45 acp ammo, FMJ or Flat Point FMJ

This is a discussion on 45 acp ammo, FMJ or Flat Point FMJ within the Defensive Ammunition & Ballistics forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Does 45 ACP FMJ round nose do more damage than Flat Point FMJ ?...

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Thread: 45 acp ammo, FMJ or Flat Point FMJ

  1. #1
    Member Array Tx1911's Avatar
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    45 acp ammo, FMJ or Flat Point FMJ

    Does 45 ACP FMJ round nose do more damage than Flat Point FMJ ?
    Springfield Armory 1911-A1 TRP SS
    Glock 17
    Glock 32 ( w/ 23 barrel )
    Smith & Wesson M&P 9

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    Senior Member Array coffeecup's Avatar
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    About the same I would guess. Both are non-expanding .45 caliber.

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    VIP Member Array cvhoss's Avatar
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    I would think that the FP would do a bit more damage but probably not enough to concern yourself about. Compare it to pushing a needle into your finger as opposed to pushing a paper clip into your finger. The more streamlined profile of the needle pushes the tissue aside whereas the paper clip has to tear the tissue. Just like shooting a paper target. The FP bullets punch out a clean hole where the RN bullets push the paper aside and then the hole tries to close up. In either case, as coffeecup said, you're only going to end up with a 45 cal hole as neither is going to expand much. With the power of a 45, I really can't think of any good reason not to use a quality HP and get some bullet expansion.

    Hoss
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    Member Array Tx1911's Avatar
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    re:

    Thanks for the replies. I use HPs in my 1911. I was just wondering because I have a friend that says he hunts with the FP, and says it does all this damage.
    Springfield Armory 1911-A1 TRP SS
    Glock 17
    Glock 32 ( w/ 23 barrel )
    Smith & Wesson M&P 9

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    +1 on what Hoss said.
    “You can sway a thousand men by appealing to their prejudices quicker than you can convince one man by logic.”

    ― Robert A. Heinlein,

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    Member Array Bart's Avatar
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    Isn't a .45 BIG ENOUGH? There are many reasons for a hollow point & expansion, the .45 is NOT one of them!

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    VIP Member Array cphilip's Avatar
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    I wouldn't want to get shot with any of them...

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    VIP Member Array cvhoss's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bart View Post
    Isn't a .45 BIG ENOUGH? There are many reasons for a hollow point & expansion, the .45 is NOT one of them!

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    Quite frankly, I don't want to be shot with a 22, but anyone who thinks the 45 is some magical beast that as soon as you point it the BG dies from fear needs to read this article. As far as I'm concerned, regardless of what gun and what caliber I may be carrying at the time I want to make the biggest hole with the most tissue damage possible.

    Hoss
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    Member Array Bart's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cvhoss View Post
    Quite frankly, I don't want to be shot with a 22, but anyone who thinks the 45 is some magical beast that as soon as you point it the BG dies from fear needs to read this article. As far as I'm concerned, regardless of what gun and what caliber I may be carrying at the time I want to make the biggest hole with the most tissue damage possible.

    Hoss
    I agree that there is no magical bullet, however, the .45 is a big enough hole, it will penetrate deeper through bone and tissue and still not over penetrate. Shot placement is everything, regardless of the size of the hole. 80 % of those wounded with a hollow point survive their wounds. The only one to benefit from using a hollow point in .45 cal. is the BG. The hollow point is a social issue...STOP THEM, DON'T KILL THEM. IMHO, if you can't take them down with standard 230 gr. ball ammo, throw the gun at them and run like hell.
    :tumbleweed

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    Senior Member Array bbqgrill's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tx1911 View Post
    Thanks for the replies. I use HPs in my 1911. I was just wondering because I have a friend that says he hunts with the FP, and says it does all this damage.
    Interesting, several states do not allow FMJ for hunting.
    "To believe that social reforms can eradicate evil altogether is to forget that evil is a protean creature, forever assuming a new shape when deprived of an old one." - SAT

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    VIP Member Array cvhoss's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bbqgrill View Post
    Interesting, several states do not allow FMJ for hunting.
    Kansas Legal Firearms for Deer:
    FIREARM: Centerfire rifles and handguns that are not fully automatic and that fire a bullet larger than .23 inches in diameter and that use a cartridge case that is 1.280 inches or more in length, while using only hard-cast solid lead, soft point, hollow point, or other expanding bullets;
    I guess our game biologists didn't read the report that 80% of hits with HP bullets are non lethal. Try as I might, I can't remember a single critter I've shot with a HP that ever required a second shot as long as the first one is in the right place. A leg hit isn't going to kill a critter, FMJ or HP. I'd equate using a FMJ to hunt with to bowhunting using target points instead of broadheads. For deer in Kansas, I really don't have to worry about the 45 because as you can see in the regs quoted above, the 45 ACP doesn't meet the minimum requirement for a legal deer cartridge. While I've known several guys who handgun hunted deer with a .357, my personal minimum is 44 mag. I don't like wounding animals and I hate having to blood trail them and maybe lose them but any caliber I hunt with is going to have an expanding bullet in it just like my self-defense carry guns.

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    Senior Member Array usmc3169's Avatar
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    Dont understand why you would shoot something with a FMJ when HP exists....
    The single biggest factor in killing something with pistols (it is different with rifles) is size of the permanent wound channel. HP's expand = bigger permanent wound channel. FMJ's go straight through = smaller wound channel. The argument that having an exit hole with FMJ makes them bleed out faster is laughably niave. You only see more blood. The real bleeding associated with HP's is internal.

    round nose and flat nose? same difference - I like the example of a pin and a paper clip.

    wanna kill something? use HP.
    "All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing."

  14. #13
    VIP Member Array dukalmighty's Avatar
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    What's he hunting with a 45 ...field mice
    "Outside of the killings, Washington has one of the lowest crime rates in the country,"
    --Mayor Marion Barry, Washington , DC .

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    Member Array Dr Guido's Avatar
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    I've seen this debated everywhere. I've seen all kinds of YouTube vids showing hollow points doing damage to water jugs, water jugs stuffed with paper, water jugs wearing 4 layers of denim, and ballistic gelatin. When I see what a hollow point bullet looks like after it has penetrated an expensive leather motorcycle jacket, a leather "plate" about the thickness of an average mans' belt, 4 layers of denim, and then something that approximated a sternum before making a good penetration into some ballistic gelatin, I'll use that bullet. But until then, i'm going to continue to use FMJ flat points. The type that handgun hunters use. HP's are for police department lawyers who are more concerned with pubic perceptions than officer's lives. Don't reply to me unless you've seen a few autopsies.
    After many years of consideration, I must regretfully conclude that diversity is our enemy.

  16. #15
    VIP Member Array Tubby45's Avatar
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    FP bullets drive more square to the target than the RN bullets. RN bullets are more prone to stray off course than FP bullets. Neither is more effective terminally than the other.
    07/02 FFL/SOT since 2006

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