what's known about their thinking, their actions, their consideration for the safety and rights of others. Fail to earn that, and you'll find that other folks will start exercising their right to be absent, their right to stop you, or their right to make you absent (if the action is severe to have become a serious threat to life and limb).
    Your best weapon is your brain. Don't leave home without it.
    Thoughts: Justifiable self defense (A.O.J.).
    Explain: How does disarming victims reduce the number of victims?
    Reason over Force: The Gun is Civilization (Marko Kloos).
    NRA, SAF, GOA, OFF, ACLDN.

  10. #84
    Member Array Zach and Holly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hopyard View Post
    Every day I trust all the other drivers to do the right thing at the right time. I know many don't, and I have been hit by a drunk driver as well. Still I drive.

    I do not favor VT style; except in theory. In theory it is great. HOWEVER,

    In reality I like the idea of a background check for cc and some sort of Texas style classroom and test. I wish there were a reasonable way to test emotional maturity as well.

    I would not feel comfortable knowing that everyone and anyone might be carrying concealed.

    OTOH, I know that is happening now, illegally. The police find it on traffic stops all the time. Felon in possession. Teen in possession. That will continue to happen no matter what we do.

    This one is so multi-faceted that all we can do is make our compromises. There will be no perfect answer, ever.


    Heh, it's interesting -- how willing are we to accept freedom...do we "appreciate" a permission slip from the government? I'm not so sure.
    It is utterly illogical to believe that passing laws to reduce gun violence will be successful when those who are commiting the gun violence do not obey the law.

  11. #85
    Member Array DIXIETWISTER's Avatar
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    O.K. here is one to think about.......Just say that Defensivecarry Members are having a national meeting so everyone can meet and greet fellow members, say at a convention center here in Georgia.....but wait, no GUNS, Cause we want the public to trust us with guns even though we cant trust ourselves. I would trust all of yall with a gun around me until u prove you cant be trusted....If we want our government to trust us we need to trust each other.

    A government that does not trust it's law-abiding citizens to keep and bear arms is itself unworthy of trust. -- James Madison
    You may not like guns. You may choose not to own one. That is your right.
    You might not believe in God. That is your choice.
    However, if someone breaks into your home at 3AM the first two things you are going to do are:
    1) Call someone with a gun.
    2)Pray they get there in time." - A wise man

  12. #86
    VIP Member Array 9MMare's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DIXIETWISTER View Post
    O.K. here is one to think about.......Just say that Defensivecarry Members are having a national meeting so everyone can meet and greet fellow members, say at a convention center here in Georgia.....but wait, no GUNS, Cause we want the public to trust us with guns even though we cant trust ourselves. I would trust all of yall with a gun around me until u prove you cant be trusted....If we want our government to trust us we need to trust each other.

    A government that does not trust it's law-abiding citizens to keep and bear arms is itself unworthy of trust. -- James Madison

    I'm going to a 'ladies carry fashion show' next weekend. I asked Pax and women will be able to carry. There may be some rules, including no guns handled at all during the gathering. (Blue guns only for instance). But I am still going (& carrying unless I hear differently) and feel comfortable doing so.

    If I see differently when I'm there, that's a different story. But knowing Pax, things will be handled appropriately.
    Fortune favors the bold.

    Freedom doesn't mean safe, it means free.

    The thing about "defense" is that it has practically nothing to do with guns. (As passed on by CCW9MM)

  13. #87
    Member Array Wolf357's Avatar
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    I trust everyone else to own firearms until they prove to be untrustworthy. I then avoid those particular knuckleheads as if they carried the plague.

    Why shouldn't we trust others to possess firearms? I'm certainly not an anti with a subversive agenda, or one of those "Just dial 911 and let us protect you" LEOs who overtly praises our Second Amendment right to bear arms for the sole purpose of hunting game animals, (Say, what?) but actually think private citizens should be denied their true Second Amendment right to bear arms to protect themselves from human predators, and a government gone bad to make them feel safer while performing the duties they chose to do.
    And Jesus said, "If you don't have a sword, sell your cloak and buy one." (Luke 22:36)

    I am a peaceful man. But I am not a pacifist.

  14. #88
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    If Vermont or Alaska suddenly have high rates of people shooting at each other, I'll change my mind. But for now, I would be just as comfortable as I am now NOT knowing if the guy beside me is carrying.
    ~Coriantan~

    "When seconds count, the police are only minutes away." * "Don't bring a knife to a gun fight."

  15. #89
    Distinguished Member Array Guardian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DIXIETWISTER View Post
    O.K. here is one to think about.......Just say that Defensivecarry Members are having a national meeting so everyone can meet and greet fellow members, say at a convention center here in Georgia.....but wait, no GUNS, Cause we want the public to trust us with guns even though we cant trust ourselves. I would trust all of yall with a gun around me until u prove you cant be trusted....If we want our government to trust us we need to trust each other.

    A government that does not trust it's law-abiding citizens to keep and bear arms is itself unworthy of trust. -- James Madison
    Amen!
    "I dislike death, however, there are some things I dislike more than death. Therefore, there are times when I will not avoid danger" Mencius"

  16. #90
    VIP Member Array peckman28's Avatar
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    I would feel much safer if the entire country went with Vermont style carry. I distrust the criminals far more than any law-abiding gun owner; even if that owner is incompetent they don't have malicious intent. And there is the larger issue of the government failing to trust its people, then demanding their trust and violating it at every turn. More people carrying is a good thing. I haven't heard anything about the high murder/crime rate in Vermont ever, but you get stories about that out of LA, NY, DC, etc all the time. Gun control is what makes the people unsafe, not the reverse.

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