Hornady Critical Duty 175 gr. 10mm

This is a discussion on Hornady Critical Duty 175 gr. 10mm within the Defensive Ammunition & Ballistics forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; I got some of the Hornady 175 Critical Duty, a Cabela's exclusive. It was immediately obvious that the 175 gr. Critical Duty produced less recoil ...

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Thread: Hornady Critical Duty 175 gr. 10mm

  1. #1
    Distinguished Member Array CDW4ME's Avatar
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    Hornady Critical Duty 175 gr. 10mm

    I got some of the Hornady 175 Critical Duty, a Cabela's exclusive.

    It was immediately obvious that the 175 gr. Critical Duty produced less recoil than the Hornady 155 gr. XTP.

    Same Glock 29 previously got a 1,278 fps average (562# KE) with 155 XTP.
    The 175 gr. Critical Duty produced a 1,077 fps average (451# KE)

    I thought the 175 gr. CD kicked less than the 155 XTP and the power factor calculation supports my opinion.
    175 gr. @ 1,077 fps = PF 188
    155 gr. @ 1,278 fps = PF 198

    I shot the 175 Critical Duty into water filled gallon jugs, it exited the 3rd jug and hit the 4th jug hard but did not enter. Recovered bullet expanded to about a consistent .64 - .65 at the widest points.
    This ^ is good performance, but nothing special.

    The 155 gr. XTP (tested into water filled gallon jugs in the past) penetrated into the 4th jug and measured at about .68 expanded diameter.

    I do not want any more recoil than generated by the 155 XTP (PF 198) as 2nd shot follow up time would be adversely affected.

    How does the Critical Duty 10mm compare to some 40 S&W loads?

    Glock 27:
    Winchester Ranger T 165 gr. @ 1,116 fps / 456# KE
    Speer Gold Dot 155 gr. @ 1,134 fps / 442# KE
    Hydra-Shok 180 gr. @ 935 fps / 350# KE.

    The comparatively mild 180 gr. 40 S&W Hydra-Shok penetrated (on a previous day) to the back of the 3rd jug of water and expanded to about .68 from the short barrel of the model 27. (About the same result as obtained from the 175 gr. 10mm Critical Duty)

    40 S&W from a Glock 23:
    1,125 fps / 464# KE with 165 gr. Ranger T.
    1,171 fps / 472# KE with 155 gr. Gold Dot

    Is the potentially faster 2nd shot time of the 175 Critical Duty worth the 100+# loss of KE compared to the 155 XTP?
    In my water jug test, the Critical Duty offered no advantage in penetration or expansion against the XTP, but not a significant loss either.

    The Hornady 155 XTP with a PF of 198 is pushing my limit for a quick* (about 1/3 second) 2nd shot out of the 29.
    * My 2nd shot average time is based on both the 1st and 2nd shot hitting a 6'' circle placed at 6 - 7 yards; hitting out of the 6'' circle or simply inside a silhouette doesn't meet my criteria.

    A very comparable alternative:
    My Glock 30 (45 acp) is very controllable with either of these loads:
    Federal Hydra-Shok 230 gr. @ 807 fps = PF 186
    Hornady 185 gr. XTP @ 970 fps = PF 179

    The Critical Duty 10mm produced a comparatively controllable PF of 188

    Maybe the Critical Duty and Glock 29 is an alternative to the 30 with those 45 acp loads, the recoil is comparable to the 30 and capacity is increased by two; my flush fitting Glock 30 magazines hold 8 rounds versus 10 rounds in the model 29 magazines.

    I know, isn't increased KE the main reason someone would carry a 10mm instead a 40 S&W?

    Given much consideration, I think the Critical Duty 10mm would make a good carry round for my Glock 29 especially in winter. The polymer tip should eliminate the ability heavy clothing to clog the hollow point, seems like this bullet design should ensure expansion.

    My next comparison will be against the Corbon 150 JHP 10mm... not ready yet.

    No internal lock or magazine disconnect on my pistols!

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  3. #2
    Member Array WINTEJER000's Avatar
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    Nicely written, I carry the Crit duty in my 45 when i cant get my gold dots.
    “But now,” he said, “take your money and a traveler’s bag. And if you don’t have a sword, sell your cloak and buy one!” Luke 22:36 (NLT)

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    Your numbers are certainly correct, but remember that recoil is not defined by a single parameter. The simple algebra leaves out the duration of the impulse, and that can vary substantially. Two loads with the same KE can have markedly different recoil characteristics. As a practical example, I can drive a 158 grain bullet in my K-frame .38 at 900 ft/sec with either Titegroup or Unique. The recoil with Titegroup is downright snappy, but with Unique it's more of a firm push, and with less muzzle flip.
    glockman10mm likes this.
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    VIP Member Array glockman10mm's Avatar
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    Those are down right watered down loads for a 10mm. Are you trying to duplicate 40S&W ballistics?
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    Ignorance is a long way from stupid, but left unchecked, can get there real fast.

