personal defense ammo for .357 sig ?

[Shizzlemah]

Guys,
Can you suggest good personal defense loads for a .357 sig ? What are the feds using ?

Currently using 125gr Speer Gold Dots, but only because that was the only ammo in the store.

Thanks !

[DefensiveCarry.com]

[7677]

Guys,
Can you suggest good personal defense loads for a .357 sig ? What are the feds using ?

Currently using 125gr Speer Gold Dots, but only because that was the only ammo in the store.

Thanks !

I carried Gold Dots in my G31 and G33 when I worked patrol and they were very impressive in the Jello testing my department conducted.

[srfl]

The U.S. Secret Service and the Federal Air Marshals carry Gold Dot 125 grain loads in their SIGARMS P229s....at least they did a couple of years ago. A good many FLEO agencies (like mine) carry Gold Dots in their guns as well. In the case of my agency, 165 grain .40 S&W.

You are carrying a good round in your gun.

Winchester Ranger-T 125 grain loads are good too; I have that in my personal SIGARMS sigpro SP2340 and Steyr M357.

[Sam Douthit]

There was only one Jacketed Hollow Point available for the Sig, the Federal .357 Sig Jhp in 125 grain. This one could say was an optimum load. And this is too simple an answer. First consider what you are going to do with the gun. If it is by your bed in a thin walled apartment, keep in mind the penetration of these walls and damage to those that are unintended consequences. Hollow points are not as likely to go through lots of things as ball ammo does. Also you may be shooting at someone behind a car windshield or heavy door then you want the penetration. Self protection favors a hollow point
round. The exotic ammo such as Magsafe and others merit careful consideration and testing by shooting in a particular gun and some should be avoided all together. The Federal rounds look like your best bet for an average round. New stuff might be available but the older reliable ammo is good. See what the law enforcement people are using. They have experience and there is no substitute for experience.

[7677]

The U.S. Secret Service and the Federal Air Marshals carry Gold Dot 125 grain loads in their SIGARMS P229s....at least they did a couple of years ago. A good many FLEO agencies (like mine) carry Gold Dots in their guns as well. In the case of my agency, 165 grain .40 S&W.

You are carrying a good round in your gun.

Winchester Ranger-T 125 grain loads are good too; I have that in my personal SIGARMS sigpro SP2340 and Steyr M357.

When I was at FLETC in January, I visited the FTU to talk with some friends and the SS and FAMS are still are using Gold Dots in 357sig and there are a couple of smaller agencies that have also gone with 357sig...Social Security agents come to mind.

From the jello testing and autopsies of officer involved shootings the difference between Winchester Ranger Talons and Speer Gold Dot's is very small. Gold Dot hold a slight advantage in barricade penetration especially in defeating windshields. I still remember when we first tested the 125gr Gold Dot and it threw the block of jello off the table I remember thinking I have to have one of those.

[srfl]

SSA/OIG went to 357 SIG, hmm? Interesting.

[DRT]

For your reference, here is Gold Dot terminal ballistic data (after IWBA heavy clothing) directly from SPEER's 2007 LE catalog:

Caliber/Weight/Penetration/Expansion/Test Weapon:

9mm, 115, 18.85", .510", P226
9mm+P+, 115, 15.90", .530", G17
9mm, 124, 16.43", .555", P226
9mm+P, 124, 15.88", .560", G17
9mm, 147, 16.93", .540", P226
.357Sig, 125, 17.50", .535", P226
.38+P, 135, 13.00", .554", S&W640
.357Mag, 125, 22.75", .394", S&W65
.357Mag, 158, 24.85", .402", S&W65
.40S&W, 155, 14.45", .630", G23
.40S&W, 165, 17.55", .583", S&W4006
.40S&W, 180, 14.10", .662", G23
.45ACP, 185, 15.00", .651", P220
.45ACP+P, 200, 15.20", .675", G21
.45ACP, 230, 14.55", .675", S&W4506

They also provided a data sheet for the .40 Short Barrel Load (IWBA 4 layer denim):

.40S&W, 180, 13.25", .648", G27

As a comparison, here's Winchester Ranger T terminal ballistics data after IWBA 4 layer denim. This can be found on Winchester's website in the LE section. http://www.winchester.com/lawenforc...g/testing.aspx# Just choose the link to launch their testing sheet. Here's some of their data to save you some time:

caliber/weight/penetration/expansion

9mm, 147, 14.5", .66"
9mm+P, 124, 13.9", .67"
9mm+P+, 127, 12.2", 68"
.357Sig, 125, 12.1", .66"
.40S&W, 165, 13.2", .70"
.40S&W, 180,14.3, .70"
.45ACP, 230, 12.7, .72"
.45ACP+P, 230, 15.2, .78


Conclusions:
1) Ranger T does better in most calibers.
2) .357 Sig ~= 9mm.
3) If you want a .40 Gold Dot, I'd go with either the 180gr or 155gr. Skip the 165gr since it doesnt open as well through clothing or IWBA heavy clothing. See detailed data below, again directly from Speer's 2007 LE catalog.


155gr
=====

G23, ave velocity = 1162fps

bare = 12.05", .769"
clothing = 16.4", .632"
steel - 17.95", .502"
wallboard = 12.58", .677"
plywood = 13.10", .645"
Glass - 13.05", .572"
IWBA heavy clothing = 14.45", .630"

165gr
=====

S&W4006, ave velocity = 1099fps

bare = 13.32", .672"
clothing = 18.0", .618"
steel - 18.8", .494"
wallboard = 13.06", .628"
plywood = 15.42", .621"
Glass - 12.8", .588"
IWBA heavy clothing = 17.55", .583"

180gr
=====

G23, ave velocity = 995fps

bare = 12.19", .640"
clothing = 13.25", .709"
steel - 19.6", .507"
wallboard = 12.75", .673"
plywood = 17.10", .575"
Glass - 12.75", .612"
IWBA heavy clothing = 14.10", .662"

[Fastball]

Gold Dots in my recently acquired 229!! Only other thing I would consider is the Corbon DPX.

Here's a good read; http://www.recguns.com/Sources/IIIC2q6.html

[1911shooter]

Gold dots for the 357sig are the ideal round...