200 gr blunt round nose .38 special ammo

200 gr blunt round nose .38 special ammo

This is a discussion on 200 gr blunt round nose .38 special ammo within the Defensive Ammunition & Ballistics forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Hi Does anyone know a custom loader that loads 200 gr blunt round nose .38 special ammo ?? I can no longer buy the Winchester ...

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  1. #1
    Member Array rojo's Avatar
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    Question 200 gr blunt round nose .38 special ammo

    Hi Does anyone know a custom loader that loads 200 gr blunt round nose .38 special ammo ??
    I can no longer buy the Winchester or Western I had previous used , please post , rojo


  2. #2
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    Array bmcgilvray's Avatar
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    You might try Gad. I've obtained some obscure components for hand loading obsolete cartridges. He knows his business and can supply most any special request.

    Gad Custom Reloaded Cartridges and Shell Reloading Services

    It's a hoot that you ask for 200 grain .38 Special ammunition which was once offered as one way to obtain enhanced performance from the .38 Special. Conventional wisdom generally has generally held that the heavy bullet was not a good trade off for the decreased velocities obtained in factory loadings. I've shot some old factory loads but never chronographed them. They seemed very mild.

    I don't think the heavy weight .38 slug is as useless as some do. I did play with hand loading the 200 grain bullet for some years, using data in one of the older Lyman manuals. The first deer I ever took with a handgun was effectively dropped with a hand loaded 200 grain Remington lead round nose component bullet fired from a long barreled Smith & Wesson Model 14 .38 Special. The bullet apparently turned after entry and was lodged in the rib cage on the off side, the soft lead expanded considerably. Velocity was higher than the factory loading though.
    Charter Member of the DC .41 LC Society "Get heeled! No really"

    “No possible rapidity of fire can atone for habitual carelessness of aim with the first shot.”

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  3. #3
    Member Array rojo's Avatar
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    Wink 200 gr blunt round nose .38 special ammo

    hi bmcgilvray, very interesting , the policeman who turned me on to 299 gr .38 special told me they somtimes key-hole , it would leave a hell of a wound track , will check with Gal, many thanks rojo

  4. #4
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    I purchased a number of boxes of Remington 200 grain bullets on a close out many years ago and had fun shooting them up. I discovered this single remaining box when I packed up for a move last year.


    GhostMaker likes this.
    Charter Member of the DC .41 LC Society "Get heeled! No really"

    “No possible rapidity of fire can atone for habitual carelessness of aim with the first shot.”

    Theodore Roosevelt, The Wilderness Hunter, 1893

  5. #5
    Member Array rojo's Avatar
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    Thumbs up

    howdy bmcgilvray, I'll try and post some Western / Winchester style they are semi circle round nose , I gave two boxes to a friend in under cover law enforcement , she had to shot on two different occaisions both one shot man stoppers in upper torso.
    Of coarse the dept gave her days off , non dept issue round , the world is getting weider every day

  6. #6
    Senior Member Array Sky Pilot's Avatar
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    30 years ago and more, I believe in Gun World magazine, an article on the heavier bullets in .38 Spl. for the short (2") barrel revolvers. testing showed these bullets keyholed reliably; the article postulated that this larger striking area improved their stopping ability.
    I read the article, scratched my head, and as I was still in college at the time, allowed as I'd maybe give it a try sometime ... but never have.
    Short of getting a mold and casting my own, I have absolutely no idea where to get the heavier grain bullets.
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  7. #7
    Member Array rojo's Avatar
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    Thumbs up 200 gr blunt round nose .38 special ammo

    howdy Sky Pilot, at on time here in the north east you buy the heads or loades ammo at the many gun shows , ohh the hay dayof the Newburgh gun show , new yorks slice of heven east of the Vegas show, then there was a man Westchester NY who cast them , all long gone but in memories , rojo

  8. #8
    Member Array rojo's Avatar
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    200 gr blunt round nose .38 special ammo

    Hi guys , here are some picture s of ammo left to right
    200 Peters, 200 gr Western luboloy, 200 gr Winchester , 158 lead and last 200 gr Winchester lead ,, great old bullets , rojo




  9. #9
    Member Array LouisianaMan's Avatar
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    Hello, has anyone chronographed their 200g loads? I just posted to a different thread about my "experiments" with 200g lead semi-wadcutter bullets. . .which have become my favorite load! I buy them from Mt. Baldy Bullets and load them myself, and am very interested in doing two things:
    1. Ensuring that the velocity of my reloads is comparable to original factory loads.
    2. Comparing the penetration of LRNs to the LSWC-K I've used.
    Since I'm waiting for a Lee custom mold in 195g weight--it's a round-nose--I will soon be able to cast some of my own. I've seen posts elsewhere stating that factory 200g loads achieved 730fps or 770 fps from 6" barrels; believe the latter was the "Highway Patrol" loading, but unsure how it differed from the 730 fps load. . . .I'd like to know what MV to expect from my 2" Colt D.S. (I've loaded the LSWC-K to 718 fps, which may be about right. Also to 761 fps, which I think might be somewhat warm for a D-frame--not what I want!)
    Although I would feel well-armed with many modern hollow-point rounds, I remain concerned about their expansion from a 2-inch barrel. I feel more confident with the heavyweight 200g LSWC-K slugs whose penetration & felt power (i.e. recoil) are convincing to me. I'm looking forward to figuring out where the LRN fits in. . .I, too, have seen posts that indicate the destabilization of the LRNs contributes to their stopping power. Although I think I'd generally prefer the straight-through penetration demonstrated by the LSWC-K, it may be significant that high-velocity rifle rounds such as certain .223/5.56mm rounds have been shown to wind up facing base-forward after penetrating a target. I think I've read where other high-vel. rifles tend to do the same thing. Perhaps the 200g .38 LRN has benefited from the same tendency. Just like the early M-16 ammo, in that they both had a decent record in anti-personnel mode, but lacked penetration through helmets, car bodies, etc. For my SD purposes, I'm not concerned about penetrating car bodies like LE must be.
    Happy shooting!

