Anyone use .45 GAP? NYSP replaced 9mm with this in 2006

This is a discussion on Anyone use .45 GAP? NYSP replaced 9mm with this in 2006 within the Defensive Ammunition & Ballistics forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; I fired a friend's G38 one time. Seemed a little poppy. However, I agree with those who like the .45 caliber in the smaller frame, ...

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Thread: Anyone use .45 GAP? NYSP replaced 9mm with this in 2006

  1. #46
    VIP Member Array peckman28's Avatar
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    I fired a friend's G38 one time. Seemed a little poppy. However, I agree with those who like the .45 caliber in the smaller frame, and I actually think I might pick one up sometime down the road. I'm a sucker for oddball stuff like that, at least to some extent. It would complement my 357 SIG barrel I got for my P229 anyway...

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  3. #47
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    Correct me if I am wrong, but IIRC, while the .45 GAP frame may equal the size of the 9mm/.40, the slide is similar in width to that on a G21 or G30. Therefore, while those with smaller hands may be more comfortable with it, you cannot interchange 9mm/.40 holsters with the .45 GAP.
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  4. #48
    VIP Member Array smolck's Avatar
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    The story in the very first post is sad. Anytime a lawman dies in the line of duty, it is sad. And just like typical Government, they use one situation to try and re-invent the wheel. When will we learn that sometimes bad things happen and NOTHING can be done to change that. Who is to say that the bad guy who soaked up 4 shots with the 9mm wouldn't have survived 4 shots with a .45, .40, or .357 sig? It is proven a jacked up individual may or may not respond to being shot like a "normal" person.

    What I am trying to say is that moving to a different caliber isn't necessarily going to stop officers being gunned down. Maybe they should spend more time and money on better body armor for officers? Or more officers period?

    My prayers go out to the family of the fallen, and my continued prayers go out to those who put themselves in harms way for our safety and freedom. God Bless them all!

  5. #49
    Member Array alien319's Avatar
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    I think another reason that some agencies went with the .45 GAP ws because of what everyone else is saying, the fitting in a smaller package, but also, back when these agencies adopted the cartridge Glock was not producing the SF models of the .45 ACP.

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  6. #50
    New Member Array Francis's Avatar
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    While the shooting did happen, you have it a bit wrong. NYSP carried Glock 17's with the New York-1 8lbs trigger. Not 19's. They actually went to buy more GLock 17's. The ones they issued were going to the NY Guard for domestic service. GLock offered them the 45 GAP pistols for free because they needed a major agency to issue them to drum up sales. Not because of any percieved lack of firepower.

  7. #51
    New Member Array Francis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MitchellCT View Post
    Glock gave the guns to the NYSP for publicity.

    When a company offers you guns, leather, mags and so forth for FREE the admin says "OK" and deals with it later.

    It's a short .45ACP round. An overpriced, hard to find short .45ACP round. Yippee. Yawn.
    Bingo!!!!!!1

  8. #52
    Distinguished Member Array skysoldier29's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Francis View Post
    While the shooting did happen, you have it a bit wrong. NYSP carried Glock 17's with the New York-1 8lbs trigger. Not 19's. They actually went to buy more GLock 17's. The ones they issued were going to the NY Guard for domestic service. GLock offered them the 45 GAP pistols for free because they needed a major agency to issue them to drum up sales. Not because of any percieved lack of firepower.
    Its a good plan. These large LE agencies are going to test these guns because they have a bunch more $$$ than the smaller ones T&E of firearms. The smaller agencies will look at these tests and decide to possibly change over to the GAP round because these larger agencies are finding success. If the GAP does pickup success in the LE, the civilian market will start buying the GAP because they want what LE is using. I think Glock wants the end user being the civilian market to pickup on the GAP because they will pay full market value for them. Look at the other Glock models, almost everyone has a Glock of some sort because LE adopted it as their side arm of choice.

  9. #53
    VIP Member Array Rob99VMI04's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mbell1968 View Post
    ", Mel Gibson, "17 in the clip, one in the pipe" "what do you carrry" Danny Glover" Smith and Wesson revolver" Mel Gibson, "yeah, most of the old guys still carry that." That movie opened the general public and law enforcements eyes to the high capacity semi-auto big time. Great movie as well although Mel did WAY to much spray and pray in it.
    Man if your going to quote probably the greatest movie of all time then make sure you do right. What he actually said was:

    "Nine millimeter Beretta, takes fifteen in the mag, one up the pipe, wide ejection port, no feed jams."

    "What do you go in there?"

    "4-inch Smith"

    "Six shooter Huh, a lot of old timers carry those."

