Grain Question

This is a discussion on Grain Question within the Defensive Ammunition & Ballistics forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; I have a .40 xDm and carry it daily. When looking on midwayusa website at double tap ammo they have 125gr for $69.99 & 140gr ...

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  1. #1
    Member Array Shiphted's Avatar
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    Grain Question

    I have a .40 xDm and carry it daily. When looking on midwayusa website at double tap ammo they have 125gr for $69.99 & 140gr for $68.99. Well I've always thought higher grain more power. And from what I've read double tap ammo is best for PP. so question is why is the less grain more expensive. I know it's only a dollar, but is there a reason for this?

    Thanks.


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  3. #2
    New Member Array Twosocks's Avatar
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    Not sure what you Mean by Higher Grain More power but lighter bullets will travel faster with the same powder charge than a heavier bullet. As to why more expensive, I have noticed that in other brands of ammo also. Only speculation here but maybe more powder.

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    VIP Member Array Smitty901's Avatar
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    Cost has more to do with supply and demand .
    here you always find 40 ammo lower than 9mm why demand.

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    Senior Member Array jem102's Avatar
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    Depends on what you are looking for performance wise. Loaded to the same chamber pressures: A heavy bullet in the same caliber will retain energy/velocity over a longer distance. They also have higher sectional density allowing greater penetration at distance. The lighter bullet is faster in the short run and will likely create a larger temporary wound channel. It would also technically produce less recoil. I say technically as in my personal experience I can control 165 and 180 gr. bullets better than 155 gr. bullets. I have never shot anything lighter in .40 S&W.

    As a civilian "I" think 3-5...Gun fights take place at 3-5 yards, with 3-5 shots exchanged and last 3-5 seconds before one combatant is down and/or one or both combatants can flee, take cover, cavalry arrives what have you. So...a lighter bullet?

    As a State Trooper/Highway Patrol officer I would have to add in the consideration of auto glass, barricades and accurate stopping power at 25 yards and beyond for a sustained fight against multiple combatants. So...a heavy bullet?

    FWIW I have had myself timed with 180's and 155's in both my Glock 27 and 23. The average time over 3 strings of 5 rounds each, to keep both weights center mass at the 7 yard line, is right at 7 seconds. So I split the difference and carry 165 gr. Gold Dots in either gun. I find them to be very accurate, very manageable, easy to find and at least reasonable in cost YMMV.
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    Member Array lyodbraun's Avatar
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    Save your money and Buy either Winchester Ranger T's or Federal HST's works just as good if not better than those high dollar Double taps, not to mention places like double tap uaually use bullets like Gold dots, for there rounds, with other brands you will be able to afford to practice with your carry ammo.... just my .02cents...

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    Member Array Fisher10's Avatar
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    I have read reports that Double Tap ammo often has an issue not reaching their advertised velocities, which are usually their selling point.
    Just because one round has a heavier weight bullet doesn't mean it has "more power". Heavier bullets will sometimes penetrate deeper, but with some designs they penetrate less because they have greater expansion than their lighter weight counterpart. It's all about bullet construction and velocities. A heavier bullet won't travel as fast as a lighter bullet. In order to keep chamber pressures within specifications, manufacturers have to put less powder in the cartridge with a heavier bullet, so it isn't like you're just pushing more lead at about the same velocity. Do your research when looking for a carry round.

    The tiny difference in cost is supply and demand. One bullet design might cost DT a tiny bit more than another one too.

    Unless Double Tap has a unique load that will actually reach advertised velocities, I wouldn't spend the money on their ammo. I first recommend Federal HSTs and then Speer Gold Dots. They'll be much cheaper and have a great reputation. 50rd - 40 HST 180 grain Federal hollow point ammo P40HST1 | SGAmmo.com

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    VIP Member Array glockman10mm's Avatar
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    First of all, the term " grain" for bullet weight is incorrect. It applys to volume as in powder charge. An example would be 15 " grains" of Alliant 2400 under a 125 " weight" bullet.