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    VIP Member Array LimaCharlie's Avatar
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    I carry Buffalo Bore or Underwood 180 grain JHP in my Glock G20 SF and Winchester Silvertip 175 grain in my Colt Delta Elite and Kimber Stainless Target II.
    I carry a gun, because a Cop is too heavy.

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    Distinguished Member Array CDW4ME's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by WINTEJER000 View Post
    Nicely written, I carry the Crit duty in my 45 when i cant get my gold dots.
    Thanks!

    Quote Originally Posted by gasmitty View Post
    Your numbers are certainly correct, but remember that recoil is not defined by a single parameter. The simple algebra leaves out the duration of the impulse, and that can vary substantially. Two loads with the same KE can have markedly different recoil characteristics.
    True.
    I used the PF calculation as a way to compare recoil, but it is really only applicable to the Glock 29 VS 30 as they have same size grip and slide. The 27 and or 23 have a thinner lighter slide as well as a narrower grip, so an identical bullet driven to identical velocities would likely have more felt recoil in the 27 or 23 than the 29.

    Quote Originally Posted by glockman10mm View Post
    Those are down right watered down loads for a 10mm. Are you trying to duplicate 40S&W ballistics?
    I was only trying to report my findings on the Hornady Critical Duty 175 10mm.

    Not specific to this ammo:
    Before trying the Critical Duty, I have only shot Hornady 155 gr. XTP in my Glock 29, couple hundred factory rounds, plus my several hundred rounds of my handload that duplicates the factory velocity.
    The recoil is tolerable with the 155 gr. XTP, but I would not want more; neither would I want the bullet impact to be any higher compared to my point of aim, so I figured any heavier bullets would negatively affect both recoil and POI.
    The "watered down" Critical Duty 175 actually struck closer to my desired POI than the Hornady 155 gr.

    2nd shot follow up time (given the previously mentioned accuracy stipulation) is a consideration in my ammo selection.
    My 2nd shot average time is based on both the 1st and 2nd shot hitting a 6'' circle placed at 6 - 7 yards; hitting out of the 6'' circle or simply hitting inside a silhouette doesn't cut it.
    9mm is always the winner in this little drill, but I'm not willing to go with 9mm over .001 - .003 second advantage.
    My main carry methods are either Smartcarry or appendix IWB with a Fist kydex clip-on, I rarely use strong side IWB (those three options shown in my avatar). The Glock 23 or similar size pistol is just a little too big for appendix IWB, length bugs me more than thickness.
    So my main contenders for carry are Glocks 26/27/33 or 29/30.
    Average split times with those run .31 - .34 second using +P in the 9mm, 180 JHP in the 40, 185 or 230 Hydra-Shok in the 30 and 155 gr. XTP in the 29.
    I'm not particularly fast at anything I do like moving, walking, talking, typing, ect... and shooting is no exception.
    MY perception of the effort required to obtain a .34 sec with the Glock 29 compared to the Glock 26 at .31 sec or Glock 27 at .32 sec feels much greater.
    I have Ranger T 230 gr. 45 acp but do not carry it in the 30 due to recoil, at 874 fps and a PF of 201, recoil is notably sharper than the Hydra-Shok 230.
    Same for the 27, I carry the 180 Hydra-Shok instead of the harder kicking 165 Ranger T.
    Just for comparison, using a full size 1911 and 230 gr. ammo the average split time was .23 sec. My Glock 23 loaded with "soft kicking" 180 JHP was good for .24 sec

    I guess my rambling post reveals that I am looking for the best possible combination of capacity, control, power, diameter, and POI as can be achieved between the Glocks that lend themselves to appendix IWB carry.
    I am interested to see what kind of recoil, KE, penetration, expansion, and POI I get with the Corbon 150 10mm, maybe it will be the "the" load for my 29.
    No internal lock or magazine disconnect on my pistols!

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    VIP Member Array glockman10mm's Avatar
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    I'd say a G23 and call it good. I understand you have a. G29, but you are in 40s&w territory anyway. So unless it's just a matter of the expense of another gun vs finding a load in the. 10mm that is what you want.
    And I can understand that line of thinking too.

    So, I believe I can understand what you are trying to accomplish now:)
    Ignorance is a long way from stupid, but left unchecked, can get there real fast.

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    Member Array lyodbraun's Avatar
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    Got any pics of the rounds ? I tested them in .45acp into a few ocean spray bottles and it failed to expand and actually folded I. On it self ... I'm just not impressed with hornadys line of handgun ammo...
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    Last edited by lyodbraun; November 29th, 2013 at 08:13 PM.

  10. #9
    Distinguished Member Array CDW4ME's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by glockman10mm View Post
    I'd say a G23 and call it good. I understand you have a. G29, but you are in 40s&w territory anyway. So unless it's just a matter of the expense of another gun vs finding a load in the. 10mm that is what you want.
    And I can understand that line of thinking too.

    So, I believe I can understand what you are trying to accomplish now:)
    I have a 23 and its great for strong side IWB, but my main methods of carry are Smartcarry and appendix IWB, best suited to either 27, 29 or 30.