    And yes I bought a Beretta because of this movie.
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  10. #54
    New Member Array rkw1786's Avatar
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    Nysp 9mm/45gap

    Sorry about the late reply, during the gunfight the passenger in the Toyota pick up got off the first shots striking AJ as he stood by the drivers window thinking he stopped a traffic violator and not knowing anything about the bank robbery. During the exchange the bad guy who was sitting in the passenger seat got hit in the shoulder, arm and calf. all of these rounds from AJ went through the rear window and cab. One of AJ's 9mm went through the tailgate passed through the front of the box through the cab through the rear of the front seat into the back of the driver and lodged under the skin on the front of his stomach. This is the round that caused the idiots to seek medical attention and ultimately get caught. The passenger during their walk over to the staged get away car took two aimed shots at AJ who at this point was laying by the front of his police cruiser (Tahoe) and basically executed him for no reason. The resulting union demands for a larger caliber were not supported by this particular shooting. The State Police adopted the 45 GAP because the frame is smaller and fits smaller hands better, with basically no loss of ballistics when compared to the standard 45ACP. I am a firm believer that once you meet a minimum caliber threshold (9MM) shot placement determines the outcome over caliber. Off-duty I carry either a Sig 9MM or 40. I also from time to time carry a HK USP 45ACP. On the hot days (two) here in western NY I opt for a Walther 380 with the idea anything is better than nothing. Even though I don't own a Glock it has been a very reliable handgun and is extremely easy to train non-gun people (most of the current Cops on any large department) When the state went to the Glock in the mid to late eighties I was involved in the testing and actually preferred the Sig we tested. Glock offered to give the State the Glocks even up for the 681 with the only requirement the State buy the holsters and ammo from the same vendor. Sig wanted 1+ mil. The Glock I was issued in the Summer of 1988 was US000051 and for the almost twenty years I carried it never experienced a malfunction.

  11. #55
    VIP Member Array mcp1810's Avatar
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    I don't yet but I might soon. Years ago Sig was developing a double stack .45 acp but dropped it when the AWB was passed. The current lineup does not include exactly what I am looking for. I have been in touch with Bruce Grey (who makes 10mm P220s) and asked about doing a classic P226 in.45 gap. He said when he his his backlog caught up he will do it. We figured there is probably not much of a market, but he said every now and then he likes to do some "why not?" projects.
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  12. #56
    Distinguished Member Array Madcap_Magician's Avatar
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    The OP's story says more about ineffective shot placement than it does about caliber. I'm guessing that little short of an intermediate rifle round to the extremities is going to cause immediate incapacitation, so .45 v. 9mm to the foot? Doubtful.

    I'm not saying the officer didn't do his best, maybe he just plain got unlucky, but there isn't a handgun caliber in the world that will instantly stop someone if you shoot him in the foot with it.
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  13. #57
    Member Array mbell1968's Avatar
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    OK, so it wasn't an exact quote but close enough. It has been awhile since I saw the movie...and you are right, one of the best action movies of all time. Mel didn't use hollow points though, only had one to kill himself with, another quote from Danny Glover" man you are not trying to draw a pyscho pension, you are really crazy" Mel Gibson, "well I'm hungry, I'm getting something to eat".

  14. #58
    Member Array mbell1968's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Francis View Post
    While the shooting did happen, you have it a bit wrong. NYSP carried Glock 17's with the New York-1 8lbs trigger. Not 19's. They actually went to buy more GLock 17's. The ones they issued were going to the NY Guard for domestic service. GLock offered them the 45 GAP pistols for free because they needed a major agency to issue them to drum up sales. Not because of any percieved lack of firepower.
    I think the lack of firepower or stopping power had alot to do with it. GunWeek.com
    See the quote by NYSP spokesman .45 GAP was chosen to increase "immediate incapacitiation" and to "maximize safety". It may have been a combination of both the free pistols as well but that is NOT the only reason.

  15. #59
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    The GAP round was invented to allow a smaller grip on a "45" Glock for female and smaller male police officers. With the advent of the Glock SF and Gen4 models the GAPs are relicated to collector pieces. I'm not saying it's not a good gun, but it's just an oddball, non-standard caliber.
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  16. #60
    New Member Array knuckleed's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rob99VMI04 View Post
    I have used the .45 GAP. I think this is an answer to a to a question nobody was asking.

    This caliber also had more to do with GLOCKS pride than practicailty. If you look on all the .40's glock produces you will not find it stamped .40 S&W, same thing with .357 SIG, and .45 ACP.
    Glock stamps .40, .357, and .45 Auto instead of the actual caliber of the gun. IMHO GLOCKS feelings were hurt that .40 S&W and .357 SIG where actually successfully cartridges and they had nothing. Therefore, they bought into this caliber which nobody except a handful of people use. Glock dosn't want any other manufactures name on their guns. Even though these are the actual calibers of the gun. HOwever, all .45 GAP pistol glock produces are stamped GAP.

    I have 2 NYSP troopers on my wifes side of the family, and a good friend that is also a trooper with NYSP. I've asked them about this IIRC they do not carry this caliber it is an option not a requirement.

    Why would you make a fairly large Semi-Auto in a uncommon caliber that holds 10 rounds, then turn around and make a G21 SF in a Caliber that many people love that holds more BB's. I still cannot figure this out.

    I can only think of two Manufactures that chamber a gun in this caliber.

    GLOCK
    Springfield (not even sure if they are currently producing guns in this caliber).

    Ammo is hard to find
    Wide selection not available.
    This caliber will probably be dead in 10 years.

    I think .45 GAP would have been good idea just about 30 years ago.
    I use the 45 gap, i have posed a few times about it, because i bout it just recently. Mine is the glock 39 and it shoots like a beauty. It is a very accurate weapon, well as accurate at the shooter, where you aim is where you will hit. It is approx the same ballistics as the 45 acp, it is a smaller casing infact a fuzz smaller than a 9mm in length. It has the approx ballistics as the 45 acp because it is loaded with higher pressures that equal to a 45 +p round. I am not sure how the older g 37 or 38 were but i can tell you if you fire the 39 ya just might fall in love with it and regardless of what people say i have looked and ammo is still readily available for it.


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