9mm or .40? defense ammo

This is a discussion on 9mm or .40? defense ammo within the Defensive Ammunition & Ballistics forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Originally Posted by snakyjake Just to get you started: http://www.defensivecarry.com/forum/...rspective.html Just because something is bigger and has more energy doesn't mean it is going to ...

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Thread: 9mm or .40? defense ammo

  1. #31
    Senior Member Array thebigdl86's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by snakyjake View Post
    Just to get you started:
    http://www.defensivecarry.com/forum/...rspective.html

    Just because something is bigger and has more energy doesn't mean it is going to make a difference. It's still too small. I don't know how else to explain this! It's like every time a rocket takes off from Earth, the rocket moves the Earth. Did it change Earth's orbit?

    So the real debate becomes how small the difference. According to the studies, the difference is small enough that it cannot be measured in real life. And that's why you still see 9 mm (and 40) being used by law enforcement and world militaries.

    All else, it just comes down to someone's "feelings" or maybe someone's anecdotal evidence.
    I beg to differ that the diffetence is negligable. fact, bigger bullet eqauls bigger would cavity. which eqauls quicker incapacitation. a .45 cal bullet, or . 40, in this case, will make a bigger hole then a .38 cal bullet plain and simple. bigger hole means more blood loss faster=threat eliminated fastef

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  3. #32
    Senior Member Array RemMod597's Avatar
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    Let us focus on the gun here for a sec.

    Some guns shoot better in some calibers than others. Throw that in the pot and we can help you narrow down an answer for yourself.


    The maximum effective range of an excuse is zero meters.

  4. #33
    Member Array snakyjake's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by thebigdl86 View Post
    I beg to differ that the diffetence is negligable. fact, bigger bullet eqauls bigger would cavity. which eqauls quicker incapacitation. a .45 cal bullet, or . 40, in this case, will make a bigger hole then a .38 cal bullet plain and simple. bigger hole means more blood loss faster=threat eliminated fastef
    How much time do you think it would take to incapacitate someone by blood drainage or a bigger wound cavity? Talk to some people who have shot animals with high power rifles how long it takes to bring down an animal when they don't hit a vital.

  5. #34
    Senior Member Array DPro.40's Avatar
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    I have owned them both. I love them both. I carry the 9mm only due to the cost of the ammo. I do hit better with the 9mm. Unexplained. Perhaps it was the weapon. .40 was a Beretta and the 9mm is a Sig. Could have been recoil anticipation. Personally if I could conceal a 12 gauge tactical with 00 buck I would. To hell with recoil. Blow a hole in it and be done.
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  6. #35
    Member Array JohnWFD's Avatar
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    I prefer 9mm to keep all my ammo stock consistent. I may venture into buying a 45 down the road.....but will most likely stay away from a .40
    Try before you buy....
    "A free people ought to be armed." - George Washington

  7. #36
    Distinguished Member Array Doc Holliday's Avatar
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    Hahahahahahaha.....a gun clerk said that the .40 would be obsolete in 10 years.

    The only way that will happen is if Gamma Death Ray-guns become avaliable for concealed carry.

    I carry both. Positives and negatives with each. Both are viable SD rounds that will do the job provided you do yours.

    If you are an inexperienced shooter then I would lean towards the 9mm. The .40 is not the best gun to try to learn on.
    Why Ike, whatever do you mean? Maybe poker's just not your game Ike. I know! Let's have a spelling contest!

  8. #37
    Senior Member Array thebigdl86's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by snakyjake View Post
    How much time do you think it would take to incapacitate someone by blood drainage or a bigger wound cavity? Talk to some people who have shot animals with high power rifles how long it takes to bring down an animal when they don't hit a vital.
    I regularly hunt wild boar, and have inacapacitated one with a single corbon power ball w/o hiting any vitals in less then 10 seconds. I have attempted the same thing with my g19 several times with different loads and had no such luck. it almost always takes 2 sometimes 3 9mm rnds for the same kind of kill. not talking percision shooting here cause I usually drop them with 1 .22 lr behind the ear, im saying just shooting torso purely for ammo testing sake. the expanded diameter after recovery the .45 dwarfes the 9mm.

