Magsafe or Glaser in a snubnose

This is a discussion on Magsafe or Glaser in a snubnose within the Defensive Ammunition & Ballistics forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Originally Posted by CountShotula I carry Glaser Silvers in my 38 Special derringer. I figure that I only have two SAO shots, I want something ...

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  1. #16
    VIP Member Array ExSoldier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CountShotula View Post
    I carry Glaser Silvers in my 38 Special derringer.
    I figure that I only have two SAO shots, I want something that will cause large amounts of damage to the circulatory system rather than try to hit a critical nerve structure.
    That makes perfect sense, too. You're shooting at contact range, the chance for a miss is slight but does exist. The odds that the shot will connect with an area thick with muscle or in a fleshy region such as the throat and upper thorax is greater and a Glaser would reduce those areas to a pulpy mess. He might not die instantly, but I'm pretty sure an attacker with his throat ripped away is going to lose interest in fighting. He is going to be wondering why his breathing is suddenly spotty and filled with blood. This is also why my S&W 642 is stoked with MagSafe. I'm more likely to be shoving the snub barrel into somebody's gut inside an elevator and pulling that trigger than I am to be trading shots from behind cars in a parking garage. In that ugly scenario, muzzle blast alone will almost do more damage than the rounds path or depth.
    Former Army Infantry Captain; 25 yrs as an NRA Certified Instructor; Avid practitioner of the martial art: KLIK-PAO.

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  3. #17
    Member Array CountShotula's Avatar
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    ExSoldier, your response is perfect.
    If the thoracic triangle is covered in an attack, hit em in the gut. A fragmentation round will turn his guts into soup and cause large amounts of hemorrhaging quite fast.
    I've been toying of the idea of getting some Magsafes in 38 Special for testing. The Glaser Silver has met my requirement: it will work through heavy clothing and perform as designed.
    Magsafe looks like a conventional JHP shell and I worry if heavy clothing will affect it (clogging). (I see your in FL and have no need to worry about that, but in Ohio the winters are brutal).

  4. #18
    Member Array Anthony's Avatar
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    Neither for 'general purpose'.

    Glasers and Magsafe are both very specialist ammo.
    A 'J' frame in the pocket, as a second gun, that will probably be used to blast point blank into the belly region of a BG is one thing. (A 'gun grab' comes to mind, or simply in the home, day to day, with a 'J' frame in the pocket, and your loved ones nearby.)

    Trying to fight a typical police/civilian firefight with frangible ammo, is stupid IMHO. - Choose a premium +P JHP IMHO.

  5. #19
    VIP Member Array ExSoldier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CountShotula View Post
    Magsafe looks like a conventional JHP shell and I worry if heavy clothing will affect it (clogging). (I see your in FL and have no need to worry about that, but in Ohio the winters are brutal).
    I'm in extreme south Florida (Miami) and when the weather turns frigid here, like in the lower 50's or upper 40's even then I usually switch to conventional JHP's for my carry loads. Speer GD, HST or Ranger. I also like Critical Defense quite a bit.
    Former Army Infantry Captain; 25 yrs as an NRA Certified Instructor; Avid practitioner of the martial art: KLIK-PAO.

  6. #20
    VIP Member Array ExSoldier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Anthony View Post
    Trying to fight a typical police/civilian firefight with frangible ammo, is stupid IMHO. - Choose a premium +P JHP IMHO.
    If you're really in Brazil, SA then I'll bet the average civilian gunfight IS a "FIREFIGHT," lol. But most civilian self defense shootings in this country occur at zero to a maximum of 7 yards and are over within 3 shots when the attacker is a lone wolf. More of course if the number of perps is multiples.
    Former Army Infantry Captain; 25 yrs as an NRA Certified Instructor; Avid practitioner of the martial art: KLIK-PAO.

  7. #21
    Member Array CountShotula's Avatar
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    I also like Critical Defense quite a bit.
    I've tested some of those in 38 Special and have had good results, always expand.
    Last winter it got down below 0 for a week or two, so thick clothing can really be an issue.

  8. #22
    Member Array Anthony's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ExSoldier View Post
    If you're really in Brazil, SA then I'll bet the average civilian gunfight IS a "FIREFIGHT," lol. But most civilian self defense shootings in this country occur at zero to a maximum of 7 yards and are over within 3 shots when the attacker is a lone wolf. More of course if the number of perps is multiples.
    Opps............
    Yes, I ment to write 'gunfight', but sometimes my written English lets me down. I don't really get to speak it much more, just read and write it, with the occasional telephone call to my mother.

    But yes, the typical police shootings in places like Rio de Janeiro, are far more likely to be 'fightfights' than 'gunfights'. - I have watched several over the years. Not quite the Falklands or Iraq on scale, but every bit a match for some of our exchanges back in Northern Ireland, - minus the IEDs of course.

