Is there a move in the federal line with this new guard dog bullet to try and replace the hydrashok??? I am seeing it being pushed alot more and was wondering if anyone had any idea.
It's a lighter weight bullet than some of the hydra-shok line : 9mm @ 105 grains .40S&W @ 135 and .45 ACP @165 though HS has a 135 in .40 and a 165 in .45 ACP. Seems to be directed at indoor low penetration home defense market. I don't think it is intended to replace the hydra shok line. Just one more step in ammunition specialization maybe.
I'm sure it isn't. they did a dismal job of promoting it. I think it is a great idea and one which I have wanted to try for a long time now. But i can't find any of this ammo to actually look at in my hands before buying it yet. No matter where I have looked. So if they want to rename it and actually promote it and get it out there on the market, then great. Do it already!
Available in 9mm, .40 S&W and .45 ACP, Guard Dog Home Defense is a full-metal-jacket style non-hollowpoint that's filled with an expanding polymer, which is designed to minimize over-penetration when shooting through interior walls. Guard Dog Home Defense expands rapidly but doesn't fill with barrier material. During Federal's testing, Guard Dog was shot into four wall-like surfaces and a layer of ballistic gel. Results were that the ammo did not penetrate the gel. Conversely, traditional hollowpoints punched through 15 inches of gel after passing through the same four wall-like surfaces.
I'm confused...is anyone else confused why you would use ammo like this in your SD weapon? I mean, realistically, you're probably only going to hit the BG with 3 or 4 rounds out of your magazine anyway, so the "over-penetration" argument is kinda moot, but still, If I need to shoot through a wall or barrier (not likely, but hey, I'll play along, Federal), I want the round to count...
In a home with children or apartment/condo with shared walls is the environment that is just made for the Glaser Safety Slug, no reduced power load with anemic performance. maybe not the deepest penitration but pretty much the angel of death mentioned.
Don't forget some states do not allow civilians to carry or use hallow point bullets to me this sounds like a very good alternative to me in that situation
I might consider it if I lived in an apartment but I dont really liked my .45 rounds less than 200 grains. I prefer my 9mm rounds 115 grains or higher, these sound a little bit gimmicky to me. I would consider the EFMJ if they were a little bit heavier, I think the concept may have value.
I might consider it if I lived in an apartment but I dont really liked my .45 rounds less than 200 grains. I would consider the EFMJ if they were a little bit heavier, I think the concept may have value.
I was watching on self defense tv where they were discussing cover vs concealment. They shot a 9mm through simulated walls, a couch, an arm chair, and even a refrigerator. All rounds easily penetrated the "concealment" and continued to the target with plenty of punch. I wouldn't want a 135gr bullet in my .40, no way, I want a big 185gr mother with a lot of umph. I'll just make sure I hit what I aim at ya know.
Federal developed the EFMJ ammo years before Hornady's Critical Defense jumped on the band wagon. I've been carrying EFMJ in my .45's for over 10 years. The reason they were developed was because hollow point bullets often fail when they become clogged with clothing or other material. I have personally seen hollow point bullets, including the super-duper Law Enforcement Only stuff and HydraShok, clog and perform exactly as a FMJ bullet, with NO expansion what-so-ever. I'm one of the guys who had to recover the bullets at autopsies or emergency operating rooms.
For decades, ammo makers told us we should only use hollow-point bullets, and the bigger the HP the sexier the ammo. I've seen gun guys comparing bullets to see which one had the biggest HP cavities. Once that mind-set took hold, any other options were unthinkable. Then people like me started to point out the flaws in the HP designs and the ammo makers responded with new technology. For some reason gun owners and shooters are slow to adopt change, but cling to the old wife's tales and myths about bullet performance. I was around when the in-crowd resisted hollow point technology, clinging to the idea that soft lead bullets were superior.
Some are upset if the new bullets won't penetrate four (4) layers of wall material and then penetrate ballistic jello. Think about that. Should you really be shooting at someone two rooms away?
Time and technology marches on.
My opinion based on experience. Your mileage may vary.
What the heck does this mean? Are you saying you do not think the EFMJ round works? If you have some proof of this I would be interested to see it. I have read time and again how this round performs just as advertised in test after test.
I don't rly think it's a big deal. If it cycles through your firearm smoothly with no issues, it doesn't really matter what you shoot someone with. You can shoot someone with a .45 caliber pebble and it will still do the trick 9 times out of 10. Ok, I carry critical defense in .45 for CC. It's worked well for me so far and havent had any issues. If in the slim to none chance I have to shoot someone and it doesn't expand 100% exactly the way it should it's still going to do the job.
I use the +P 124 gr "LEO" version of 9mm EFMJ. Unfortunately, it is backordered, and Federal won't be making more until later in the year, per an email they sent me when I inquired.
I like it because there is no hollow cavity to get plugged, wrapped by clothing fibers, or crushed by barriers. It feeds well, has low flash, and the recoil is good. If it fails to expand, it still has a blunt profile.
As far as performance goes, 15 inches out of a P11's short barrel seems pretty good to me:
My supply firm has plenty and I have plenty in stock at my Off Premise Storage and Reloading Depot. Bought at really good prices for the 25 round boxes vs the 20 round boxes for other brands in the last two years.
I will be switching to Glazers for the summer months. Not as heavy a round, and not going THROUGH anything; just in. They are somewhat expensive, but I don't have to worry about my round going through the BG, and into the neighbor, or their kids.
Has anyone actually seen Guard Dog ammo on the shelves anywhere? I looked at the 4 places near me that the Federal site says carries it and so far, none of them have even heard of it. I want some, but I'm having a pretty hard time finding any.
Now in stock at sporting goods store such as Academy as well as local gun shops...20 round box street price around 27.00. For those wanting to try, the only advantage I see is if you have had trouble finding a non FMJ round that will feed properly.
Very much a different product than ES AFR or glaser SS. I would think that if you wanted to go this route, you would be choosing one of those which will not even go through 1 insulated wall (two pieces of drywall), rather than this round which will go through at least 2.
Not endorsing the round, just putting the locations I have seen it for sale.
:35::35::35: In 40+ years of shooting I have seen "NEW...IMPROVED...BEST EVER...." ammo come out every few years. Spend your time at the range and quit looking for the 'magic one shot needed bullet.'
"Some are upset if the new bullets won't penetrate four (4) layers of wall material and then penetrate ballistic jello. Think about that. Should you really be shooting at someone two rooms away?"
I agree, shouldn't be shooting at someone 4 walls away...but what if you need to shoot through a windshield? I want my bullet to have enough uummph to pull it off and still penetrate the target. There is a fine line between not enough penetration and too much. Hard to say but different scenarios call for different loads...sometimes I think we all overthink ammo.
The chances of me needing to shoot through a windshield, plywood, sheet metal to defend my life is near zero (unlike law enforcement that does traffic stops). Knowing how poorly pistol bullets perform on human targets, how inaccurate most are at hitting a critical part of the target to immediately stop the threat, and having to go through hard barrier. I'm probably not even going to stand there and try to gun down the target. I figure my chances of defending myself are much higher if I simply run.
In an apartment/condo, the chances are much higher for the need to defend myself. And the last thing I would want is to fire through wall board and hit an innocent child or other victim, I would rather die in the attack. So I'd choose something that would be less danger to other innocents.
Weighing those options, I'd choose my ballistics for apartment/condo.
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