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Do you trust OTHER people W/ guns?

9K views 147 replies 99 participants last post by  Cold Warrior 
#1 ·
Do you trust other people W/ guns?

Frequently I see threads here about gun shops that restrict carry or gun shows or the NRA convention. It reminds me of a Pastor at a church I used to attend that used to ask “Do you hate sin?” and everyone would raise their hand then he’d ask “Do you hate your sin?’ not quite as enthusiast a response.

Anyway I thought I’d throw this out; In general do you trust other people, people that you don’t know or people that do things that, while legal, you disagree with , with a gun?

How would you feel if the entire country did away W/ permits and just allowed Vermont carry? Would you feel more or less safe?
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#27 ·
It doesn't matter wether or not I trust someone to carry a gun or not. It is their right to do so. That doesn't mean I trust that they will be safe with their guns. I've shot at 2 indoor ranges and both had bullet holes in places where there shouldn't be any. That makes me very nervous, but I'm not going to say a guy that shoots the celing or the bench shouldn't have a gun, it just means if the guy in the next booth does it I'm getting off the line for a while.
 
#29 ·
I am currently in a situation where everyone HAS to carry a weapon. Do I trust them all? No. Are there ADs? Sometimes (Very few and far between. I havent seen any personally, but we all know they occur). Does that make me uncomfortable? No. My situational awareness around other people who are doing something with thier weapon is always at its highest. I have seen the ridiculousness and carelessness of people and have come to learn the signs of ignorance. If the weapon is holstered on someones side or slung across thier back, then it isnt going to hurt anyone. Now around the clearing barrel is a different story! To answer the question, I would feel just fine if everyone carried, I am responsible for what happens in my immediate surroundings.
 
#66 ·
Ditto.

As my mom used to tell me as a kid; "I'm from the show me state... Don't tell me what you can do. Show me."

Until proven otherwise I as a default assume as related to myself and my own well being in the physical that _everyone_ regardless of implied skill level be they a; LEO, IDPA shooter of equal or higher grade than me, or they claim to have been huntin' and shootin' since they were single digit age (almost always the worst ones for safety practices!).

When it comes to firearms you get many chances to get it wrong, and just one chance to get it right.

- Janq
 
#31 ·
I haven't heard that Vermont and Alaska have become so dangerous and unsafe because people can carry without a permit. I haven't seen any evidence of increased accidental or negligent shootings in states without required training either.
"...the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed." Doesn't matter if I trust them or not.
 
#58 ·
I agree with the above 100%.

But to answer the OP's original question:

Do you trust other people W/ guns?

How would you feel if the entire country did away W/ permits and just allowed Vermont carry? Would you feel more or less safe?
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I would feel neither more nor less safe.

Responsible gun owners would still be responsible gun owners.
Irresponsible gun owners would still be irresponsible gun owners.
Criminals would still be criminals.
 
#32 ·
First, lets look at trust, How many people would you trust to stand behind you on a 1,000 foot cliff? For me that would be none. I trust no one except myself.
With that out of the way lets consider how safe I would feel with everyone armed. The majority of people are law abiding and would try to do the right thing. That would mean if there are more people with guns then there are more people to watch my back. I would prefer to live in a society where all law abiding people were armed.
 
#33 ·
I posted this in the 2A section, it pretty much sums it up for me.

Nobody said freedom and liberty were the safest option, just the best for each individual person. Tyranny and governmental control has it's own dangers. I prefer to trust my freedom and responsibility to my own hands, not my governments. And I'll take the chance that the next guy will respect that like I do, and prepare if he does not. Some folks will too readily give their freedom away for perceived safety. As Ben F said they will get neither. The safety we might gain on one hand by getting rid of guns is not worth the danger we would face from not having them on the other hand.

Crooks work on the idea that most folks do not carry. How do you think that idea would change if most folks carried?

We are all endowed with rights and some of them are legally protected, safety is not one of them though.

