Newbie question regarding 9mm Bonded Bullets

This is a discussion on Newbie question regarding 9mm Bonded Bullets within the Defensive Ammunition & Ballistics forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Originally Posted by MP9NewMexico No I don't, but last I checked, 1/4" bone, i.e., a rib or the sternum, was as dense as car-door thickness ...

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Thread: Newbie question regarding 9mm Bonded Bullets

  1. #16
    VIP Member Array Harryball's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MP9NewMexico View Post
    No I don't, but last I checked, 1/4" bone, i.e., a rib or the sternum, was as dense as car-door thickness steel. Now consider that your attacker will almost certainly not be standing stock-still like a silhouette target on the range. It is highly likely that the bullet will have to go through some bone before reaching the heart or lungs. Or if I'm lucky, maybe I'll score an abdomen hit and cut the aorta or renal arteries.

    Additionally, have you ever seen what happens to a non-bonded bullet passing through auto glass? If not, I recommend researching it. And who's to say I won't be the victim of a violent car-jacking and NEED to shoot through glass to protect myself?
    Like someone else advised, get some good ammo and be on your way. Additionally, I have seen what happens to a non-bonded bullet passing thru car glass, because I have shot thru car glass. Its not all its cracked up to be. Speer gold dots seem to do the job just fine....
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  3. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Harryball View Post
    Like someone else advised, get some good ammo and be on your way. Additionally, I have seen what happens to a non-bonded bullet passing thru car glass, because I have shot thru car glass. Its not all its cracked up to be. Speer gold dots seem to do the job just fine....
    I was shooting a self-healing target and found the jacket of an FMJ round embedded on one side of the target, and the lead core inside the target. I suspect the bullet hit the ground infront of the target, but still, the jacket peeled right off. For target rounds that is fine, but if you want them for defense, bonded is the only way to go, IMO.

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    Find a brand that works and keep it the same.
    I fail to see how mixing rounds for any 'special purpose' helps in a SD moment.
    You don't really think that you're going to be able to count/keep track of what/how many rounds you fire in a couple of seconds with tunnel vision?
    Neither my 'old' brain nor 'old' memory work that fast...but then, I'm not really that fast either. OMOYMV
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    Man I am glad I just use ball in everything. This T rangercorbonDPXgolddotgoldensabresupervelspeer hollow point this is really confusing.

    Find what works in YOUR gun, then worry about what it does to the bad guy. Believe me it won't matter if it is the 1st or 15th bullet fired you keep shooting until he stops what he is doing that caused you to shoot him in the first place.
    "A first rate man with a third rate gun is far better than the other way around". The gun is a tool, you are the craftsman that makes it work. There are those who say "if I had to do it, I could" yet they never go out and train to do it. Don't let stupid be your mindset. Harryball 2013

  6. #20
    VIP Member Array Harryball's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TVille View Post
    I was shooting a self-healing target and found the jacket of an FMJ round embedded on one side of the target, and the lead core inside the target. I suspect the bullet hit the ground infront of the target, but still, the jacket peeled right off. For target rounds that is fine, but if you want them for defense, bonded is the only way to go, IMO.
    Take a look at this. It should make more sense after you read it.

    Understanding "Bonded" Bullets
    Don"t let stupid be your skill set....

  7. #21
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    Actually Gold Dots ARE Bonded and happen to expand very well too. That's part of the reason so many trust them.

    Of all of the expanding "non-bonded" rounds, I trust Federal HST the most. Wicked expansion, but seems to hold up in many of the tests I've seen better than other non bonded rounds through barriers.

  8. #22
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    Staggering seems like a bad idea to me. I load my 9mm's up with Winchester PDX1 124 gr +P.
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    Harryball,

    I'm sorry, but I'm not buying the Buffalo Bore BS. The owner is a jerk. His claims on FPS for products are usually wildly inaccurate; see numerous YouTube videos of individuals shooting his BB loads and chronographing them. Also see tests of non-bonded bullets, especially buffalo bore, fired into various mediums, and how the JHPs he uses tend to shred and fragment.

