Best 9mm round for Defense?

This is a discussion on Best 9mm round for Defense? within the Defensive Ammunition & Ballistics forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; My wife went with 127 GR. +P+ Winchester Ranger http://bellsouthpwp2.net/s/c/scgunguy/rangerlist.htm & you can get them from a site sponsor....

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Thread: Best 9mm round for Defense?

  1. #31
    VIP Member Array Thanis's Avatar
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    My wife went with 127 GR. +P+ Winchester Ranger


    http://bellsouthpwp2.net/s/c/scgunguy/rangerlist.htm & you can get them from a site sponsor.

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  3. #32
    Distinguished Member Array P7fanatic's Avatar
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    Cool

    Federal HST's


    "The price of freedom is eternal vigilance." -Thomas Jefferson

    "Liberalism is a Mental Disorder." -Michael Savage

    GOOD Gun Control is being able to hit your target! -Myself

  4. #33
    Senior Member Array dripster's Avatar
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    Remington Golden Saber Bonded 124 grain +p.
    One more step and it's on!

  5. #34
    Member Array theheater905's Avatar
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    In order of preference:
    Federal HST 147gr, 124gr+P
    Speer GD 147gr, 124gr +P

  6. #35
    Member Array Munsterman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by theheater905 View Post
    In order of preference:
    Federal HST 147gr, 124gr+P
    Speer GD 147gr, 124gr +P
    Where are you finding the 147 gr.+P HST's ?

  7. #36
    Ex Member Array AVIVIII's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cat-O-Matic View Post
    I am trying to find a 9mm round that has a proven street record for stopping the criminal. This round will be used for protecting my home.
    With all the misinformation on the internet I am trying to find what ammo (if I apply good shot placement) has a good reputation for neturalizing a BG. Any suggestions are welcomed--Many Thanks!
    A .45!

    Just kidding.

    Go for higher velocity over increased weight. In a 9mm, a 124gr+p has better ballistics than a 147gr any day, plus with the higher velocity, you get better penetration, especially if they are wearing heavier clothing. After that, its basically your choice of Gold Dot, HST, Ranger, Golden Saber or Cor-Bon. Or whatever other favorite brand there is out there.

    Whatever you choose, get a few boxes of it and make sure it functions correctly in your gun. I have had ZERO problems with any of the above listed ammo in many different firearms.

  8. #37
    Member Array 15AcreWoods's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Texian View Post
    With good shot placement any ammo in a major caliber (9mm, .40S&W, .45ACP) will do the job. I have to wonder how many of those who constantly agonize over which "magic bullet" is the best have achieved the defensive skills that deliver this shot placement. Without these skills it is unlikely that any handgun round will deliver this magic "stopping power."

    Concentrate on training and practice. Get the best professional instruction that you can afford. Cultivate a warrior mindset and strive to avoid the situations that are most likely to expose you to deadly force situations and learn conflict resolution skills. Then if you still want to engage in the quest for the "magic ammo," carry on.

    I agree with you. Too much talk of ballistics and too little time at the range. A .500 S&W wonít stop anything you miss. I canít think of a 9mm round I would want to be hit in the sternum with. I do remember a .25 APC I shot into a clay embankment that bounced back and hit me in the chest. It didnít even leave a bruise.
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  9. #38
    Member Array Darkwater's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AVIVIII View Post
    Go for higher velocity over increased weight. In a 9mm, a 124gr+p has better ballistics than a 147gr any day, plus with the higher velocity, you get better penetration, especially if they are wearing heavier clothing.
    Untrue - The Federal HST 147 gr provides better penetration and expands better then the Federal HST in 124gr +p. You do even better if you purchase the 147gr in +P.

    There is a reason why the LE testing of Federal HST in 9mm has only compared the 147gr to the Ranger Ts. They never have supplied the 124gr because it does not perform nearly as well as the 147gr.

  10. #39
    Ex Member Array AVIVIII's Avatar
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    Well, I haven't been able to find anyone that makes a 147gr+p besides the Fed HST, and it is nothing besides changing the headstamp. They do claim an additional, blistering 50fps at the muzzle. Thats from a 4" barrel. Whoop-dee-do.

    Heres the chart from the Fed LE HST

    It goes:
    147gr
    124gr+p
    147gr+p
    Thats the only way the table would come up.

    Show me some dead people with holes in them and we can talk. Until then, I'll stick with physics, Mr. Newton and the numbers.

  11. #40
    VIP Member Array LongRider's Avatar
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    Federal HST out performs everything else by every measure I have seen

    Here are a couple of links I posted on another thread. Federal HST by far out performs every other bullet I have seen and studied. No matter what they are shot through or into they are the most consistent performing and expanding round available. Ammunition To Go! keeps a supply available with decent prices and excellent service. They of course carry other premium ammo, Rangers Gold Dots, Golden Sabers etc all of which they tend to have in stock.