To answer do I trust them? To a point. I try to give a certain level of respect and trust to everyone. It's then their opportunity to gain more or loose it all. As far as VT carry, the folks that should not legally possess guns carry them anyway. What's the difference in allowing folks who are allowed to possess them the right to carry them?

And my sig line.
 
#34 ·
I think I'm in agreement with ChiefJason, as displayed in my signature also.

"Freedom doesnt mean safe, it means free."
 
#69 · (Edited)
...
"Freedom doesnt mean safe, it means free."

I am careful around people with tools.....hammers..... saws......icepicks.......knives........vehicles.......jackhammers........ohh and GUNS.

I am not a HYPOCRITE
Do I trust other people driving their cars? Nope. So I just suck it up and drive defensively. The same applies to gun carriers, few of whom I notice. (except if really looking for that)
No, I don't.

Then again, to everyone else, I am one of those other people.

So, I guess the only option is to trust. Given the statistics, people are generally trustworthy with firearms.
↑ ↑ ↑ ↑ ↑ ↑ ↑ ↑ :yup: ↑ ↑ ↑ ↑ ↑ ↑ ↑ ↑ :yup: ↑ ↑ ↑ ↑ ↑ ↑ ↑ ↑ :yup: ↑ ↑ ↑ ↑ ↑ ↑ ↑ ↑ :yup: ↑ ↑ ↑ ↑ ↑ ↑ ↑ ↑ :yup: ↑ ↑ ↑ ↑ ↑ ↑ ↑ ↑

The above sum it up, IMHO.

My way of saying it:

Trust every one? No.

I accept the risk because the alternative are :banned:.

There are plenty of post-proof-of-being-too-risky laws (felons can't have [in theory] guns type laws). No need for any more prior-restraint on the 2A, than there is for prior-restraint on 1A, to keep the press from getting it wrong.

OTOH, this thread plays into the hands of the Antis (and they monitor this and other forums) for as OD* said it helps

Divide and conquer.
 
#35 · (Edited)
I trust very few individuals, throw guns into the mix and the list narrows down to a few that I know.
As soon as someone picks up a weapon, my eyes are all over their handling of the weapon. It doesn't take long to spot someone with unsafe habits. If that is the case, we part company until the weapons are gone.
I know that lots of individuals carry a firearm, and I respect that right, but it does give me cause to scrutinize the use of that right.

That said...
Have a plan to kill everyone you meet.:yup:
 
#36 ·
Do you trust other people W/ guns?
Yes, basically. Though, that trust doesn't go very far at all. Until such time as an individual has shown others he has no right to an expectation of trust or respect for his actions, that person hasn't earned any different attention from me or others than anyone else nearby. However, at the moment when such actions become a threat, what I and others in the area have to say about those actions becomes far more important than the person's opinions of the trust or respect he should have.

It reminds me of a Pastor at a church I used to attend that used to ask “Do you hate sin?” and everyone would raise their hand then he’d ask “Do you hate your sin?’ not quite as enthusiast a response.
In every place, there are folks who don't see well.

In general do you trust other people, people that you don’t know or people that do things that, while legal, you disagree with , with a gun?
It's easy for the potential lethality of guns to become a threat. The moment a person's actions threaten others, then at that moment trust and respect for the person's presence and actions has just been tossed out the window.

How would you feel if the entire country did away W/ permits and just allowed Vermont carry?
Same as above.

Would you feel more or less safe?
Not much different. I don't feel unsafe getting off a plane in Burlington or Stowe, nor walking through town there.
 
#37 ·
In one sense yes, and in one sense no.
Trust that they will make the right decision, I will have to. However true trust must be earned, hence I will have faith in man yet not complete trust.
However there is a point no one has brought up. Yes there are people that have a gun for the wrong reasons falling into the basic category of “because it’s cool”. However I believe that there are also those that do not have the mentality to use a gun. This “guardian” mentality, is arguably the mentality that a person carrying a firearms should have. Someone who does not should probably not CC, and I definitely do not believe that I could come to trust them completely with a firearm.
 