    I'll stick to the big-name manufacturers, ones who LE/Military trust, personally.

  10. #24
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    I carry 147gr Ranger Bonded rounds. They have worked just fine on four legged predators. Plus they will go through barriers. The thing is pretty much any of the "LEO rounds" will be designed to meet FBI minimum standards. Ranger T, Ranger Bonded, Golden Saber, Gold Dot, HST, and Federal Tactical Bonded will all do the trick.

    Whinchester has a tool on their site for comparing performance of the different Ranger options in each caliber. It has the manufacturer's results for the various types of barrier test required by the FBI. ATK the maker of Federal and Speer has test results on their website as well. Read the info and pick the one you like.
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    Gold Dot 124 short barrels will shoot through glass?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Spirit4earth View Post
    Gold Dot 124 short barrels will shoot through glass?
    Any bullet has the ability to pass through glass, it's what happens to it after it goes through the glass is the issue, whether it yaws off course or has lost so much of its retained weight that it is no longer effective is what the issue and where bonded bullets are superior in weight retention. The bonding process simply is a manufacturing process where the jacket is "bonded" to the core to help retain the bullet weight.

  13. #27
    Senior Member Array hayzor's Avatar
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    I won't make any ammo recommendations except this - shoot something that fires 100% in your gun.
    For me, JHP, FMJ, bonded, etc aren't that different in deterring BG's. Just remember that when the SHTF, you are only going to hit the BG about 1 out of 4 shots (or less). I recommend spending time, money and effort on good training and practice.
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    I shot a Gun Fighting Course two weeks ago. The first 46 rounds were Corbon 115Gr. +P DPX, the next 200 rounds were Remington Golden Saber Bonded +P, the last 200 rounds were Ranger T's in 127GR +P+. All functioned flawlessly with no gun issues in my G-19. I will carry any of these bullits as I have a nice supply of all of them. When I left the firing line, I reloaded my mags with the Ranger T's. Having a selection of very good "Social Ammo" to use comes in handy when only one of the varieties is available to be purchased in the future.
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    I would suggest getting out of "what if" land or "theoreticland" and stop over thinking everything. Find ONE round you are confident in and carry it.

    If you don't think a traditional bullet is going to penetrate a car door or a window , carry a bonded bullet like the Speer Gold Dots you mentioned. There's nothing wrong with them. Keep in mind, pretty much no bullet is going to expand after punching through glass or metal. A bonded bullet is supposed to have an increased percentage of weight retention compared to traditional rounds.

    If you are satisfied with the performance and generally higher expansion likelihood of a well designed non-bonded bullet, carry a non-bonded bullet.

    Don't stagger your rounds. That is something a wannabe tacticool mall ninja would do. A legit tacticool mall ninja would be staggering Extreme Shock and hard cast. You know, for the naked watermelon terrorists in a crowded airplane with attack bears hiding behind car doors . If all of the ammo in your magazine is the same, you'll have the same recoil impulse and point of impact.

    As for me, I carry Federal HSTs 147+P. Excellent performance across the board and well over .70" expansion in denim/gelatin tests.

  16. #30
    Mal
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    Quote Originally Posted by MP9NewMexico View Post
    Also, just out of curiosity, why are "Dutch Loads" discouraged? Is it for feeding reasons?
    I'm curious to hear the answer to this as well...there seems to be a lot of disgust at this...but it's something I do with my 12-Gauge when camping...every other shell is 00-Buck and Slug. I like having the variety.

    My pistols can handle a mixed mag (although I don't do this myself, I see no reason NOT to)...my pistol is very low-tech though, and doesn't monitor what round it is ejecting and compare it to the round it's feeding...it just moves the slide back, pops the brass out and stuffs the next round in. If a round does not have the "oomph" to make the action work, then I imagine I'd have a FTF malfunction no matter what round it was trying to feed.

    I highly doubt in a real shootout (which I have NOT been involved in) I'd tell the difference in recoil or "hand feel" between rounds. I think I'd just be shooting and thinking, "I can't believe this is happening!"

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