Which is more important in ballistics? - Page 4

Which is more important in ballistics?

This is a discussion on Which is more important in ballistics? within the Defensive Ammunition & Ballistics forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Originally Posted by 40Bob I believe it is a combination of ME and KE . We know it takes energy to do work. We know ...

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  1. #46
    Distinguished Member Array Hoganbeg's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 40Bob View Post
    I believe it is a combination of ME and KE. We know it takes energy to do work. We know that the same bullet at a higher velocity does more damage (ME). KE allows for deeper penetration.

    You can throw all the mosquito legs and postage stamps you want, but it does not matter. It's like the golden gloves boxer who decided to fight me one night in El Paso, he hit me 8 or 9 times until I picked him up and slammed him into the truck. He literally was so much smaller than me [B]he could not hit me hard enough to hurt me (light featherweight)[/B].
    I believe you'll find that Muzzle Energy is Kinetic energy--measured at the muzzle.

    Don't make the mistake of thinking a small person cannot be an effective fighter. While weight does matter, it is not the main determinant. Your antagonist that night in El Paso just wasn't choosing the right targets. Boxing is not fighting, it is a game. Although some of the training is useful, it conditions the practitioner to avoid hitting the most disabling targets while denying him the use of the entire hand and the rest of the body's weapons.


  2. #47
    VIP Member Array Bad Bob's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hoganbeg View Post
    Don't make the mistake of thinking a small person cannot be an effective fighter. While weight does matter, it is not the main determinant. Your antagonist that night in El Paso just wasn't choosing the right targets. Boxing is not fighting, it is a game. Although some of the training is useful, it conditions the practitioner to avoid hitting the most disabling targets while denying him the use of the entire hand and the rest of the body's weapons.
    That was his problem, I am a fighter not a boxer.
    My rifle and pistol are tools, I am the weapon.

    “Moral indignation is jealousy with a halo.”
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  3. #48
    Member Array FLArmadillo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bmcgilvray View Post
    "I can run 100 meters in 15 seconds..."

    Hmmm...I'm not much of a threat. from 100 meters away even with heart and aorta intact for that 15 seconds would be a whipping.
    Haha, I certainly wouldn't WANT to sprint 100 meters, and with heart and aorta punched out, I'd be pretty much combat ineffective at that point. Just pointing out the physical capabilities of an adult intent on hurting you, whether you have a .22 or a 12ga.
    As we used to teach in the spook business, carry a 25 if it makes you feel good, but do not ever load it. If you load it you may shoot it. If you shoot it you may hit somebody, and if you hit somebody - and he finds out about it - he may be very angry with you. -- Jeff Cooper

  4. #49
    VIP Member Array SmokinFool's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GunTrooper View Post
    I would have to say that in terms of importance, muzzle velocity and muzzle energy fade into the background compared to terminal effects. And there are no terminal effects if the shot does not hit the target. So really the important part is shot placement. I still say you should shoot the smallest, weakest, lowest recoil round that will still stop the target.
    And since we don't know ahead of time what target we may need to defend ourselves from, I say carry the biggest, most powerful, round you can shoot effectively/accurately. Of course there are some self imposed exceptions to this, depending on circumstances. I sometimes carry my LCR. I hope I never encounter a really large attacker during those times.

  5. #50
    Member Array Tayopo's Avatar
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    HOLA 40 bob: Ya big --XXX--- - , heheh, agreed, But you will have to admit that if those hits had been directed to yer family's jeweles, your throat, or even open fingers to your eyes, it might have been far different. Me, chicken, I hurt too easily, soooo I rely upon the universal equalizer.

    You also posted -->You can throw all the mosquito legs and postage stamps you want, but it does not matter.
    ------------------------------
    That was in answer to the ballistic question, which does not include the physical placement of the projectile.


    Don jose de La Mancha

  6. #51
    Member Array patrol's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by imthduke View Post
    In a defensive rd for a handgun which is more important to consider....muzzle velocity or muzzle energy?
    The caliber and round that will create the most bleeding and penetrate the needed body mass in order to accomplish this feat. Muzzle Velocity is Muzzle Energy matter more in use of a rifle in shooting targets of greater range...so to answer your question as it relates to a handgun" ....neither.
    If you can read this thank a teacher. If it is written in English thank a Marine.

  7. #52
    Member Array WillyNilly's Avatar
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    If the handgun could deliver the energy and the velocity of a rifle then the hydraulic shock alone will take the fight out of the BG.

  8. #53
    Senior Member Array SgtRick's Avatar
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    None of it matters if you can't hit your target.

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    Iraq 2004 to 2011.
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  9. #54
    VIP Member Array glockman10mm's Avatar
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    Smaller lighter bullets need speed. Bigger heavier bullets dont.

    Muzzle energy information is the scientific mathematics to make small bullets act like big ones.
    Ignorance is a long way from stupid, but left unchecked, can get there real fast.

  10. #55
    VIP Member Array Bad Bob's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by glockman10mm View Post
    Smaller lighter bullets need speed. Bigger heavier bullets dont.

    Muzzle energy information is the scientific mathematics to make small bullets act like big ones.
    Almost, but not quite. Hunting for meat is better with big slow bullets than lighter faster bullets because you don't get the bloodshot meat. For self defense It does not matter as long as the threat is stopped.
    My rifle and pistol are tools, I am the weapon.

    “Moral indignation is jealousy with a halo.”
    - H. G. Wells -

  11. #56
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    My favorite "gun" book-

    QUANTITATIVE AMMUNITION SELECTION

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