Defensive Carry banner

Best 158 Grain 357 load

24K views 30 replies 15 participants last post by  atctimmy 
#1 ·
I am looking for a 158 gr load to use outdoors. I have a new S&W 620 with a 4" barrel. I have bought several boxs of Buffalo Bore 158 gr. 38 +P. I will use these for personal and home defense. Out of a 4" barrel these hit with alot of authority! I also have some 180 grain hard cast I use at night while fishing. There are Mountain Lions where I night fish and that is why I carry them. But the recoil is pretty stout also. I also have some areas where i night fish that I am much more likely to run into two legged problems or wild dogs! I am looking for 158 gr load that might be able to handle everything or be a close compromise?
 
#2 ·
I carry Federal-Premium Hydra-Shoks in my .357mag.

Maybe look into some PMC Gold Starfires- those are pretty good.

Or maybe some of these... Federal Premium - Handgun Details They look pretty nasty.
 
  • Like
Reactions: grouse and DanielC
#9 ·
Only handloads are used in the .357 Magnums around here. The heavier charge weight of 2400 listed in the link below has worked great in Smith & Wesson revolvers of several different frame sizes from K through N along with the Colt Python. That charge weight of 2400 has been worked up with both jacketed hollow points and cast lead semi-wadcutters. It exceeds 1400 fps by a smidgen from my favorite .357 Magnum, a 6-inch Smith & Wesson Model 27 and the big revolver soaks up recoil nicely. Work up the load for yourself and always take any forum advice with a large grain of salt.

.357 Load Question | Elmer Keith Members Area

H110 is another that yields really great velocities for 158 grain jacketed bullets with apparently reasonable pressure levels, at least as discerned by observation. The maximum charge weight for H110 as published in the 1978 Sierra manual gives slightly lower velocities than the 2400 load but nothing on the receiving end will be able to note the difference between the two loads.

A too-dark photo of the Model 27 in full recoil from a 158 grain JHP loaded with 2400, being fired by our youngest son a a target up on the side of a hill at 165 yards. The bullet gets there quite quickly and is pretty flat shooting too.
 
#12 ·
They have the Federal LE 158gr. available at Ammunition to go right now. Does anyone have any experience with that. Thanks for the info bmcgilvray! I may learn how to reload yet? Seems like fun.
Current Federal ammunition may not compare with some from a few years back. I did a chronograph test of factory Federal 158 grain jacketed soft point .357 Magnum ammunition that gave an average velocity of 1437 fps for 10 shots. In digging back through handloading notes kept, it's noted that this was done on May 28th of 1984 and that was a little more than a few years back. Perhaps it was a warm day in late May here in Texas and the ammunition had sat in the sun. A box of Remington 158 grain jacketed hollow point factory loads registered 1372 fps for 10 shots on January 30th of 1983. Temperatures were bound to have been considerably cooler in January. A 6-inch Smith & Wesson Model 27 was used on both occasions.

I've not tested .357 Magnum Buffalo Bore but their +P .38 Special ammunition yields every bit of the velocity they claim for it so their .357 Magnum ammunition is likely pretty rip-roaring as well.

Despite all the hoopla over the 125 grain bullet in the .357 Magnum, I really like the 158 grain bullet weight better or even a bit heavier as may be had in some cast bullet configurations. I'll leave the lighter weight bullets to lesser cartridges like 9mm. I'm sure the 125 grain weight bullets are fine but don't think they are "the answer" as much as their internet reputation suggests.
 
#14 · (Edited)
I am with bmcgilvray on the newer loads being lower powered. The ordinary loads in .357 and 44 mag of today are much tamer than those we used to shoot in the late sixties and early seventies. One of the reasons for it that I have been told of is liability. Back in those days a 357 was built on a much larger frame. Then the lighter weight alloy frames came out and it seems were not as well suited for everyday shooting with those loads.

I even remember letters being sent to a local police dept in the late sixties not to use their newer light weight 357's for target shooting using full house loads. It said to use them with either 38 special rounds or use their older heavier frame guns to qualify with. The newer guns were not meant to be shot so much as just carried.

I believe these new so called extra power loads that are sold today such as buffalo bore are nothing more than what used to be the standard load we used to shoot. They are probably fine in the heavier older style handguns but I have serious doubts about the longevity of the newer lighter framed guns fed a regular diet of these loads.

Some of us used to use lighter loads in certain small framed guns not because we couldn't handle the recoil but because we knew the firearm would not last using hot loads. I think many have forgotten that over the years. They believe that if it fits that is all that matters.
Which is why I believe the manufacturers started downloading them to begin with.

EDIT: Some loading manuals even acknowledge this fact by listing different maximum loads for different firearms of the same caliber.

Michael
 
#15 ·
Good point, mir1m.

That's one of the main reasons I am uninterested in stunted 5-shot .357 Magnum models from any manufacturer. A .357 Magnum revolver ought to have the capability to roundly thrash all other comers of the .355/.357 bore diameter tribe in power delivered to the target and that just isn't practically achieved with comfort and long life with "undernourished," lightweight, shrunken .357 Magnum revolvers with snub barrels. The .357 Magnum cartridge shouldn't have ever been so limited. Tiny .357 Magnums are a stunt in my view.
 