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  9. #38
    Member Array Showman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by thebigdl86 View Post
    I beg to differ that the diffetence is negligable. fact, bigger bullet eqauls bigger would cavity. which eqauls quicker incapacitation. a .45 cal bullet, or . 40, in this case, will make a bigger hole then a .38 cal bullet plain and simple. bigger hole means more blood loss faster=threat eliminated fastef

    Sent from my LS670 using Tapatalk
    While I would agree that a bigger bullet can increase the wound cavity, I am still not convinced that the difference between .35 (9mm) and .39 (40) caliber is so significant that the best bullets and loads can't minimize it.
    Yes, more blood loss does incapacitate faster, but if both bullets hit the would-be killer in the same spot and both expand to .50 or .60 caliber, the net incapacitation effect, to me, is going to be much the same. At that point, a 9 is a 40 is a 45.
    I once believed that all serious pistol calibers began with a "4". I now believe that a lawfully-armed citizen or lawman armed with a 9mm or 38 and above who can place their shots properly is best armed of all, as long as they are armed with quality expanding ammunition.
    Once upon a time, bullet expansion was far less reliable and bullet design was not what it is today. Expansion could not be counted on. Back then, a person truly needed a "4 and above" more so than today, IMO.

  10. #39
    Member Array ConcealedG30's Avatar
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    Rented a G23 the 0ther day and I can say it kicks, and I like it! I have actually been looking for a used one to aide me in my weapon collecting disease.
    And here is some interesting yet worthless information I just picked up today at my wifes concealed carry class. The wichita, KS police department is switching from .40's over to 9mm's. I'm told one reasons is cost savings. I believe that to be a B.S. answer however I thought it was interesting when I heard it. I have looked at buying .40 ammo in bulk and its not much more money than 9mm ammo. .45 ammo is a different story on the cheap side its 80.00 more per thosand rounds of .40 ammo. Being a gun freak I like them all and will continue to till there is a better way to take care of business.

    Last edited by ConcealedG30; July 19th, 2011 at 01:13 AM. Reason: missing word

  11. #40
    Member Array Gladius's Avatar
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    In over 40 years of carrying a firearm, I've tried just about everything you could think of. I prefer something that is flat shooting, powerful and accurate. That being said, it doesn't matter how flat shooting, powerful or accurate a round is, if a person can't hit what they are aiming at, the round is useless. I have and do carry a .45, a .40, a .357 SIG, a .38, a .380, and .22 LR and Magnum. All will kill if shot placement is on target. With the new technology available in ammunition design and powder formulation, all can be potent 'man-stoppers'.

    Practically, for me, I prefer the larger calibers but will readily carry my CZ82 in 9mm MAK, my Bersa in .380, my CZ RAMI in .40and my American Classic and Kimber, both in .45. My wheel gun favorites are .38 Special, .357 magnum and a .44 Special.

    A note: An Israeli exchange officer I knew, a Col. David (Daveed), could consistently place 7 rounds of .22 from a Beretta, in a space the size of an orange at 7 yards rapid fire. But then GySgt Jessup could do the same thing with a .45.

    To each his/her own......

  12. #41
    Member Array ConcealedG30's Avatar
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    It was inevitable after I rented one, I had to have one. Picked up a G23 today.

    All is good, everyone love a happy ending.
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  13. #42
    Member Array fiddlers's Avatar
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    Both calibers work well. I favor 9MM because of reduced recoil, for target accuracy when firing during rapid fire drills and for cost.
    You can get a dozen terrific defensive loads in 9MM. All will do the trick for self defense.

  14. #43
    Distinguished Member Array grouse's Avatar
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    Hmmm, Interesting thread. Been thinking about trading my Kahr MK9 for a Kahr K40 (the MK9 is just to small) like the larger grip frame on the K series opposed to the MK series. Why a .40? Guess I think I'll get more thump. But yeah, you guys are right its shot placement. Maybe I'll trade for a K 9 instead.

    That said my EDC are 1911 .45's The .45 acp is such an easy case to reload. But 9 mm factory ammo is so cheap why reload it? So if I Buy the .40 I buy the reloading dies & if I don't like the .40------- yeah its shot placement, now I'm thinking 9.

  15. #44
    Ex Member Array JOHNSMITH's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ConcealedG30 View Post
    It was inevitable after I rented one, I had to have one. Picked up a G23 today.

    All is good, everyone love a happy ending.
    Congrats! Be sure to post pics when you get a chance :)

    Don't sniff that new gun smell too much, though.

  16. #45
    Epi
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    The way I've always approached the caliber wars is this:

    1: "With my 9mm, I have 16 chances to hit the lungs, heart and head, your 45 has 9."
    2: "But I have 2 extra magazines"
    1: "So do I, I now have 46 chances, you have 25."

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