Pistol Calibers in Carbines?

Pistol Calibers in Carbines?

This is a discussion on Pistol Calibers in Carbines? within the Defensive Ammunition & Ballistics forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; My question is would the round below have a higher velocity in turn making it have more energy , or would the barrel be so ...

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Thread: Pistol Calibers in Carbines?

  1. #1
    Member Array 357sig's Avatar
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    Feb 2008
    Chesterfield, Va

    Pistol Calibers in Carbines?

    My question is would the round below have a higher velocity in turn making it have more energy , or would the barrel be so much longer that it would slow down the velocity? This is a 40 S&W from Double Tap

    Deep Penetrating and hard-hitting! This load offer both for woods and hunting applications.

    The 200gr WFNGC @ 1050fps from a Glock 23!

    990fps 435 ft/lbs from a 3.5"bbl.

    1100fps 538 ft/lbs from a 4.5"bbl.

    Caliber : .40 S&W

    Bullet : 200gr. Wide Flat Nose Gas Checked

    Ballistics : 200gr. @ 1050fps / 490 ft/lbs- Glock 23 (4.0"bbl)
    Glock 22 4.5" bbl - 1106fps
    Glock 27 3.5" bbl - 1009fps

    Box of 50rds.
    Glock 32 (357 sig)

  2. #2
    Member Array laeckcrov's Avatar
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    Oct 2008
    Groton, CT
    The longer the barrel, the slower burning your powder can be. I'd recommend hand loading a pistol caliber carbine so you could figure out what works best, and gives you more bang. I would also assume the carbine might have higher pressure limits, but that's a guess. I'm sure someone here would know though.
    The muzzle end of a .45 pretty much says, "Go Away" in every language.

    Fast is fine, accuracy is final. Learn to be slow in a hurry.

    "I never met a man that had been in a gunfight and wished that he had a smaller gun. Ever."

  3. #3
    Member Array 357sig's Avatar
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    any other coments on velocity and ME from a carbine in pistol caliber???
    Glock 32 (357 sig)

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  5. #4
    VIP Member Array ccw9mm's Avatar
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    Well, with any specific cartridge, it's loaded with a certain amount of a given powder, and it's chosen that way to deliver a particular speed, power, pressure and flash in a given-length barrel. Often, the length of barrel in which it's intended to be used isn't specified.

    Double Tap does specify, on many of its loads.

    Consider the DT .44 Magnum: 240gr. Speer GDSP, which publishes the following ballistics:

    * 1500fps - 1200 ft./lbs. - 6.5" bbl.
    * 1810fps from a Win. 1894AE 16" trapper carbine (no force mentioned)

    Same cartridge. Two different-length bbls mentioned. No indication of which is the better match, which it was really designed for.

    I'm sure the reloading experts in the crowd can discuss the degree of tuning that can be done to optimize pressures, velocity, power, muzzle flash (wasted powder) ... all matched to the given bbl length.a load.

    I also have pistol-caliber carbines. A Marlin 1894P 16" .44mag lever-action, and a Marlin 1894CP 16" .357mag lever-action.

    My ammo choice, short of reloading (which I don't yet do): DoubleTap's Speer Gold Dot .357mag and .44mag, and Buffalo Bore's .44mag. These three loads have good power, low flash and excellent accuracy. Optimized for 16" length bbls? Dunno, but all three seem to work well in these two carbines.

    My only question is: what's the pressure curve of these loads in the carbines versus a ~4-6" bbl revolver using the same cartridge; what's the relative muzzle flash and amount of wasted powder. While these loads seem to work well in my two carbines, without strict testing I can't be certain these are "optimized," as such.
    Your best weapon is your brain. Don't leave home without it.
    Thoughts: Justifiable self defense (A.O.J.).
    Explain: How does disarming victims reduce the number of victims?
    Reason over Force: Why the Gun is Civilization (Marko Kloos).

  6. #5
    Ex Member Array echobaby's Avatar
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    Higher velocity and energy from a carbine.

  7. #6
    New Member Array automag928's Avatar
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    FWIW, and only because I've researched this already. Here are some examples on a Keltec Sub2000 9mm carbine from keltec forums. As you can see, a little higher velocity.

    Win 147 gr PP - Five shots through the SUB-2000:

    1111 FPS
    1139 FPS
    1119 FPS
    1136 FPS
    1130 FPS

    1139 FPS - High
    1127 FPS - Average
    1111 FPS - Low
    28 Extreme Spread
    11 Standard Deviation

    Win 147 gr PP - Five shots through the Kahr PM9:

    938 FPS
    923 FPS
    910 FPS
    934 FPS
    915 FPS

    938 FPS - High
    924 FPS - Average
    910 FPS - Low
    28 Extreme Spread
    11 Standard Deviation

  8. #7
    Senior Member Array Beans's Avatar
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    AZ Border Territory,
    About 25 years ago a southern Nevada Police department was testing some ballistic material to install in and around thier radio room, which was visible and exterior accessable to the public, but there was no access to the radio room by the public.

    The radio room had bullet proof glass and they were looking for something to put inside the walls surrounding the room.

    The material had stopped everything from fired from a handgun including .22 to a .44 Mag, until I showed up at the range with my Marlin 1894 Carbine, in .357 Magnum

    We loaded it with 125 Gr Jacked Hollow points, PD issued ammo, and proceeded to poke holes in the ballistic material.

    They rethought the material they had considered and I learned something
    Last edited by Beans; November 12th, 2008 at 09:17 AM. Reason: spelling error

  9. #8
    VIP Member Array Superhouse 15's Avatar
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    Carbine loads

    The only way to know for sure is to chronograph the particular load in your rifle and pistol. I have a bunch of pistol caliber carbines, an Uzi, Marlin Camp .45, Ruger PC9, etc. I also maintain some Kel Tec .40s and an AR in 9mm for some local PDs. The 9mms seem to be the most sensitive to different loads, but a chrono is the only way to know for sure. Anything else is just a guess.

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