357 vs. 45 ? - Page 5

357 vs. 45 ?

This is a discussion on 357 vs. 45 ? within the Defensive Ammunition & Ballistics forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; "Dr. Robert, he's a man you must believe, Helping everyone in need, No one can succeed like Dr. Robert." Oh sorry. This one is Dr. ...

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  1. #61
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    "Dr. Robert, he's a man you must believe,
    Helping everyone in need,
    No one can succeed like Dr. Robert."

    Oh sorry. This one is Dr. Roberts.
    Charter Member of the DC .41 LC Society "Get heeled! No really"

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  2. #62
    Distinguished Member Array razor02097's Avatar
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    I own, shoot and carry both. To be honest it is all about preference. If you want something to carry they both calibers are perfectly fine. A nice thing about .357 is you can shoot .38 special also which allows you to save some money on ammunition. The cheapest .45 I can find around here is still $20 for a box of 50 where as .38 specials are still about $17 per box of 50.

    I also own .44 magnum pistol and one carbine... Where that caliber fits is if you want to take down large game with a pistol round. It also makes milk jugs of water explode in a spectacular show (great 4th of july trick)
    There is something about firing 4,200 thirty millimeter rounds/min that makes me feel all warm and fuzzy inside.

  3. #63
    Senior Member Array CCWFlaRuger's Avatar
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    Depends, which one hit the target? Which ever one hit the target is the one that is best. IE, practice with whichever is more comfortable and stop inciting caliber wars!
    "You will not rise to the occasion and you will not default to your level of training. You WILL ONLY default to the level of training you have mastered."
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  4. #64
    Senior Member Array CCWFlaRuger's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cmdrdredd View Post
    I don't think Billy Badass attacking you will give a hoot what it is when he is hit with it. Generally though I have read that a .357 round being a hotter load with more velocity causes more shock trauma than a .45acp which is traveling slower. The .45acp will tear more tissue as it passes through creating a larger wound channel, but won't produce the same type of surrounding shock trauma generally speaking. Not that I am an expert but my reading has always come to this conclusion. Then there is Dr. Roberts who's studies show that a fast moving .357sig round does about the same damage as a .45acp in the "shock trauma" department.
    Notice how the .357sig traveling at 1319fps is doing about the same damage as any other round and penetrates to the same depth (past 12"). What this tells me is that it doesn't matter as long as you hit the target. Shot placement is the winner.

    Look what you did to that poor defensless jello... and to prove nothing more than the fact that your bullets penetrate Jello... No bone, no connective tissue, no clothing.

    Practice, practice, practice and maybe when the time comes, you will live, regardless of what you carry.
    "You will not rise to the occasion and you will not default to your level of training. You WILL ONLY default to the level of training you have mastered."
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  5. #65
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    What are we talking abotu here? .357 sig, or .357 magnum? Different people are talking about different things, and the OP never specified.

  6. #66
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    "what is more powerfull 45 or 357? and if its 45 then how does the 40 cal stack up to the 357? "


    Uh, which .357 and .45? The answer is pretty much yes, regardless. Which you'd rather carry as a SD round is another question altogether.

    Does the super-size soda include refills?
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  7. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by usmc0811 View Post
    what is more powerfull 45 or 357? and if its 45 then how does the 40 cal stack up to the 357?
    What is your specific interest in these questions? What sparked your query? You provide no context at all to frame your questions in.

    This looks like another drive-by post.

    .

  8. #68
    VIP Member Array cmdrdredd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CCWFlaRuger View Post
    Look what you did to that poor defensless jello... and to prove nothing more than the fact that your bullets penetrate Jello... No bone, no connective tissue, no clothing.

    Practice, practice, practice and maybe when the time comes, you will live, regardless of what you carry.
    Uh...didn't know you wanted to volunteer for ballistics testing on your body...

    The only medium we have available that simulates human flesh in a consistent and reproducible manner is ballistics gelatin. Dr. Gary Roberts is one of the foremost authorities on ballistics and wounding. He's done real research with real shooting victims as well to backup his statements and lab testing. I trust his word more than any armchair warrior on a forum.
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  9. #69
    Senior Member Array CCWFlaRuger's Avatar
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    I'm sorry, didn't realize I was coming off as an armchair warrior. I retract my statement in defense of Jello. May Bill Cosby have mercy on your soul.
    "You will not rise to the occasion and you will not default to your level of training. You WILL ONLY default to the level of training you have mastered."
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  10. #70
    VIP Member Array TedBeau's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gasmitty View Post
    Physics, again... or still.

    Bigger diameter bullet; heavier bullet; launched at slightly lower velocity (than a .357)

    Representative loads - .357 - 158 gr @ 1475 ft/sec, .44 mag - 240 gr @ 1300 ft/sec


    Kinetic energy = half the mass times the square of velocity
    Momentum = mass times velocity

    Either way, the .44 mag wins the numbers contest.
    Why Half the mass? I thought the formula was E=MC squared, not E= 1/2 M * C squared.

  11. #71
    Ex Member Array azchevy's Avatar
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    I would not want to be shot by neither caliber. 45 or .357

  12. #72
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    Quote Originally Posted by TedBeau View Post
    Why Half the mass? I thought the formula was E=MC squared, not E= 1/2 M * C squared.
    Newtonian Kenetic Energy is 1/2 * M * V**2 where V is bullet velocity.

    E=MC**2 is Einsteinian nuclear energy for total conversion of mass. You'd need a matter/anti-matter weapon for that one. It would definitely when the caliber battles though.

  13. #73
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    Yeah, the "C" in that is the speed of light... :)
    A man fires a rifle for many years, and he goes to war. And afterward he turns the rifle in at the armory, and he believes he's finished with the rifle. But no matter what else he might do with his hands - love a woman, build a house, change his son's diaper - his hands remember the rifle.

  14. #74
    Distinguished Member Array Rexster's Avatar
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    Wow, this debate was old when I started handgunning in 1982 or 1983. Aren't y'all tired of it by now?

    I have long since decided that both of these cartridges' approaches to "stopping" are valid. Until the .40 gained preeminence in law enforcement during the 1990s, plenty of bad guys fell to the .357 Magnum and .45 ACP. The PD that employs me allowed a range of primary duty cartridges until 1997, and .45 ACP and .357 Mag were the top two in popularity. Cadets started with mandatory 4" 357 Mag sixguns until well into the 1990's, and rookies had to use the .357 sixgun until finishing a year of wearing the badge. The most common automatic chosen for duty carry, until well into the 1990's, was the .45 ACP 1911. A quite large PD, we shoot plenty of folks each year. .357 and .45 worked well against felons, as the present .40 does these days, when we place the shots well.

  15. #75
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    IMO between the two rounds, the .357 sig usually will allow for an extra round or two due to the size; with the energy between the two being pretty close, firepower wins the day IMB.

    .357 sig

    Now if we're talking .357 Magnum vs .45 ACP that's a slightly different story, but I would still opt for the Magnum load over the .45ACP. The .357 Magnum load outa the 3" and up delivers devastating FPE which I think gets overlooked way to much. JMO, YMMV.
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