RBCD ammo Platinum Plus 60gr./ or Magsafe

[ascendmfg]

The range I'm a member of pushes these brands, I'm currently carrying 60gr. RBCD Platinum plus total fragmentation rounds. I googled RBCD and they seam to be making some pretty nasty rounds. Anyone have knowledge/experience with these rounds?

Thanks for the input.

Ben

[DefensiveCarry.com]

[myusername]

Box of truth tested these and they broke apart without penetrating very far. IIRC

I always use DPX, Gold Dot, and would use Double Tap loaded Gold Dot.

[ascendmfg]

, Bummer


The Magsafe
or

The RBCD

Thanks
Ben

[TyC]

Ben do you shoot at rangemasters too?
I dont know much about the mag safe but since they push RBCD I thought i'd check them out a bit. From what i've read there is alot of controvery about them and the tests that have been performed. They say things like "the bullet only works on warm targets so the balistics jello tests dont count"
I dont know if i buy into the blended metal tech of their lightweight high velocity bullets, seems they lack alot of penetration. Also at 2 bucks a bullet I dont have the cash to shoot a couple hundred rounds to make sure it feeds and fires well with my gun.
Here are some of the tests.
Box o truth
http://www.theboxotruth.com/docs/bot38.htm

tests with many bullets in gel
http://www.goldenloki.com/ammo/gel/9mm/gel9.htm

RBCD tests into gel
http://www.rbcd.net/gelatin%20photos.html

do some searches or try them out and see if you like them.

[thedude]

The shop out here pushes RBCD pretty heavily. I am nothing short of amazed with this stuff.

If you search for RBCD on youtube you can find their video compairing a few types of ammo into clay. If you pick up a box try shooting a nice big ham. They have a video showing that in the store. Very impresive.

[aus71383]

I'd never heard of RBCD until just now, but I've known about Magsafe for a long time. 10 years ago (I was in middle school) I did a science project on terminal ballistics, and knew through a chain of people a guy named Joe Zambone. He invented the Magsafe bullets, made them in his house/shop, and sold them. Basically he would melt the lead out of a hollowpoint, fill it with birdshot (size depended on caliber) and then cover it with epoxy. When they'd hid, the epoxy would break - and you'd get a massive wound - although not too deep. I tested a ton of different bullets in ballistic gelatin. Good times! Lucky I went to a private middle school...

I don't think I'd want to gamble on someone else's technological marvel. A 230 grain .451 diameter hollowpoint going around 900 fps is what I depend on.

JMO

Austin

edited to add: Joe sold the company, but died in New Zealand in a head on collision with a semi soon afterwards. I think his pelvis was broken and he bled to death. This was some years ago IIRC

[SCGunGuy]

Seach RBCD or LeMas over at TacticalForums. Quite an eye-opening experience.

Here's one thread for starters: http://www.tacticalforums.com/cgi-bi...;f=78;t=001189

Also, take a look at the Recommended Pistol Service Caliber loads thread there (http://www.tacticalforums.com/cgi-bi...;f=78;t=000964).

[Randy]

RBCD = Stay away.

Also, there doesn't appear to be a calibration BB present in the gelatin blocks pictured. No BB, no calibrated gelatin.

Randy

[TyC]

Wow just read that link you provided SCGunGuy. I think im going to write it down and give it to the guys at my range who make fun of my carry ammo.

[thedude]

RBCD = Stay away.

Also, there doesn't appear to be a calibration BB present in the gelatin blocks pictured. No BB, no calibrated gelatin.

Randy

Would you mind expounding a bit on that? Not trying to start an argument but this is the first time I've ever heard this stuff knocked...

[stmcelroy]

Neither.....

Get yourself a quality hollowpoint like a Gold Dot or use a FMJ bullet for greater penetration.

Neither RBCD(CRAP) or Magsafe offer you any better chance of stopping a bad guy, they probably offer you less of a chance.

[MitchellCT]

I wouldn't trust it.

Too many companies have too much invested in the LE market to not be doing similar things if it works as they claim it to work.

If ATK (speer & federal), Remington, Winchester and others aren't going in this direction, it makes me wonder.

Those companies have proven products. Proven in the lab and on the street.

Till a major company adopts the ultra lights for production AND a major police department starts using them with good results...

Pass.

Look into DPX if you want to see "the next best thing"

[Texas Yankee]

Might want to check this link as well: LEMAS Ammo testing on pigs - SOCNET: The SpecialOperations.com Bulletin Board

BTW the writeup on the tactical forum is on Lemas ammo that is only available to the LE and Military. Even Lemas admits that it doesn't expand in gelatin. RBCD that we can buy is claimed to expand in gelatin and clearly blew up in water on the Box site. It seems to me it acts like frangible ammo generally acts.

From the limited incidents, I have read about involving frangibles, they seem to work pretty well and I haven't read of any failures. Again though, this is a very limited sample.

The issue with frangibles is do you trust a shallow, 3-10 inch, but wide, 2-7 inch, hole more or less than you trust a deep, 10-20 inch, thin, .38-.75 inch, hole. Also do you have any worry about penetration through walls.

Personally, I think both frangibles and classic hollow points have their places.

[TyC]

Would you mind expounding a bit on that? Not trying to start an argument but this is the first time I've ever heard this stuff knocked...

Ballistic gelatin - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

To ensure accurate results, immediately prior to use, the gelatin block is "calibrated" by firing into it a standard .177 caliber (4.5 mm) steel BB, from an air gun over a gun chronograph into the gelatin, and the depth of penetration measured. While the exact calibration methods vary slightly, the calibration method used by the INS National Firearms Unit is fairly typical. It requires a velocity of 600 ± 10 f/s (183 ± 3 m/s), and a BB penetration between 3.25 and 3.75 inches (8.3 to 9.5 cm). 600 f/s is two to three times faster than the velocity of a BB propelled by a typical spring-air BB gun, and so where a typical BB gun might not penetrate the elastic skin of an animal, the higher velocity calibration shot will penetrate the gelatin more than might be expected

No BB means that the gel could be of any density, and the results of the test aren't correct.

[ascendmfg]

Guess I opened a small can there, and then walked away from it for awile. Thanks for all the input. Have since ordered a box of federal HC's 147 gr., and a box of Winchester LE 147gr. "talons?".


TC, yes I have a membership at Rangemasters

Thanks everybody

Ben