What do you think? When I go on long backpacking trips I usually choose to carry a .357 mag instead of a .44 mag because my .357 is so much lighter. When I go camping with the car or just for the weekend I will bring the .44
If your carrying a 3" .357 mag in black bear and moose country would you carry SD HP's or FMJ? From a ballistic standpoint what would be a better choice to carry in the woods in that caliber?
HP is the answer, it gives great energy impact. FMJ will get exit wounds that will possible continue attack you or if it runs away will have slow dying with a lot of pain. My .02
My vote is HP, althought the FMJ gives a better wound trial for a bleed out that only works if the bear runs away from you.... No comfort in him bleeding out while he is ripping your head off..
you need deep penetration but expansion would be nice also. no matter - unlikely one shot from a pistol is bringing down a bear. I've seen them take multiple 12ga. slugs from 20 feet and keep coming. Nearly always takes a head shot stop them instantly. Maybe stager HP and FMJ?
When fishing in bear country, (black bears) I carry a 649 with Corbon 200 Gr HC bullets. Really stout load, and at point blank range I feel they would do the trick....Better than a rock or a stick:blink:
I shoot them out of my 3" GP100 and that is what I carry hiking and we have BB's, moose, elk and griz although smaller than the northern ones. The 180s are stout, but not unmanagable.
There not unmanageable with a good grip but with the small boot grip I have on there now I just can't hold on to the darn thing. Definitely a stout load! Sometimes I bring along the 10mm but I prefer the .357
I load federal 158gr. softpoint flat nose. Being in a totaly different area..... My main worry is feral hog, dog. Maybe a rabid cyote or mountain lion. Possible aggressive buck...father-in-law was attcked by one 'bout six years ago while clearing brush.
In black bear/moose country I'd carry 158 or 180 grain soft points. While FMJs will do better penetrating a skull or breaking bone, you can't count on those kinds of deliberate shots if you run into a nasty surprise. The semi-jacketed soft points will give you a good mix of expansion and penetration. Just make sure you launch a few at the range so you're prepared for the sound and the fury if you do have to use 'em. And carry a couple of speed strips with some more moderate stuff (like maybe the 158 gr .38 +P LSWCHP) to give you some options in the field.
* Lacking the squishy lead makes it more consistent. You get more reliable expansion than JHP, and this also results in more consistent penetration depth.
* Penetration is deeper than JHP but less than FMJ, this makes it ideal for both hunting and self defense because you are more likely to reach vital organs without the risk of over penetration and wasted kinetic energy.
* Because 100% of the mass is retained it is also better at going through thick animal bones and barriers than JHP, rather than glancing off.
* Now comes the downside, although I don't really think it is a downside: because the copper is slightly less dense than lead, you get slightly less room for powder than with a JHP round. This means it has slightly lower velocity and less recoil. I don't think this is a negative because a tiny increase in velocity has no benefit, if anything it just reduces expansion size by taking the spurs off an otherwise good mushroom.
Unless you stick the barrel in the bear's mouth when you fire, a handgun isn't very effective.
That being said, having the .357 is better than leaving the heavy .44 at home. I agree w/ the CORBON advice. The DPX gives you the best compromise in penetration and expansion.
Personally, I carry a 3" .44 Magnum w/ 240gr JHP for the back country and I practice enough that I shot my former agency's qual course with it. Look at a good carry system if the weight bothers you. If you don't like it on your belt try a shoulder holster to distribute the weight better. Just throwing it out there.
What do you think? When I go on long backpacking trips I usually choose to carry a .357 mag instead of a .44 mag because my .357 is so much lighter. When I go camping with the car or just for the weekend I will bring the .44
If your carrying a 3" .357 mag in black bear and moose country would you carry SD HP's or FMJ? From a ballistic standpoint what would be a better choice to carry in the woods in that caliber?
Neither. On creatures like these you want penetration. Best rounds to use are a SWC, LFN, or WFN all lead hardcast gas checked bullet. THIS is what I carry when I am in bear country here in the Pacific Northwest. Me personally, I would NEVER use a hollow point bullet on any game animal (other than varmits); NEVER, EVER.
I've never seriously considered what I'd load with if bears were a possibility. Probably would tote a .41 Magnum or .44 Magnum stoked with full-power lead semi-wadcutter handloads if there was a real possibility of an encounter with critters that bite back and I couldn't carry a suitable long arm.
The simple answer is to alternate in the cylinder (FMJ / HP) with rounds that have similiar recoil. I do this all the time with a sidearm when hunting / hiking, as my concerns range from 2 legged to 4 legged.
+1 on the pepper spray. It is not always clear cut when to fire in SD with a wild creature. Most of the time surprise (for both you and the critter) is the major problem. For those times when not sure, pepper fogger / spay can be used to warn. There are also studies that show that the rare critters bent on attack might respond to retreat to pepper spray than a hit by a round or the sound of a firearm.
I'm not suggesting I would take a firearm over spray (I'm simply not sure). I just take both when camping / hiking (when hunting, the pepper is replaced with a 30-06).
FYI, I was just told with bear it might be best to aim for the shoulder followed by a head shot in a (pistol) SD situation. The head can take damage, and might trigger a more aggressive attack, while an initial shoulder hit (even if followed with head shots) might trigger retreat. The bear expects head blows, but is taken by suprise (and slowed) by an injured shoulder. Just something I've been told.
i carry 225 gain Hornaday lever evolution in my .44mag for SD when I carry it around town, I would trust it to defend against a bear as it is the only back country gun i would carry
My vote is penetration on a bear. That would mean a solid point, preferably, hard cast. Expansion won't help if it does'nt reach the vitals. Even a non expanding .35 cal. in the heart or brain beats a .50 cal. expanding in fat or on the outside of bone. Just my opinion
I hear what you are saying, but I saw a video of a Grizzly rolling in an area just sprayed with pepper spray like a dog on road kill. That turned me off to depending on bear spray!
+1 for BB. Their loads are well-planned and tested. If you would want to carry the .44, they have a load called Deer Grenade! That would certainly get the attention of anything on the receiving end of it.
I would say HP is the better choice....however...on my backpacking or hiking trips in mountain country...I have either my Blackhawk .357 or .41 mag....both are stoked with hardcast SWC's....but I still carry handloaded Hornady XTP's for both as well.
My vote is for hard cast SWC, heaviest and stoutest load you can handle. As a side note - a bit of a sea story - when I was getting transferred to Kodiak AK several years back, Exec was telling me about the Island. I asked about using a 357 in bear country. Exec advised me if I took a 357 to Kodiak be sure and file off the front sight. I bit - Why? I asked. Answer, when the bear shoves the 357 up my ***** it wont hurt as bad. I've never forgotten that.:redface:
I got pretty much the same story in Fairbanks, only it was so you didn't chip your teeth as you put that last bullet in your mouth--as in it ain't stopping no AK bear!.
Cast bullets.....performance on game is determined by penetration. The animals you mention are tuff, cast bullets rule the day on these....more so than in (human) self defense situations.
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