#38 ·
I trust our military and the vast majority of civilian gun owners. I know how responsible I am with my firearms and I gotta think that the vast majority have a similar level respect for such a deadly tool. I mostly think of myself as your average adult male, nothing special, but and active part of the whole picture.

The way I look at is; just like with anything else, you have individuals that defy logic but until they demonstrate the trait, you just never really know.YMMV

GBK :bier:
 
#64 ·
I'm reminded of a line from the movie Conair, "There's only two people I trust; one of them is me & the other is not you".
.

I love that movie! My favorite line is: "Put...the bunny....back....in the box."
 
#40 ·
The OP's question seems an attempt at member admissions of hypocrisy. "why should someone trust you with a gun and you not trust them" sort of thing. I think it’s worded really vague. I mean "other people" includes law enforcement, open carriers, conceal carriers, military as well as every man, woman and child in the world. A huge number of which DOESN'T trust you with a gun no matter what. *cough* Brady *cough*

I know a few people that should not have a gun. These people have shown they either can't handle a gun properly or have continued to admit they would kill someone for a reason other then fear for their life. If someone can demonstrate they can handle a gun properly then I develop trust that they won't shoot me accidently. A trust that can be broken the moment they mishandle a gun. I fully expect the same from other people judging my ability to handle a gun.
 
#41 ·
I think people are reading more into this question than is there. I'm asking if you trust other people W/ guns. I'm not asking if you support gun control or Vermont carry , I just want to know if you trust other people's safe gunhandling skills?

If you do , would you trust it enough to go to the NRA convention knowing that everyone there was armed.

Originally posted by razor02087 The OP's question seems an attempt at member admissions of hypocrisy. "why should someone trust you with a gun and you not trust them" sort of thing. I think it’s worded really vague.


Originally posted by Treo It's a difficult question to properly articulate and I welcome any attempte to help flesh it out and properly frame it.

Originally posted by Treo I think a better question might be "Do you trust other people's safe gun handling skills?"
 
#43 ·
Originally posted by razor02087 The OP's question seems an attempt at member admissions of hypocrisy. "why should someone trust you with a gun and you not trust them" sort of thing. I think it’s worded really vague.


Originally posted by Treo It's a difficult question to properly articulate and I welcome any attempte to help flesh it out and properly frame it.

Originally posted by Treo I think a better question might be "Do you trust other people's safe gun handling skills?"
my apologies Treo I admit to skimming through the thread :doh:
 
#44 · (Edited)
I know alot of people who own guns, I grew up around guns as most of my
freinds. I carried a firearm in my veical sence I was 18 years old (LEAGALLY)
As far as trusting everyone with a gun, NO and that includes some LEO'S & I rather stay far away from them as possible, But that don't meen they don't
have a right to own/carry one. JMO ; )
H/D
 
#45 ·
I didn't read the responses, but in the Steve Lee song "I like Guns" he says... "I ain't gonna shoot anyone, and no one shoots at me, 'cos I gotta gun"

That pretty much sums up my feelings.

I don't want to be down one, but I am OK being equal.
 
#50 ·
I dont think anyone is wanting to take anyone elses rights. This is a question of trust. I dont trust everyone to have a knife. Do I think they shouldnt be allowed? No, they should be as long as they havent previously demonstrated they are not to be trusted with the knife (felons, kids who stabs furniture, mentally incapable). Everyone should have the right to stab themselves, I just dont trust them not to stab me.:gah:
 
#47 ·
I Think the Founding Fathers trusted the general population to have/own/carry firearms.
 
#49 ·
First, do I trust other people with guns, no. Would I want to see their rights restricted to carry a gun, no. I know it is a paradox, but it is one we have to live with. As mentioned previously, I consider everybody behind the wheel , except me, a complete maniac and drive cautiously.

