Calling all handloaders; your thoughts please.

This is a discussion on Calling all handloaders; your thoughts please. within the Defensive Ammunition & Ballistics forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; I do not have much experience loading the 40s&w. I actually started loading it a couple of years ago, but just a few rounds for ...

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Thread: Calling all handloaders; your thoughts please.

  1. #1
    VIP Member Array glockman10mm's Avatar
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    Calling all handloaders; your thoughts please.

    I do not have much experience loading the 40s&w. I actually started loading it a couple of years ago, but just a few rounds for the range here and there. Since it's my duty caliber, I just haven't had to handload for it.

    All the data listed shows 6 to up to eight grains of Unique for the 150-155 weight bullet. Back when I started loading it, I chose a load of 5.6 under a Berrys hollow back bullet. Now this load shoots extremely well, but the recoil impulse is significant, and I'm not exactly recoil sensitive. There are no signs of pressure, the primers look good after firing, and there is no case bulge. Iirc it chrono at 1000 fps. To be cautious , I even seat the bullet out a little further than spec.

    I cannot imagine a charge of 8 grains of Unique as published on the Alliant website, as a max load. I would be hard pressed to even exceed 6 grains with the recoil impulse I am getting.

    Is it possible that Alliant has kept the old data published on their website since changing the Unique powder recipe? If so, I think this could be catastrophic.
    Your thoughts and comments?
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    VIP Member Array dukalmighty's Avatar
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    I cast a 155 LRN bullet and load it behind 6.0 grains unique,I was having a problem with some brass rupturing around the base ,as far as I could figure it out is I may have been over crimping wirh a standard seat and crimp die that was causing a pressure spike,I bought a Lee Factory crimp die and after setting it up I have had no cases ruptured in about 500 rounds where I seemed to have about a 10% to 15% failure rate in the past.
    I had a friend that had bought some reloads from a guy that he has been buying from for years,he was having a problem with FMJ loads and case ruptures I pulled down several rounds to weigh the powder charge and every charge weighed the same at 5 grains,not sure what the powder was but more than likely it was bullseye,I was wondering if it was possible that he was overcrimping resulting in a spike in pressure.
    I've only encountered the problem in 40 S&W,and I reload 9mm/40 S&W/45acp/44 mag/380 acp/ 38/357
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    Ex Member Array Gearhead's Avatar
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    Similar to you I have a recipe that uses 5.7gr of Unique behind a 155gr bullet. But 8 gr? No way. My brand spanking new Hornady handbook (8th edition) shows a recipe that consists of up to 8-8.5gr of Unique behind a 135gr bullet. Same book also shows up to 8.9gr of Unique behind a 155 gr HP - for a 10mm! Either way, I'd suspect that Alliant is showing bad data in their website. It would probably be a good idea to bring this to their attention.
    nedrgr21 likes this.

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    Distinguished Member Array svgheartland's Avatar
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    When I get out to the loading bench in the barn I'll check my log. I'm all but positive that I've loaded that exact combination but can't recall the charge. But it sounds a bit spooky based on your description and the comments so far. You're a 10 mm guy so recoil shouldn't be talking back like that.
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    VIP Member Array Easy8's Avatar
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    I am going to look it up but I thought I read that berrys suggest using lead formulas for their plated bullets. I would think there would not be much room left for bullet with over 8 grains of unique.
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    VIP Member Array glockman10mm's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Easy8 View Post
    I am going to look it up but I thought I read that berrys suggest using lead formulas for their plated bullets. I would think there would not be much room left for bullet with over 8 grains of unique.
    You don't have to look it up. I can already tell you plated bullets should not exceed 1000 fps, same as softer lead bullets.
    40Bob likes this.
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    VIP Member Array Easy8's Avatar
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    Just checked the new lyman book says 155gr gets 5.5 to a max of 6.5 of unique to get 1100 fps

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    VIP Member Array glockman10mm's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Easy8 View Post
    Just checked the new lyman book says 155gr gets 5.5 to a max of 6.5 of unique to get 1100 fps
    Thanks. So they have adjusted their data from the. 47th a addition to reflect the burning rate changes of Unique.
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    VIP Member Array Easy8's Avatar
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    Yeah, things change so fast we all have to be careful to update our material when changing any components we normally use

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    VIP Member Array glockman10mm's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Easy8 View Post
    Yeah, things change so fast we all have to be careful to update our material when changing any components we normally use
    I do have a history of being behind the times....
    dangerranger likes this.
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    Member Array muddy's Avatar
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    I load 6.8 grains of Unique with a 165 grain bullet and didn't notice the recoil as bad.

    Unique didn't change there recipe or at least burn characteristics, if they did the powder wouldn't be called Unique. Think about it, a powder company changes up a powder's burn characteristics but names it the same as another powder. Some old reloader pulls his 20 year old reloading book or load data for his favorite load off the shelf because he ran out of ammo and needs a few more. This same reloader realizes that he is out of powder and runs down to the local toy store to purchase a pound of powder. The reloader notices that the label on the can of Unique is different from what he has seen but there are no warnings or information on the can to indicate that the powder is anything other then the old Unique he is used to. Do you really think a powder company is going to open themselves up to that kind of liability?

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    VIP Member Array glockman10mm's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by glockman10mm View Post
    Thanks. So they have adjusted their data from the. 47th a addition to reflect the burning rate changes of Unique.
    No , I am mistaken. The 47 edition reflects the current data .
    StormRhydr likes this.
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    VIP Member Array glockman10mm's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by muddy View Post
    I load 6.8 grains of Unique with a 165 grain bullet and didn't notice the recoil as bad.

    Unique didn't change there recipe or at least burn characteristics, if they did the powder wouldn't be called Unique. Think about it, a powder company changes up a powder's burn characteristics but names it the same as another powder. Some old reloader pulls his 20 year old reloading book or load data for his favorite load off the shelf because he ran out of ammo and needs a few more. This same reloader realizes that he is out of powder and runs down to the local toy store to purchase a pound of powder. The reloader notices that the label on the can of Unique is different from what he has seen but there are no warnings or information on the can to indicate that the powder is anything other then the old Unique he is used to. Do you really think a powder company is going to open themselves up to that kind of liability?
    I and several others have noticed , and documented velocity differences in the old vs the newer cleaner burning . I have data going back to the 80's that show a marked difference in velocity compared to the same load assembled with the new powder.
    HotGuns likes this.
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  15. #14
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    Not cool. That they change formula and no warning on the packaging. I have been using the same load for quite a while and load mild , but will be double checking data now. I have found loading the berrys plated longer than spec seems to improve accuracy and not affect cycling.
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    VIP Member Array StormRhydr's Avatar
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    Im totally stumped by all this. I dont understand a company even considering keeping the same name, for a different product, with different characteristics, when that product is gun powder.

    I know many of us like old reloading manuals. We keep the old ones, (some very old), update when new ones come out, etc. I know I would never have suspected that unique had changed formulas, unless I had read this thread.

    I read what the OP posted, but thought what I read just couldnt be right. That he must have meant something else. NOPE! Apparently, he wrote it accurately, and meant exactly what he said. Which pretty much goes to show me that he has more sense than the idiots at the gun powder company.
    Christopher67 likes this.

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