Which is more important in ballistics? - Page 3

Which is more important in ballistics?

This is a discussion on Which is more important in ballistics? within the Defensive Ammunition & Ballistics forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; ladies & Gentlemen: quite frankly - 'delivered energy' - is the key after all, an open postal stamp at 2000 fps will do little to ...

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  1. #31
    Member Array Tayopo's Avatar
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    ladies & Gentlemen: quite frankly - 'delivered energy' - is the key after all, an open postal stamp at 2000 fps will do little to stop a bg, nor will a needle. <-extrememe examples.

    Don jose de La Mancha Tayopa
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  2. #32
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    Tayopo;

    You're smarter 'n you look.

    My personal extereme example is a thrown mosquito leg.
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  3. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by imthduke View Post
    In a defensive rd for a handgun which is more important to consider....muzzle velocity or muzzle energy?
    You forgot one.

    Quantity

    You need enough to stop the threat. Whether that is one properly placed .22

    or four misses and one solid hit with a .45 the amount of muzzle energy or how fast it is moving is irrelevant if you do not hit something vital.

    Today’s ammo is very comparable in most of your modern defensive calibers and loads; if you do your part they are all capable of doing theirs.

    Find one that shoot consistently well out of your choice of gun and call it a day on that matter.

    Then spend your energy, time, and curiosity on training.
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  4. #34
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    People die from a single stab wound from a 4 inch knife, live through 5 rounds of .357 magnum and even take several steps, standing up right after being hit 20 times with a .40S&W.

    Sounds to me like shot placement is the important factor in the grand scheme of things. Also, like old vet said, the ballistic gel blocks pretty much look the same regardless of what was just shot through it.

  5. #35
    Senior Member Array DocT65's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by imthduke View Post
    In a defensive rd for a handgun which is more important to consider....muzzle velocity or muzzle energy?
    The correct answer is this.....shot placement. Rapid incapacitation and death only occurs with the abrupt disruption or destruction of a component of the central nervous system or a major vascular structure resulting in rapid hemorrhage and loss of blood pressure. I've seen this done with a .44 Mag and a .22 LR.

    If you review data published by Drs. Fackler and Roberts, most of the ballistics work has been done on popular handgun calibers. The most important thing to remember is to know your weapon and practice, the laws of physics take care of the rest.
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  6. #36
    VIP Member Array Bad Bob's Avatar
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    I believe it is a combination of ME and KE. We know it takes energy to do work. We know that the same bullet at a higher velocity does more damage (ME). KE allows for deeper penetration.

    You can throw all the mosquito legs and postage stamps you want, but it does not matter. It's like the golden gloves boxer who decided to fight me one night in El Paso, he hit me 8 or 9 times until I picked him up and slammed him into the truck. He literally was so much smaller than me he could not hit me hard enough to hurt me (light featherweight).

    In 3 decades on the street in some of the toughest places in our country I have seen a lot of people shot, with a lot of different things. Actually one of the scariest things I saw was a guy beat to death with a bumper jack, one hit. That is why I carry the most powerful gun I can conceal and shoot well. You get no second chance, no do over.
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  7. #37
    Distinguished Member Array Arborigine's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mike1956 View Post
    There, at last, conclusive proof that my caliber is the one to carry.
    But, of course, you are "The ONE". The rest of us are mere mortals and have to deal with the laws of physics until POTUS signs an executive order abolishing them. Until then,,,,,



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  8. #38
    Senior Member Array dV8r's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by imthduke View Post
    In a defensive rd for a handgun which is more important to consider....muzzle velocity or muzzle energy?
    They are both equal, and right behind shot placement.
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  9. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by lyodbraun View Post
    Shot placement,.....
    Shot placement

    Shot placement

    Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk 2

    As this says^ and my signature says ACCURACY ALWAYS WINS!

    I believe Deeper penetration is better in long term. If your bullet is not doing some internal damage it is no good. The shallower damage from better muzzle energy doesn't help you out if it is not hitting the vitals, Lungs, heart, spinal cord etc.
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  10. #40
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    I would have to say that in terms of importance, muzzle velocity and muzzle energy fade into the background compared to terminal effects. And there are no terminal effects if the shot does not hit the target. So really the important part is shot placement. I still say you should shoot the smallest, weakest, lowest recoil round that will still stop the target.

  11. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by imthduke View Post
    In a defensive rd for a handgun which is more important to consider....muzzle velocity or muzzle energy?
    Your aim and accuracy.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spec View Post
    I believe Deeper penetration is better in long term. If your bullet is not doing some internal damage it is no good. The shallower damage from better muzzle energy doesn't help you out if it is not hitting the vitals, Lungs, heart, spinal cord etc.
    I agree. Penetration is the most important aspect of terminal performance- expansion is nice if you can get it, too.
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  13. #43
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    An adult can fully function for 15 seconds after having the entirety of the heart and aorta destroyed. I can run 100 meters in 15 seconds, so can someone intent on killing you. CNS is the ONLY way to instant drop. Severing the spinal cord, especially via rifle shot would be pretty effective I think.

    Quote Originally Posted by 40Bob View Post
    I just find it funny that the same guy starts the same discussion on several forums at the same time. Not just once.
    Eh, get all the opinions you can.
    As we used to teach in the spook business, carry a 25 if it makes you feel good, but do not ever load it. If you load it you may shoot it. If you shoot it you may hit somebody, and if you hit somebody - and he finds out about it - he may be very angry with you. -- Jeff Cooper

  14. #44
    Senior Member Array imthduke's Avatar
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    ---Quote (Originally by 40Bob)---
    I just find it funny that the same guy starts the same discussion on several forums at the same time. Not just once.
    ---End Quote---
    Eh, get all the opinions you can.

    I am glad to provide some comic relief for some. I just find it funny that some might think all the post are required reading.

    I would like all the opinions and info I can gather is the reason.
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  15. #45
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    "I can run 100 meters in 15 seconds..."

    Hmmm...I'm not much of a threat. from 100 meters away even with heart and aorta intact for that 15 seconds would be a whipping.
    Charter Member of the DC .41 LC Society "Get heeled! No really"

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