My major worry is the complete fearlessness some people have with a weapon. They just don't believe they could have a ND.

While on active duty in the USMC, I was on the pistol team most of the time and handled a 1911 almost every day. A neighbors wife, her husband was a USN Hospital Corpsman, brought over a cigar box one day. She had her father's 1911 in it. I had seen her kids outside playing with it, I thought it was a toy. As I took the piece out of the box, I immediately noted that the magazine was in, and the piece was heavy! I removed the magazine, which was loaded and immediately took the gun out into the backyard. Aiming at the ground I jacked the slide. Yes, a live round ejected!

Her kids had been playing cowboys and Indians with a loaded .45! She tried to give me the gun as it was hers, not her husband's, but I told her I would try to find her a buyer for it. She immediately sold it to me for $10.00(just to get it out of the house). I later gave it to one of my brothers.

I tell this just to show how ignorant some people are about guns. But I still have to defend their right to own them!

If you don't defend others' rights, you stand to lose your own.
 
#51 ·
Ugh. I'm gonna try...

Forgive the political rant, I don't mean to offend, and only use this as a metaphor for my feelings. My standard, feeling only without thinking about it answer, would be "no, I don't want anyone except a few good people I know to have a gun". But thinking further about it, I don't agree with my emotions.

Left-wing political policy is extremely desireable and idealistic on paper. The idea of communism, taking care of the less fortunate, getting rid of weapons, saving the planet, etc. are all things that any child could get excited about. These ideas, while "perfect", do NOT work in the real world. They have been found to fail and be extremely costly experiments at the expense of the people they were meant to serve. This does not apply to all policy, and it goes both ways, please forgive my lack of full disclosure, it's in the name of saving space. How does that relate to guns?

My emotions and theory about the subject are hypocritical and not practical. I immediately realize I'm not one bit uncomfortable when I see someone who is likely concealing, and I see armed citizens and police every day without a second thought. Further, armed citizens and police see me every day and don't bat an eyelash, ask for ID, do a double-take, or anything except say "Hey there" and "be safe" on departure.

This is a case where the theory and what many would consider common sense goes out the window. Other people not having guns sounds good, but is not in line with reality. I like other good, trained people to be capable of defending themselves, and possibly smoke-check someone for my family or myself.

If someone has a gun to my head, and the outcome isn't looking good, I trust YOU to save a good man's life. I choose you, a man or woman with unknown experience, dealing with poor motor skills, reduced vision, shaking hands, and a heartbeat that can be heard in outer space, to put some metal in my attacker's electricity.

This isn't nearly complete and I don't think I articulated myself accurately, but I think the message is there.
 
#56 ·
As I am a Range Officer in my time off, do I trust people with guns, NO! It isn't my job to trust anybody. It is my job to do the best to make sure everybody is safe and gets to go home that day. I don't decide who can or cannot, or should or should not have a gun. Every law abiding citizen has the RIGHT to own a gun.
It does not bother me to see someone carrying a gun at any time. I do not think twice about seeing someone OC or sometimes poor CC. I am sure with all the permits in my state, many more people are carrying than I see.
As some have stated about people and cars, that is why it is called defensive driving. It is your own responsibility to drive safely and to watch out for others.
 
#57 ·
Yesterday I was at my local range buying some stuff and about to rent a stall. I saw some folks ahead of me in line renting pistols and the way the handled them made me turn around and leave the place. Complete beginners who have never handled a firearm make me nervous in a range setting.

In an OC setting where the guns are holstered, I'm not concerned in the least.
 
#59 ·
We have obviously left bad guys out of the discussion. I trust those who are on my side. I generally know who they are.

That said, I think a free permit that includes criminal/medical background checks would be the way to go. If you violate the law without a permit you would be cited and required to apply; fail and you would be held in violation of civil and criminal penalties applicable to possession of a firearm during the commission of the crime.
 
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