Caliber is irrelevant in a gun fight

This is a discussion on Caliber is irrelevant in a gun fight within the Defensive Ammunition & Ballistics forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Originally Posted by 357and40 Welcome to the caliber war... All I know is that if I am squaring off against someone and I have a ...

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Thread: Caliber is irrelevant in a gun fight

  1. #31
    Member Array USPatriot's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 357and40 View Post
    Welcome to the caliber war...

    All I know is that if I am squaring off against someone and I have a choice of any rock in the quarry to hit them with, I will go for one the size of a softball over one the size of a #2 pencil eraser any day...
    Exactly. Amidst all the talk on terminal ballistics, & the rapidity of shots fired by a 9mm as opposed to a .40 or .45, I find that one thing gets continually lost. A bigger bullet makes a bigger hole. I know, I know flesh has a tendency to close up so the diameter of the wound tends to be similar regardless of caliber. However, the bigger the bullet, the more surface area it takes up & therefore the greater the chance that something vital will be struck. Granted the difference in size between say a 9mm & a .45 is not so large as to make that huge of a difference, never the less, there is a difference. A difference that could mean hitting an artery or vital & not hitting. I'll choose anything that increases my chances of winning. Many small advantages equal one big advantage.

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  3. #32
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    The latest edition of the NRA's Rifleman magazine actually has an excellent story on this very topic. It appears to be an unbiased review of a variety of how self defense rounds performed when shot into 10 inch gelatin. Kind of surprising how some of the most popular, and heavily marketed, didn't perform as well as the competition. Definitely made me rethink my SD round choice.
    Last edited by Orangeman; August 23rd, 2012 at 09:36 PM. Reason: Grammar

  4. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by LkWd_Don View Post
    As the whole of the statement is not accurate, I would disagree with it. There are far too many folks who are dead that were part of an officer involved shooting where they either were not armed or never had a firearm in their hand when they were shot. So they did not initiate and the officer if he was being reactive at all to seeing a firearm, over reacted.

    As far as the topic of this thread goes, I would agree that Caliber as well as type of bullet is very critical to the outcome. A .45 FMJ might end up being a through and through in a non-critical location (like upper right shoulder) where a .357Mag JHP hitting the same location might fully incapacitate due to the extreme damage it could cause.
    I take it you are not an LE, and just speaking some perceptive point of view.
    Ignorance is a long way from stupid, but left unchecked, can get there real fast.

  5. #34
    481
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    Quote Originally Posted by glockman10mm View Post
    An officer is most always on the reaction side of a situation. The suspect always has the initiative. This makes a big difference.
    Quote Originally Posted by LkWd_Don View Post
    As the whole of the statement is not accurate, I would disagree with it.
    glockman10mm hit this one outta da' park.

    When we (LEOs) have to react to the stimulus of someone drawing, pointing, and firing a gun at us, we are far behind the reactionary curve because our reaction time is not instantaneous. It takes about 2/10ths of a second to process the stimulus (processing delay) and about one and a half seconds to physically react- all of this occuring while the gun is pointed at us (it's the stimulus that we are reacting to). In that time, an assailant can fire between two and six rounds and we (the LEO) have yet to pull the trigger.

    Action beats reaction. Always has. Always will.
    Last edited by 481; August 24th, 2012 at 01:12 AM.
    nedrgr21 likes this.
    My favorite "gun" book-

    QUANTITATIVE AMMUNITION SELECTION

  6. #35
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    The BG also does not have to worry about an internal investigation, media scrutiny and his Shot placement as in shooting a man in the back as he tries to get away.

  7. #36
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    Originally Posted by LkWd_Don

    "There are far too many folks who are dead that were part of an officer involved shooting..."




    We're not tiptoeing around the fine line of bashing lawmen, are we?
    “No possible rapidity of fire can atone for habitual carelessness of aim with the first shot.”

    Theodore Roosevelt, The Wilderness Hunter, 1893

  8. #37
    Ex Member Array ComplexKaos's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bmcgilvray View Post
    "There are far too many folks who are dead that were part of an officer involved shooting..."

    We're not tiptoeing around the fine line of bashing lawmen, are we?
    It's not like he's lying.

    There are a lot of people dead because of some officers with itchy trigger fingers and there was no gun or any kind of weapon. Some stories of reaching for the waistband are true and others are lies and that's the truth.

  9. #38
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    The question now is: Are you willing to bash lawmen?
    “No possible rapidity of fire can atone for habitual carelessness of aim with the first shot.”

    Theodore Roosevelt, The Wilderness Hunter, 1893

  10. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by LkWd_Don View Post
    As the whole of the statement is not accurate, I would disagree with it. There are far too many folks who are dead that were part of an officer involved shooting where they either were not armed or never had a firearm in their hand when they were shot. So they did not initiate and the officer if he was being reactive at all to seeing a firearm, over reacted.
    That's ridiculous. Whether they weren't armed or didn't have a weapon actually in hand is irrelevant if their actions caused the officers to perceive they had a weapon or were reaching for a weapon. Why in the world should LEO's have to wait to be fired upon before eliminating a threat? It's real simple, when an LEO tells you not to move, don't freakin' move; when they tell you to drop whatever is in your hand(s), drop it.

  11. #40
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    Ha, ha, ha, ha, my Dad can beat up your Dad....
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  12. #41
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    This thread is done to a turn.
    “No possible rapidity of fire can atone for habitual carelessness of aim with the first shot.”

    Theodore Roosevelt, The Wilderness Hunter, 1893

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