A higher velocity can generate higher energy, since kinetic energy is a function of the velocity squared.
However, your post prompted me to look, and I see no 185 grain +P rounds catalogued by Winchester, Remington, Federal, Hornady or Speer. What +P 185s are you aware of?
I have all sorts of 185 grain +P, please don't call my bluff and make me dig it all out.
Here is some Remington Golden Sabers, just to prove my point, I also have some CCI/Speer Gold dots in 185 +P.
No - velocity/light weight is purely for more kinetic energy. Heavier bullets have more momentum, so they penetrate better. (In general. There are exceptions and extremes of course)
I don't mean to high jack the thread but maybe I can get an answer here.
I was told to use a heavier bullet to raise the point of impact. I hand roll my own
and was hitting low using 200 gr .45 Rainier plated bullets. I've recently loaded
some 230 gr but have yet to range test them ( outdoor range and the weather
has been really cold ).
I don't get it ??? Just an old dog trying to learn a new trick.
The theory is the heavier, slower bullet spends more time in the barrel upon firing, so the barrel rises more under recoil before the bullet exits--thus rising the point of impact. I suppose it's true, but at 7 yards I haven't seen a noticeable difference.
Theory is as I understand it from what ive read is faster = more energy and more reliable expansion. Didnt write the stuff just what ive read. Seemed to make sense. If thats whats on the counter when I need ammo ill carry em in the 45.
I've tested the Remington 185 +p Golden Saber in denim covered wetpack out of full size 1911, Commander, and Officer's size. With all three guns, it expanded well but did not penetrate as well as any of 230JHPs tested (Rem 230GS, Fed 230 HS, Win 230JHP). Velocities averaged 1140fps, 1100fps and 1070fps respectively. Recoil/muzzle blast was much more than the 230s and I would not want to use them in any of my 1911s. They do make a good coyote load for my 45 Blackhawk convertable.
I has some 185+p in a G30SF I used to own. It was quite snappy. I have no idea if it was any better than any other 45ACP but the the price tag implied that it was guaranteed to turn what ever it hit into vapor!:tongue:
Thanks everyone! I will stick with 230! Was just curious. I use the 147 grain HST in 9mm also. The only gun I experiment with is my 357. Mostly because it is so versitle and it is fun! But I use 38+P in it for home defense.
I ran across this while doing some other reading you may find it of use
185 grain Winchester FMJ : 910 Feet Per Second
185 grain Remington JHP : 1015 Feet Per Second
200 grain Speer FMJ : 975 Feet Per Second
230 grain Federal FMJ : 845 Feet Per Second
230 grain Ultramax JHP : 850 Feet Per Second
I likewise carry the Barnes Tac-XP (XPB) bullet in the form of the Corbon 185 gr +P DPX. The 185 gr. +P loading penetrated deeper than the 230 gr +P HST according to the following link:
.45 ACP:
Barnes XPB 185 gr JHP (copper bullet)
Federal HST 230 gr JHP (P45HST2)
Federal HST 230 gr +P JHP (P45HST1)
Federal Tactical 230 gr JHP (LE45T1)
Speer Gold Dot 230 gr JHP
Speer Gold Dot 230 gr +P JHP
Winchester Ranger-T 230 gr JHP (RA45T)
Winchester Ranger-T 230 gr +P JHP (RA45TP)
Notes:
-- Obviously, clone loads using the same bullet at the same velocity work equally well (ie. Black Hills ammo using Gold Dot bullets, Corbon loads using Barnes XPB bullets, etc…)
What's more, a ten shot chrono average for an XD Service/4" clocked the Corbon 185 gr +P DPX at 1094 fps which is just a little shy of Dr. Roberts test(s). Most importantly, it feeds/functions reliably in my XD Service in .45.
The 185 gr. might hit closer to POA on some pistols.
The 185 gr. may produce less recoil.
I handload the 185 Hornady XTP to an average 970 fps (matches advertised factory velocity) out of my Glock 30 SF.
The Winchester Ranger T 230 gr. averages 874 fps out of my Glock 30 SF.
185 gr @ 970 fps = 387# KE / PF 179
230 gr @ 874 fps = 390# KE / PF 201
I can certainly notice the difference in recoil with a power factor of 179 vs 201 out of the same pistol.
Since I prefer the flush fitting and non-pinky pinching 9 round magazine, recoil minimization is important.
Less mass/weight plus more power behind it (+P) makes for higher muzzle velocity. A lighter, faster bullet should improve penetration, although this isn't always the case.
My understanding is that the older bullet designs needed the velocity from a 5'' barrel for expansion to take place. Afte many of the more modern 4'' 45s became popular the 185gr allegedly expanded better from the shorter tubes and penetrated less in the body which was desireable at the time. In the 80's and 90's light weight bullets were in style in all callibers. Now we've come full circle and deep penetrating bullets are now back in style.
I remember when the 185's came out it was i think an early attempt to get an .45 ACP to exspand drive a lightweight HP fast enough and maybe it would open up. Back then magnum revolver rounds got all the glory remember Dirty Harry? So anything below 1,000 fps was just to slow to be taken seriously.
I do belive shooters found the lighter bullet recoiled less so they could shoot a .45 more accurately so maybe that's why its still around?
I really have no Idea why the 185 grain .45 ACP is still with us today other than the current rage for 3 & 3.5 inch barrels. That is the short barrels will burn less powder & lower velocity with the heavy bullets so maybe the 185's make a .45 more controlable with at least a chance of expanion.
I feel if I want a lighter bullet than a 230 grain or even a 200 I will just move to a smaller caliber.
My carry pistol is always loaded with the 185gr Barnes bullets....Same sized hole but better expansion at higher velocities. I may be giving up a little on penetration, but it is worth it to me.
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