    But the weight of the bullet can make up for a lesser powder charge by elongating it and giving it better or at least equal penetrating qualities as a lighter bullet pushed hard.

    The energy of a bullet, is just another way of determining it's ability to do work. There are two ways to get there; mass or speed. The need for speed in smaller caliber bullets is nothing more than an attempt to make small calibers act like bigger calibers in terminal performance applications.
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    Grain is a measurement of weight/mass, not volume. It is equivalent to just under 65 milligrams.
    DrahtDog likes this.
    A man fires a rifle for many years, and he goes to war. And afterward he turns the rifle in at the armory, and he believes he's finished with the rifle. But no matter what else he might do with his hands - love a woman, build a house, change his son's diaper - his hands remember the rifle.

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    Member Array DrahtDog's Avatar
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    This is correct. Grains are nothin more than a unit of measurement for weight. In 40 cal usually the top performers are 155 or 165 grn high velocity, quality hollowpoints. Hst tactical, ranger t's, sxts, gold dots are all excellent. Why is a heavier bullet more expensive? It takes more lead and copper to make one.

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    VIP Member Array glockman10mm's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OPFOR View Post
    Grain is a measurement of weight/mass, not volume. It is equivalent to just under 65 milligrams.
    Yep, I am wrong. It is a measurement. Being a handloader, I always think in terms of volume for a given powder charge.
    Ignorance is a long way from stupid, but left unchecked, can get there real fast.

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    Well, volume is also a measurement, just not a measurement of weight. :) And I am not (yet) a handloader, but I can't imagine that powder charges are measured in volume, either? That goes against everything I have read...
    A man fires a rifle for many years, and he goes to war. And afterward he turns the rifle in at the armory, and he believes he's finished with the rifle. But no matter what else he might do with his hands - love a woman, build a house, change his son's diaper - his hands remember the rifle.

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    Member Array DrahtDog's Avatar
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    What he means is he calibrates a specific powder to volume. Only one brand and type of powder. He throws a charge then weighs it. Then he adjusts. He repeats until its consistent with the weight he wants. Its a shortcut used in volume reloading its very close to exact. But the only way to be exact is weighing each and every powder charge. So your are absolutely right.

    This method is for adjusting a powder measurement on a progressive reloader. Bushings can be used on shotshell loading, or dippers or little scoops for single stage presses.

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    VIP Member Array glockman10mm's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OPFOR View Post
    Well, volume is also a measurement, just not a measurement of weight. :) And I am not (yet) a handloader, but I can't imagine that powder charges are measured in volume, either? That goes against everything I have read...
    Measure powder density in by cubic centimeters, as in using powder dippers instead of a weighted charge, which I do most of the time. And when working up precise loads for extreme accuracy potential, I combine both techniques.
    Ignorance is a long way from stupid, but left unchecked, can get there real fast.

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    Got it. Mostly. ;)
    A man fires a rifle for many years, and he goes to war. And afterward he turns the rifle in at the armory, and he believes he's finished with the rifle. But no matter what else he might do with his hands - love a woman, build a house, change his son's diaper - his hands remember the rifle.

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    VIP Member Array glockman10mm's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DrahtDog View Post
    What he means is he calibrates a specific powder to volume. Only one brand and type of powder. He throws a charge then weighs it. Then he adjusts. He repeats until its consistent with the weight he wants. Its a shortcut used in volume reloading its very close to exact. But the only way to be exact is weighing each and every powder charge. So your are absolutely right.
    Well, yes and no. What i am actually doing is measuring the actual density of the powder as it can vary from can to can. Digital scales of the day take alot of the math out, such as dividing the weight of the powder by the cc to get a density level, but I sometimes get stuck in the past. It is still not uncommon for different lots of powder to vary in density, and thus perform differently.

    But yeah, what you said.
    Ignorance is a long way from stupid, but left unchecked, can get there real fast.

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