  9. #23
    VIP Member Array Cuda66's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CountShotula View Post
    I carry Glaser Silvers in my 38 Special derringer.
    I figure that I only have two SAO shots, I want something that will cause large amounts of damage to the circulatory system rather than try to hit a critical nerve structure.
    Take a look at the Xray photos in post #7.

    Those rounds aren't going to penetrate deep enough to get into the serious circulatory system.
    There are no dangerous weapons; there are only dangerous men.--RAH

    ...man fights with his mind; the weapons are incidental.--Jeff Cooper


    There is a reason they try and make small bullets act like big bullets--Glockmann10mm

  10. #24
    Senior Member Array IAm_Not_Lost's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cuda66 View Post
    Take a look at the Xray photos in post #7.

    Those rounds aren't going to penetrate deep enough to get into the serious circulatory system.
    Maybe a more effective advertising pitch for Glaser and Magsafe would be: "If you completely miss the BG and happen to hit a bystander, chances are you won't kill them. Don't worry, they will be alive and well to sue you."
    "Brilliant. So now we got a huge guy theory, and a serial crusher theory. Top notch. What's your name?" - Paul Smecker

  11. #25
    Member Array Anthony's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by IAm_Not_Lost View Post
    Maybe a more effective advertising pitch for Glaser and Magsafe would be: "If you completely miss the BG and happen to hit a bystander, chances are you won't kill them. Don't worry, they will be alive and well to sue you."
    Now that is funny! :)

    Seriously, here in Brazil, with most 'punk' BGs being as slim as you can imagine, and 12 inches front to rear, 'through and through' being a lot for down here, a Glaser or Magsafe in 'COM' at point blank would probably serve?

    But even though I have some Glasers that I bought from a friend who bought them in the USA, I still prefer 125 grain JHP, +P+ ammo in my .38s. - All three of them (.38 spl revolvers.)
    CBC ('Magtech' for you guys,) "Gold" ammo.

    Our choices are limited down here, but this seems to be very good, - from reports by ballisitics experts in your country.

  12. #26
    Member Array CountShotula's Avatar
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    Glaser Safety Slugs (Geoff Kotzar)
    The point of this ammunition is not to over penetrate. Which means it is designed to under penetrate.
    Why do people always throw about penetration "issues" with ammo that is purposely designed not to penetrate deeply?
    Yes, yes 12 inches...I know.

    I haven't seen any x-rays of Glaser Silver or Magsafe yet, so I cannot give an educated opinion on how they work.
    No. 12 shot is too small even for birds, so I opted for the no. 6 load in the Silver.

    Also, comparing the x-ray of the butt to the arm gives two different patterns. The one of the butt looks like someone stood in front of a .410 shotshell.

  13. #27
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    I'm actually grateful to see that the old thread are now capable of being brought back. In some instances they are very worthwhile and those that aren't will die again rather quickly.

    For myself, I'm still very enthused about the +P 158 grain lead SWC-HP "FBI Load" for all .38 Special revolvers used for self defense, regardless of barrel length.
    Cuda66 likes this.
    “No possible rapidity of fire can atone for habitual carelessness of aim with the first shot.”

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  14. #28
    Member Array Anthony's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bmcgilvray View Post
    For myself, I'm still very enthused about the +P 158 grain lead SWC-HP "FBI Load" for all .38 Special revolvers used for self defense, regardless of barrel length.
    Personally, so am I for 3 inch and upwards brl length, - especially from the 'old standby', - the four inch brl Model 10 revolver. (Can be a Colt or Taurus etc, too.)

    From a 2 inch brl, I feel that a full wadcutter to be superior. - Especially in the lightweight alloy 'J' frame revolver.
    A standard pressure 148 'ish' grain full WC made of hard cast lead, will cut a full diameter bullet hole right through an unarmored (no balisitc vest,) human target.

  15. #29
    Member Array CountShotula's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Anthony View Post
    From a 2 inch brl, I feel that a full wadcutter to be superior. - Especially in the lightweight alloy 'J' frame revolver.
    A standard pressure 148 'ish' grain full WC made of hard cast lead, will cut a full diameter bullet hole right through an unarmored (no balisitc vest,) human target.
    You should love these than. Standard Pressure Short Barrel Low Flash Heavy .38 Special Pistol & Handgun Ammunition
    In my wetpack tests they are absolute cannon balls, you can trust BB's velocity reports too.
    Anthony likes this.

  16. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by CountShotula View Post
    You should love these than. Standard Pressure Short Barrel Low Flash Heavy .38 Special Pistol & Handgun Ammunition
    In my wetpack tests they are absolute cannon balls, you can trust BB's velocity reports too.
    Very nice indeed Sir.
    I "roll my own" down here generally, being that imported ammo is very difficult to come by.
    Factory? - We have CBC (Magtech,) only, and it is VERY expensive!

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