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What are your thoughts about using frangible ammo for self defense? The scenario would be within a residence to lessen the chance of a round exiting the premises and injuring a bystander. Under consideration would be MagSafe, Glaser, Remington Desintegrater and similar loadings.
I have not considered using it and I have not seen much chatter on forums where folks are using it.
I would be more afraid that it would not properly penaetrate a BG and stop him quickly than I would about over penetration.
i carry one magsafe, in the tube. conventional ammo for the other 13 rounds.
I would not carry it. "Magsafe", I dont want safe. I want dangerous, very dangerous. If a bad guy is on the other side of my bedroom door, breaking through with an ax, I want to blast through the door, through his heavy leather jacket, through his sternum, and into this heart.
My primary concern, too. I have yet to see a frangible round that I'd trust my life to.Quote:
Originally Posted by pgrass101
Just stick to using a good premium JHP.
There are 2 types of frangibles. Bullets that have a jacket and are filled with shot and bullets that are compressed tin/copper.
The bullets made from compressed tin/copper powder will NOT disintegrate in flesh. They would act just like FMJ in flesh. They require contact with a hard (metallic) object to begin fragmenting. These are designed to reduce ricochet hazards when shooting steel plates at close ranges.
I am not interested in any kind of a specialty fragmenting round. I want more penetration, something with a proven track record (L.E. usage) and something that doesn't cost $3 per round.
If I needed something that would give somewhat shallow penetration (<10"), it would be a traditional hollow point at a light weight and high velocity.
I carry Federal HSTs, heavy for caliber or Gold Dots for my .380.
Only one type of hit will physiologically stop a person instantly, and that is neurological – brainstem, upper spine, etc. Outside of that placement, after a great enough loss of blood pressure, the body will shutdown. That could take several minutes to occur. Either one requires hitting the applicable vitals. 12” penetration in ballistic gelatin is the accepted minimum standard.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rockymonster
Many people stop the fight after being shot for psychological reasons, not physiological. Your plan must be for the latter.
In short, I would not use it. What's the caliber in question here?
Tell us how you really feel lol.Quote:
Originally Posted by _Hawkeye_
In all reality some people that live in apartments where a round could penetrate into the next apartment can have legitimate concerns,There are pros and cons,In my house at night my first gun I grab is a 12 gauge shotty with 00 buck,can you say Ass whooping
There are very few options for civilian frangible ammo all expensive and none terribly relyable i carry remington golden sabre JHP in my personal carry gun.if you are seriously worried about over penetration i suggest you switch to a .22 or .380 hollowpoint they just bounce around and make a horrible mess inside the body.
Years ago I and many others carried Glaser's in our duty weapons. The theory behind them was sound massive tissue destruction, multiple wound cavities and so on. We often carried stacked mags or what was mentioned carry a Glaser in the chamber followed by conventional ammunition.
The problem, if you consider it one, was that these were designed to have rapid expansion with a lot of damage in flesh. Should the person be wearing a heavy jacket or layered clothing the round would not penetrate. The simple answer of course was to fire a second round but in worst case scenario you may only get one round off before being hit yourself and are not able to fire again.
Stacking mags with different rounds created the same basic problem. You may not have the needed round ready to go in the chamber so you either had to fire until you reached the correct round or eject the live rounds until you got to what you wanted. The major problem with this was the same as stated above and that it took time to do.
Just like the discussions revolving around alternating slugs and buckshot in a mag tube you never seem to have the right round right at that moment and it can be nearly impossible to count rounds to yourself and say ok next one is a slug and so on.
Personally I would stick with a quality SD round all the way through and make sure you are proficient enough to hit the target. Yes a round could penetrate a wall or whatever but many good SD rounds in the medium velocity range will slow down, clog up, start expanding and not penetrate. High velocity pistol rounds, generally speaking, may clog with debris and take on the characteristics of a FMJ round and may go through.
Remember there are two main parts of a gunfight. The first battle is to survive, the second is what comes after.
This is simply my opinion, but I feel that using an inferior self defense round (and frangible's ARE inferior, please don't argue this) because you're worried about something that 'might', 'could', or 'may' happen is silly. Think about what 'might' happen if you don't properly get rid of the bad guy.
I always see the videos of the bullets disintigrating when hitting the steel plates, but how about sheetrock on interior walls?
To my understanding, there is no documented case on the books of a round ever going completely through one person, and killing a second person behind him with a handgun. That said, I would concentrate on shot placement and accuracy. The overwhelming majority of defensive encounters involving a handgun take place at a range of 3 to 7 yards, and happen within the span of about the same number of seconds according to active and former police officers to whom I've spoken. I'd stick with the most effective round you can carry, which for a handgun typically would be a sellf-defense or LE round like the Cor-Bon, Speer Gold Dot, HST, SXT, Ranger T-series and PDX1 hollow points.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rockymonster
I've got some Glasers, I picked them up a while ago, laying around because the guy at the ammo store suggested them. I have yet to even take them out of the box. I just don't feel that comfortable that they will do the job. Granted, they are .357 Magnum loads so, they may penetrate...or not :blink:
I think that I'll just stick to my G19 and leave the wheel gun in the safe.
The round in question is 9mm. And for the record, I agree with the consensus in this thread. I appreciate the input, thanks folks.