Best 12 gauge ammo?
I would like to know your opinion on the best 12 gauge Shotgun ammo for home defense.
I know alot of people say 00 Buck is the best, but I don't want overpenetration and hurt anyone outside my home,
although at the same time I want a stopping round.
I heard that #1 Buckshot is the way to go.
Awe shucks - opinions are very varied and for many different reasons too. :wink:
My 870 is stoked with #4 shot, mainly because I view its use as being almost certainly up close and personal ...... and I want to limit over penetration of structures. I have some very nice old 3" Eley shells which are ''BB'' - and those might perhaps be a good choice for me too.
As for the buck options, I don't think I want to go that large. I also am aware of the <cough> ''usefullness'' of a slug but - them darned thangs just keep on truckin :smilez:
A tight pattern of smaller shot (I keep full choke screwed in) will at a few feet be effectively a very potent mass of close knit projectiles and be pretty damaging! Can we say 4 to 6 inch pattern!
Oh boy did you just open a can of worms.
I like 00, there are plenty of other good choices like the ones P95 mentioned.
All of my mossberg/maverick shotguns (5), are loaded with (4) 0 buck out first followed by (2) 1oz slugs. All are 18 1/2 barrels with pistol grips. One for each room.
00 buck = 9 pellets of .33 cal & each weighs 54 grains. That means less penetration than say a 9mm. Lots of talk about adequate penetration on pistol bullets, yet many want to down size their shotgun pellets to keep over penetration. ???????? Velocity on most shotshells are around 1250 fps at, while 9mm is around 1050 fps. Bottom line, it is a myth that 00 buck overpenetrates any more than a 9mm or 40 S&W.
Quote from frfrogspad: Less anyone thinks that only one or two pellets of buckshot will effectively turn off an attacker, consider what is actually striking the target. A pellet of 00 buck is essentially a 54 grain, .33 caliber projectile that is traveling between 1000 and 1300 feet per second. This puts the effectiveness of each pellet of #4 buck at about the .22 rimfire level and 00 buckshot at the muzzle somewhere between that of the .32 ACP and .380 ACP cartridges, none of which any serious person will bet their life upon.
see the following on shotgun ballistics.
I live in an old apartment at college (its a house that was originally built like 100 years ago), so I don't know how well the walls will stop anything. I keep my coachgun loaded up with #4's. But there is a bandolier loaded up with a couple more #4's, and then 5 slugs and the rest 00.
Kind of off topic, but your old walls made most likely from plaster and lap boards, maybe even masonry will hold up far better than modern drywall.
Originally Posted by buckeye07
Well, ya just got me thinkin, it was built in 1910, and actually must have been remodeled since then, because the interior walls are definately drywall, but the exterior ones are plaster and lap boards. Either way, all the bulidings around here are about 5-10 feet apart and regardless, I feel better with the #4 loads to start with. The longest shot possible in my house is maybe 10 feet if you are going to see what you are aiming at, and I wouldn't want two 12 gauge loads of anything in my COM from that distance.
Good, college kids never do that and its good for them!:danceban:
Originally Posted by buckeye07
Back on topic, #4 is a good choice, but whatever you choose, almost everything is going to pass through drywall with ease, be careful!
shot gun ammo
ANY 12ga. load at room distance will have good stopping effect due to the fact the short range will not allow for much of a pattern spread even in a cylinder bore choke. As for penetration I wouldn't go over #2 shot for indoors..To each his own choice.
Originally Posted by Sparks
Again, tests don't support the over penetration concept.
To each their own, but I recommend reading the data before you decide.
A Penetrating Study
To determine what kind of penetration could be expected the following data was obtained from various published and International Wound Ballistics Association (IWBA) sources. The #6 birdshot load of copper plated hardened shot (2¾" - 1¼ oz -3¼ Dram) that is often recommended as an ideal solution for the in-home scenario was fired at five yards to discover the effectiveness of that loading at in-house/across-the-room ranges. All other penetration data was obtained at seven yards. It is generally accepted by those involved in the wound ballistics field that a minimum penetration of twelve inches of 10 percent ordnance gelatin is one of the criteria needed to provide reliable incapacitation of a human assailant.
12 Gauge Penetration tests
Load Number of Pellets Penetration
@ 7 yards
000 Buck 8 14" - 16"
00 Buck 9 13" - 15"
1 Buck 16 12" - 14"
#4 Buck 27 9" - 11"
#6 Shot (Hard shot) 280 4" - 6" (@5 yd)
1 oz Foster Slug - 18"
450 gr SABOT Slug - 21"
As can be seen from the table, the often recommended standard 4 buck load is lacking in penetration. This has been confirmed by data from numerous field experiences and is especially true if the target has any "give" to it such as a loosely fitted leather jacket. The #6 shot often recommended for home protection also gives marginal penetration. To insure adequate penetration under all conditions you should stick with 1 buck or larger shot although the #6 shot will probably suffice for the initial in-home encounter at "across the bed distances," where the shot charge is still essentially a single mass, when backed up by a buckshot round.
In addition, shot's spherical shape doesn't give a very good ballistic coefficient (00 buck has a nominal Gs coefficient of about .071 (approximately .045 G1) compared to .104 G1 for a 71 gr .32 caliber FMJ bullet or .390 for a 150 gr .30 caliber spitzer) and the velocity drops off rapidly as you can see below.
Performance of 00 Buckshot
The first round is bird shot then 5 1 buck, and 6 00 buck in the side saddle.
I have the first round as bird shot just in case my wife uses it. She is not all that proficient with long weapons.
1 buck has less of a chance of over penetrating walls. If the first 6 shots don't do the trick the 00 buck will end things.
Good read. http://www.firearmstactical.com/briefs10.htm
I would say that if theirs others in the house that bird shot would be plenty.
7anda half shot in an improved cylinder would stay somewhat tight and still make a hole.
the best part is that it's less likely to go through interior walls so other people in the house and your neighbors would more than likely be safe.
while typing this i realized that this was just covered.lol sorry
I have #4 turkey load in 3" magnums loaded and 00 buck with one slug in the butt stock pouch.
I think that the Turkey load gives me a good spread and I don't have to worry about over penetration
The Stock pouch is just in case things get really FUBAR.
I mean if 6 12ga rounds going off do not convice some one to leave my house than it is very FUBAR
And the people said, "AMEN!"
Originally Posted by pgrass101
I don't choose weapons for psychological effect. That is a dangerous game best left to posturing armies... IMHO....
That said...I've got 00 in my Mossy. I still need to pattern it....but if 10 rds (5 in the tube and 5 on the stock...plus the rounds stashed in my hidey hole...) of 12 ga don't decide anything, it's time for something else... CAR-15, AK, MP5SD...infantry squad...arty dropped on my position....'cuz those be some very bad hombres in mi casa....and things have gone WAY BEYOND FUBAR.... (Funny...I don't recall an acronym beyond FUBAR....) At that point, I think you just have to pray for it to be a nice day a la Sam Elliot's character in We Were Soldiers...you know...the day you survive...
A Good Morning == Hot Coffee
This is a very good morning.