    This first set are tests done at LEO facilities around the country and provide a great deal of comparative information of several different brands of ammo including Rangers and HST. They are downloadable PDF files so you will need Adobe Acrobat to read them if you do not have Adobe Acrobat . You can download it
    Here

    Los Angeles County - California
    Riverside - California
    Santa Clara - California
    Fresno County - California
    Kern County - California
    Sacramento County - California
    San Angelo - Texas
    Pierce County Workshop - Washington
    San Diego County Workshop - California
    Portland Police Bureau - Oregon

    The following are links to pages with some pretty dramatic pics of different SD ammo from a two different sites. Nothing like seeing the expansion difference side by side. Lots of 9mm pics
    ballistics testing - round 1 - varied 9mm JHP's
    ballistics testing - round 2 - varied 9mm JHP's
    ballistics testing - round 3 - varied 9mm JHP's - shooting through tshirts
    ballistics testing - round 5 - comparing 9mm JHP velocities
    ballistics testing - round 6 - Federal HST 9mm vs 45 acp
    ballistics testing - round 7 - shooting through denim - 9 mm, 45 acp, and 357 magnum

    Terminal Ballistics .45 ACP
    Terminal Ballistics 9mm

    There is also a rather informative thread here with pics at Federal HST vs, Hydra-Shock pics

    Below is a pic of my rather meager example of HST compared to some other premium SD ammunition. By the time I did this I no longer had any expanded .45 Ranger rounds. To be honest after I shot some HST and compared it to Ranger I was pretty ticked. I had just bought over $200 of Rangers that I ended up shooting at targets. The .45 Rangers look pretty much like the .380 Rangers except larger but not nearly as large as the HST or even the Golden Sabers
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  12. #41
    VIP Member Array cvhoss's Avatar
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    Have to agree with the HSTs. I'm already carrying them in my 40 and the next order I place with ATG will have some in 9mm on it to replace the Winchester Ranger they're currently loaded with.

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  13. #42
    VIP Member Array eagle5's Avatar
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    I use the HST 147gr as my defensive round. Can't say whether they are the BEST solution, but I am happy and confident with their performance and they shoot well for me.

  14. #43
    Member Array Darkwater's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AVIVIII View Post
    Show me some dead people with holes in them and we can talk. Until then, I'll stick with physics, Mr. Newton and the numbers.
    Delivering more energy isn't everything. I like the FBI tests that measure penetration and permanent wound cavity. While they don't use dead people, they do use 10% gel. Penetration should be between 12 and 16 inches. More and you risk over penetration and less will give you under penetration.

    What has been found is the lighter rounds in a given caliber can just create shallow surface damage while the heavier round has the momentum to continue to the 12 to 16 inches. Like all generalizations, this one doesn't apply to all rounds from all manufactures.

    The real test, of course, is to go out there and test it yourself. NOTHING is better then testing the ammo you will carry in your own gun. You should be shooting at least 200 rounds to ensure a jam free operation of your firearm anyway. Spend the 90 bucks and get some gel and test'm. That's what I did.



    The abstract is the 9mm 124 gr fragmented and did not penetrate as far as the 147 gr.

    We also tested RangerTs and a vintage BlackTalon. The expanded size was noticably smaller then the 124gr HST but they did have slightly better penetration. The one guy who had several thousand rounds of RangerT took one look and is going to dump his supply. In hindsight I should have taken measurements for science but to those on the range it was painfully obvious that they were not as good as the 147gr HST it didn't seem necessary at the time. The goal on the range, after all, was just HST testing.

  15. #44
    VIP Member Array LongRider's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cvhoss View Post
    Have to agree with the HSTs. I'm already carrying them in my 40 and the next order I place with ATG will have some in 9mm on it to replace the Winchester Ranger they're currently loaded with.

    Hoss
    I made a huge mistake with the rangers and bought a box of 500 before doing any tests with them the result was severely disappointing. Total waste of a couple hundred bucks with none of the famed talons, I have seen better expansion from Wally World hollow points,. Wished I had of taken pics of the Ranger .45 rounds but after I saw how bad they were I was so ticked off I sent all 500 rounds down range. I was all over paper probably more a function of being so angry than the ammo. To my credit most of my rounds still hit COM just not anything you would identify as groups.

    The HST got the complete opposite responce I was amazed at their consistency and expansion.

    Darkwater is on the money with doing your own tests nothing like seeing the results to make you comfortable that your ammo will do its job as long as you do yours. Even water bottles and wet newspapers will work
    Abort the Obamanation not the Constitution

    Those who would, deny, require permit, license, certification, or authorization for me to bear arms are as vile, dangerous & evil as those who would molest, abuse, assault, rape or murder my family

  16. #45
    Distinguished Member Array Stetson's Avatar
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    I use winchester 147 grain self defense rounds that you can buy at walmart.
    Last time I bought them I paid $12.95 for 50 rounds I sure they must be up to twenty bucks a box by now the way ammo going.

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