    Quote Originally Posted by lyodbraun View Post
    Got any pics of the rounds ? I tested them in .45acp into a few ocean spray bottles and it failed to expand and actually folded I. On it self ... I'm just not impressed with hornadys line of handgun ammo...
    Here is a pic of the expanded bullet.Critical Duty.jpg
    No internal lock or magazine disconnect on my pistols!

  11. #10
    Member Array lyodbraun's Avatar
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    Looks pretty good here is a pic of the critical duty in .45 one in middle was shot into the jugs of water..
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    Last edited by lyodbraun; November 29th, 2013 at 08:13 PM.

  12. #11
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    Good report. I found a 20 round box of .40 cal 175 gr Critical Duty ammo during the ammo shortage just after I got a couple of extra full size mags & X-Grips for my M&P40C. That fills a FS mag with 4 rounds left over. After your report & the research I've already done I'll start carrying it in the gun instead of carrying it as a spare. Normally I have my compact & one FS mag loaded with Gold Dots.

    Have you done any testing or research on Critical Defense ammo? I haven't seen any of that in local stores but I've heard that that round is the preferred ammo for self defense use. As I understand it the Critical Duty is designed to go through an obstacle like car glass with a minimum of expansion before striking the target & expanding to its fullest.
    Glenn

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    M&P40, M&P40C

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    Member Array JORZAC's Avatar
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    Like someone said above, why carry a 10mm (and the subsequent size "issues") that go along with it if you are going to shoot what amounts to a .40 s&w? If you're gonna carry a 10, you need to look into the smaller companies. BB, Underwood, Georgia Arms & Reed being the ones that come to mind. The Underwood stuff is awesome. Im carrying a Glock 29SF with underwood 135 gr Nosler at 1600 fps. That is what 10mm is all about.

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    Distinguished Member Array BlackStallion29's Avatar
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    I have a couple boxes of Critical Duty 175gr and Critical Defense 165gr for my 40. I just have better accuracy with Remington Golden Saber and Winchester Ranger Bonded in 165gr.
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    Distinguished Member Array CDW4ME's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JORZAC View Post
    Like someone said above, why carry a 10mm (and the subsequent size "issues") that go along with it if you are going to shoot what amounts to a .40 s&w? If you're gonna carry a 10, you need to look into the smaller companies. BB, Underwood, Georgia Arms & Reed being the ones that come to mind. The Underwood stuff is awesome. Im carrying a Glock 29SF with underwood 135 gr Nosler at 1600 fps. That is what 10mm is all about.

    I am fully aware of the companies you mentioned, but I'm not interested in 10mm ammo that would produce any more recoil than the Hornady 155 XTP.
    I have seen plenty about Underwood, their website, 10 ring on Glocktalk, and youtube.
    Assuming the 135 gr. load you mentioned approaches the advertised velocity out of a Glock 29 that is a PF of 216 (which exceeds the 155 gr. Hornady 10mm as well as the 230 gr. Ranger T in 45 acp).
    In addition to recoil beyond what I wish to tolerate, I am concerned about under penetration with a 135 gr. bullet driven to that velocity; check out youtube as there are two different tests with the Underwood 135 gr.

    If I was solely concerned with outright power (KE) then a Underwood or Double Tap load would be the obvious choice.
    However, due to the enlightenment I have obtained with a shot timer and a 6" circle, maximum power is not my sole concern.

    Why carry a 10mm that is not loaded with nuclear ammo?
    For me, the 29 competes with the 30 and 27 for identical methods and location of carry.
    The 29 with a "weak" load like the Critical Duty still produces as much power as a "hot" load out of the 27, but felt recoil is less due to the thicker grip and slide; additionally, the 29 offers an additional round of capacity over the 27. That being said, I am still very fond of the Glock 27.
    The 29 and 30 are the same size. The 30 launches a bigger bullet, which is a good thing, but sacrifices two rounds of capacity to the 29 when using the preferred flush fitting magazines in the 30 (they hold 8, not 9 rounds). The 29 launches a smaller bullet, but that bullet carries more KE than the 45 and most people agree that a bullet that begins with the number 4 is acceptable. (10mm vs 45 being a call between diameter or extra capacity and KE) That being said, I very much like the 30 but only with flush fitting magazines.

    In a previous post in this thread, I said I wanted, " best possible combination of capacity, control, power, diameter, and POI".
    I think all of the above should suffice as to why I do not just load up with the hottest 10mm ammo I can find.

    That being said (#3) , I believe I have found "the" 10mm load for me; not the Critical Duty, but one that offers a better "package" - will make a new thread later.

    Edit: here is that thread: Corbon 10mm 150 JHP out of Glock 29
    Last edited by CDW4ME; November 30th, 2013 at 01:12 PM.
    No internal lock or magazine disconnect on my pistols!

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    VIP Member Array Cuda66's Avatar
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    For what it's worth--

    Hornady loads their 200gr XTP to that velocity (I think it's advertised at 1080fps)--and that is a very mild shooting round.

    I'd think it would be a better performer than the Critical Duty.
    glockman10mm likes this.
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