  • Like
Reactions: shooterX
#16 ·
While I am partially in agreement with you I do believe that lighter weight 357 have a legitimate use. Many cops back then felt they needed the penetration that the 1500 fps 158 gr 357 offered. A lightweight platform that was easier to carry on a daily basis gave that to them. They knew that this weapon was more of an emergency use only weapon and not a daily shooter. After all why should they carry a huge N frame S&W that can handle the abuse of everyday shooting when they only needed to shoot it occasionally? They needed a weapon they could easily carry everyday not one that would hold up to thousands of heavy loads being fired through it. For those people who need a daily carry it makes perfect sense to go with the lighter weapon. They just need to realize that there are limits that go with the lighter weight.

Its kind of like my little 44 Charter Arms that I have had for 35 years or more. I know this gun will not hold up to everyday use with the loads I keep in it. Because of that I seldom fire it except for some practice and to use up old ammo. It will however last many a lifetime as what it was intended for. A last resort break glass in case of danger sort of gun.

Michael
 
#18 ·
Another one for handloaded 158 gr with either 2400 or H110.

My hunting loads with 2400 give about 1400 to 1425 fps out of the wifes 4" GP100. Similar velocities are achieved from a buddies S&W 629.

I haven't chronoed them out of my 3" SP101, but they shoot just fine out of it. With the Hogue grip they are not unpleasant to shoot.
 
#20 ·
I have always found the 158gr Hydra Shok to be a very low penetrating load for a 158. It expands and then fragments surprisingly quick for a bullet with a small HP, I guess the little lead post works. If you had thoughts of using it on dangerous critters I'd pick something else. I have a ton of Remington SJHP that has always worked for me.
 
#22 ·
Hey a Nosler and a Gold Dot in the same load! Yeah, that's pretty hefty and ought to do some damage too.

Only kidding.

Seriously, that Nosler 158 grain bullet looks pretty conventional if it is like the 210 grain Nosler jacketed hollow point bullets I used in the .41 Magnum. Don't know what it's claim to fame is.
 
#23 ·
Nosler rounds are partitioned rounds.

They are typically rifle rounds with a polymer tip with a post in the middle of the fragments that are encased in lead. The tip has to have the proper amount of energy on impact to push back into the lead to cause the fragments to split out. Nosler rounds do not just expand. That is a common myth. For shots over 100 yards they almost always expand properly, but under can be an issue.

I currently use a nosler round to hunt deer with. I used to hunt with a .44 mag rifle with hollow points. Hollow points are simple enough and work by expanding after impact leaving a large wound channel. Very effective rounds in their own right.

Nosler rounds don't expand in the same manner, they fragment out if they hit with the proper amount of energy to force the polymer tip back. A common problem when hunting in close is that you can be too close where the bullet will pass through the animal without fragmenting if you don't hit enough mass to push the polymer tip back. I've experienced this on very close range follow up shots (only at this point). It's a physics thing and I don't get all the math behind it.

However, when the round fragments properly, the damage caused is anything but minimal. I had a 2" exit hole on the 7 pt buck I shot at 120 yards this year with my 7mm08. They are an absolutely violent rounds that are extremely effective for killing. You just need to understand their limitations.

Just remember that even the weakest of the centerfire rifle rounds typically have far more energy than the strongest of handgun rounds. I'm not certain how well a nosler round would work for handguns. I have not seen a test of the nosler handgun rounds, and until I do I would not use one. I would want to make certain they actually do what they claim they do.
 
#24 ·
The Nosler .41 Magnum component bullets I've bought are conventional jacketed hollow points with no mention of being a Partition on their labeling.
 
#27 ·
mir1m,

Good points and historically factual.

My old (federal) agency dilly-dallied around with every conceivable .357 Magnum factory round imaginable. At one point, we were even being issued 110 grain rounds. FUN to shoot as they gave you a bang you could hear for miles and a muzzle flash you could see from outer space, but I had very little confidence in the round as a manstopper. That particular round was chosen for its lack of recoil--that made it favorable to the desk-jockeyes and undersized female academy candidates.

I haven't bought nor acquired factory ammunition since leaving law enforcement over two decades ago, but I still have boxes and boxes of Federal 125 gr JHP in .357 Magnum and still regard it as a superb manstopper.

But like my fellow Texan, I'm a fan of the 158 grain bullet. I cast a (lead) 158 gr that I hollow-point and sit on top of 14 grains of 2400 and ignite with a Winchester magnum primer. The powder doesn't really need a magnum primer, but after much load testing, I settled on that particular primer, powder and bullet configuration.

I fear nothing with six of those rounds in the cylinder of my 686 as any time I carry a wheelgun, I carry at least one loaded speedloader as well.

Likewise, the old FBI 158 SWCHP round in .38+P is very effective.

I'm generally a fan of a heavier bullet. I want knockdown or stopping force more than penetration. In other words, I want a round fired from my gun to get the bad guy's physical attention in a hurry. Lightweight deep penetrators don't always do that, as evidenced by how many people have been shot with .22s and .25ACPs and stated they weren't aware for a few moments that they'd even been shot.

I've never read an after-action or hospital interview where a bad guy was shot with a .357 Magnum or .45ACP and stated that he wasn't aware he'd been shot until later. . .

JD
 
#29 ·
Thanks. I think it's a good read, but I've been accused of occasionally being biased. . . :smile:

I'm also a big fan of the .357 Magnum--there are two instances of it being used in the book for self-defense, and it gets the job done in both cases.

Still one of my favorite calibers, along with .44 Special.

JD
 
This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.
Top