Stopping power.

Stopping power.

This is a discussion on Stopping power. within the Defensive Ammunition & Ballistics forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Bmcgilvray started a topic on old vs. new bullets. That thread is here... http://www.defensivecarry.com/forum/...ts-better.html I found the thread very thought provoking and started on a ...

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Thread: Stopping power.

  1. #1
    VIP Member Array Harryball's Avatar
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    Stopping power.

    Bmcgilvray started a topic on old vs. new bullets. That thread is here...Expanding Handgun Bullets: Better? What's Better?

    I found the thread very thought provoking and started on a mission to find more information. For those interested, I carry a .45 and a 9mm my load of choice is 230gr gold dots in the .45 and 124gr +p+ in the 9mm.

    I have followed Dave Spaulding for a few years now. I missed a great opportunity to train with him back in May. My fault. He is a very well respected instructor in the firearms community. I was talking to a friend of his this evening (friend Of mine as well) and he informed me of some of his videos that he found interest in. I checked them out and found them very interesting. These two videos really put things into perspective as far as I am concerned. In the thread I mentioned that Bmc started it was mentioned that testing on humans was out of the question, and that data was virtually not available. Dave has the data from autopsy's of shootings. I hope you find this as interesting as I did..I think it pertains to the other thread.

    He is the first part.

    Don"t let stupid be your skill set....

    Never be ashamed of a scar. It simply means, that you were stronger than whatever tried to hurt you......


  2. #2
    VIP Member Array Harryball's Avatar
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    Here is the second part....

    Don"t let stupid be your skill set....

    Never be ashamed of a scar. It simply means, that you were stronger than whatever tried to hurt you......

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    VIP Member Array Doghandler's Avatar
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    The best stopping power is a siren and a badge. Anything less is just a long stick.
    Smarshe likes this.
    There is a solution but we are not Jedi... not yet.
    Doghandler

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    VIP Member Array jbum's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Doghandler View Post
    The best stopping power is a siren and a badge. Anything less is just a long stick.
    Not when they are 15 minutes away..YMMV

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    Member Array Moby's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Doghandler View Post
    The best stopping power is a siren and a badge. Anything less is just a long stick.
    I can't believe you said that
    Psalm 144:1
    Blessed be the Lord, my rock, who trains my hands for war, and my fingers for battle.

    Romans 13:4
    But if you do wrong, be afraid, for he does not bear the sword in vain. For he is the servant of God, an avenger who carries out God's wrath on the wrongdoer.

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    Distinguished Member Array onacoma's Avatar
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    Harry even after the third or forth time watching these I still catch information that I use for reinforcement in discussions with the people I help!

    Again why the change from the kitty Kathy?


    In my many years I have come to a conclusion that one useless man is a shame, two is a law firm and three or more is a congress. -- John Adams

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    A good balanced look at the topic of expanded bullet advances. I enjoyed the second clip especially.

    I have some boxes of that "evil" 9mm 147 grain Black Talon ammo on hand. It goes into the Hi-Power in the rare instances that it is carried. It mostly sees duties as an occasional "car gun" on road trips.
    ericb327 and LouisianaMan like this.
    Charter Member of the DC .41 LC Society

    “No possible rapidity of fire can atone for habitual carelessness of aim with the first shot.”

    Theodore Roosevelt, The Wilderness Hunter, 1893

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    VIP Member Array high pockets's Avatar
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    Here we go again!
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    - Anon

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    Good stuff Harryball.
    -PEF, a Framer with a Steelie...
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
    1. All guns are always loaded.
    2. Never let the muzzle cover anything you are not willing to destroy.
    3. Keep your finger off the trigger until your sights are on the target.
    4. Be sure of your target and what is beyond it.

  10. #10
    Moderator
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    Wait a minute!

    It just occurred to me that I'm being blamed.
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    Charter Member of the DC .41 LC Society

    “No possible rapidity of fire can atone for habitual carelessness of aim with the first shot.”

    Theodore Roosevelt, The Wilderness Hunter, 1893

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    VIP Member Array Bad Bob's Avatar
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    Harry, why are you trying to start a caliber war. You know that the 357 Sig is FAR superior to the 9mm.

    My rifle and pistol are tools, I am the weapon.

    “Moral indignation is jealousy with a halo.”
    - H. G. Wells -

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    VIP Member Array SmokinFool's Avatar
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    Good videos. I saw them on his YouTube channel when he first put them out. It was good to watch them again. Lots of good information contained within.

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    Harry, thanks for posting the videos. I had not seen these before and they are quite informative.


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    Question. I have read posts by guys who do autopsies and explained how each bullet acted but they only see the dead guy. What everyone wants to know is if the bullet stopped the bad guy in his tracks. Does not matter if the bullet expands or not; was the bad guy stopped? The problem I have with all of this stuff is that I can put an ice pick into someone brain stem and stop them immediately. Does that mean that an ice pick has 100% stopping power? You see, people stop for two reasons; psychological and physical. As far as the physical goes, you either hit the CNS or wait for the poor SOB to bleed out. The difference in bullet sizes is only fractions of an inch and not the big differences they are made out to be. So the difference in the time it takes to bleed out is not going to be that much different with a single bullet shot. On the other hand, you can stop someone cold with a .22 to the brain or a .44 magnum. The only difference will be is that one is messier than the other.

    Put anything, whether it be a bullet, an ice pick or a pocket knife, in the right place and you will have stopping power no matter how big it is. All that you need is penetration and accurate aiming. The advantage of bigger bullets is that you have more room for error but again, we are talking fractions of an inch. Shot someone in the arm with a .45 or a .22 and if they stop it is not because of the caliber.

    Too much is made of stopping power and I think that is because the majority of gun owners never served in combat where people were stopped all the time and no one asked what caliber it was. They are looking at numbers to explain something physical. Almost like trying to pick the winner of a horse race by the record of the horse and jockey. May work some times but not enough to keep you from being wrong most of the time. :)
    If everyone had the same opinion, there would be no reason to give one. It is a given that each opinion is believed to be correct. It would be silly to post something you believed to be incorrect. :)

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    Senior Member Array Sap03's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Doghandler View Post
    The best stopping power is a siren and a badge. Anything less is just a long stick.

    That's the worst thing I have heard on the internet so far this week. I guess by your theory 97% of people who carry concealed are a "long stick"

    I really hope your not Law Enforcement.
    Eric357 and Buckeye63 like this.

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