  10. #10
    Member Array LouisianaMan's Avatar
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    Quick follow-up.

    I just loaded 10 rounds with 200g LRN (I think they're 358430) and 3.5g Unique, measuring each charge. Velocity from my Ruger Police Service-Six 4" barrel .38SPL was 710.5fps at 5' from muzzle. Standard deviation was 9+, i.e. single digits. I haven't measured barrel-cylinder gap in that gun yet. OAL was 1.540, bullet crimped into top lube groove just beneath the shoulder of the bullet. I won't quote group size, but will simply state it was tighter than I usually shoot! :-) Temps were mid-90s, humidity. . .YES!

    Per the Lee 2nd Ed. reloading manual, standard pressure .38SPL is 3.4g - 3.6g; +P is 3.5g to 3.7g. I'm not sure why the overlap. I forget the exact velocity the book stated, but for 3.5g it's about 760-ish. Bbl. length unknown, but I'd guess 6" from the numbers he gives.

    Will soon modify this load and do a penetration test and post results.

  11. #11
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    Are those the Famous "flying ashtrays"? LOL
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  12. #12
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    Hi LouisianaMan;

    The hunting load I developed for the Remington 200 grain lead round nose bullet used 9.5 grains of 2400 which which is a maximum load for that powder. I fired it over my chronograph from both a Smith & Wesson Model 10 with a 4-inch barrel and a Smith & Wesson Model 14 with an 8 3/8-inch barrel.

    Velocity from the 4-inch barrel was 842 fps yielding 313 ft./lbs of energy.

    Velocity from the 8 3/8-inch barrel was 922 fps, yielding 376 ft./lbs. of energy.

    I took the buck with the 8 3/8-inch gun, the bullet damaging the right lung, top of the heart and ending up wedged in a rib just under the hide on the opposite side. It had turned sideways and had a large smear of lead about the side of a dime on one side. I don't now recall what the retained weight of the bullet was but it seems that it was about 95 %. The lead on these bullets is really soft.

    I like the velocity performance of the 200 grain bullet in the 4-inch barrel. If I could obtain or mold bullets with a large flat nose of 200 grain weight I'd really go for such heavy bullets in the .38 Special (and the .357 Magnum). It'd be a good, hard-hitting bullet at velocities from 850 fps or more.

    I once contrived to do an expansion test with the 200 grain bullet and the 2400 load using my 4-inch barreled .38 Special revolver. I lined up six one gallon plastic milk jugs full of water, thinking the bullet should stop in one of them. I carefully centered the sights on the front jug and fired. Upon firing I heard the bullet "thwack" into a stand of willows 50 yards behind my jugs. It had penetrated all the jugs.

  13. #13
    Member Array LouisianaMan's Avatar
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    BMC,
    Those numbers are amazing! I've seen a post with old Lyman data for 195g, and the load with 2400 was in a different velocity class than the other powders. Its max loads were 893 fps ( no bbl length stated) with your 9.5g load; probably your b/c gap was tighter & gave you higher vels.

    How did you find blast and/or flash with your 4" barrel revolver? I think 2400 is relatively slow-burning, thus does best in longer barrels--it might look like a flamethrower from my snubbies!

    I'll load up some Win231 tomorrow, probably in the 750ish range from my 4" guns. For SD, I've like 800ish, but want to work in all my revolvers, to include a couple of D-frames--much weaker than the Rugers, of course.

  14. #14
    Senior Member Array Landric's Avatar
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    I'd very much like to play around with a 200 grain lead bullet in .38 Special. However, I think I'd rather have a SWC profile. If I ever run across any bullets (not, as of yet at least, being a caster), I'd grab them and work up some loads.
    -Landric

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  15. #15
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    Hi LouisianaMan;

    Yes, my data came from the Lyman 46th manual. I pulled it down just now to find that the test revolver that Lyman used was a Smith & Wesson Model 14 with a 6-inch barrel. My Model 14 has a longer barrel and the relatively slow burning 2400 yielded a dab more velocity.

    From the 4-inch barrel I recall that the load made a brief yellow flash that wasn't as disturbing as is Blue Dot or Unique when fired in near maximum charges in the .357 Magnum or .44 Magnum with short barrels. I also found signs of powder residue that indicated inefficient burning in the .38 Special, likely due to the lower pressures required for the cartridge. In a Magnum revolver cartridge the 2400 burns fairly clean with full charges.

    Still, the 2400 beat out Unique and IMR 4227 for gaining the most velocity from the unusually heavy bullet in the .38 Special. I tried all three powders and settled on 2400 as the most potent choice.

    2400 also will kick out the 158 grain lead SWC at well over 1000 fps in a .38 Special with a 4-inch barrel but these days the .38 Special is watered down and some consider the loads in the old publications to be a bit stiff.

    Hey Landric;

    I agree with you that the heavy weight bullet in the .38 Special if configured as a semi-wadcutter and cast as soft lead would be an interesting and viable choice for self defense in the .38 Special, especially from a snub revolver.

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