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one shot stop percentage-.38spl vs.380

16K views 32 replies 26 participants last post by  mastercapt 
#1 ·
not long ago,someone on here posted an article stating the .380 has a slightly higher, one shot stop percentage over the .38spl....is this info accurate? everthing i've ever read says the 38spl is superior..what's your take on this?
 
#2 ·
"One shot stop" statistics are somewhat less useful than knowing what color unicorns the round works best against.

So many variables - shot placement, clothing, assailant mental state, assailant pharmacological state - make this a useless point of argument,IMHO.

.22, .38, .45, 12 Ga., phased plasma rifle in the 40 watt range, it doesn't matter. The tactic never changes. Shoot until the threat stops.

Matt
 
#3 ·
There are statistics out there to prove anything that one wants to prove. I'm sure its possible to "prove" through the use of statistics that the .22 LR is a better stopper than the .50 BMG, but I wouldn't believe it no matter who posted it.

I agree that one shot stop percentages are pretty much meaningless (though the books on the subject are an interesting read). However, the .38 Special pushes a bullet sometimes more than twice as heavy as a .380 bullet, at an equal or higher velocity. Which would seem to be more effective?
 
#4 ·
Check out this web sight about shooting ballistic gel. Many calibers are compared, and if shooting ballistic jello can tell the story then here is some food for consideration.


.38 Special
 
#6 · (Edited)
Evan will be the first to tell you that it was a measure of quantitative analysis and never a theory of tactics. Shoot until the threat stops.

Evan Marshall, along with Ed Sanow were the ones that came up with the One Shot Stop percentages. It was designed as a way of measuring a bullet's effectiveness in real life encounters. Prior to that we had, goat and "old wife's tales and second hand information.

Biker
 
#22 ·
Evan will be the first to tell you that it was a measure of quantitative analysis and never a theory of tactics. Shoot until the threat stops.
Good points, that said with calibers this small shot placement becomes extremely critical. As any non fatal hit is unlikely to cause any disabling injury. With either caliber I'd expect to unload, reload and unload again
 
#7 ·
Street statistics tell us nothing of value that can't be better gained from tests in gel through various coverings. The variables on the street make those figures virtually meaningless.

Back to .380 ACP vs. 38 spl. - How could a lighter bullet, traveling at the same speed as a heavier bullet perform better with the same medium of test? The only possible answer would be that the .380 was using a vastly superior bullet design to the one used in the 38.

Come to think of it - there is another answer! The guy testing the 38 could have been using a vastly inferior aiming technique and missed the target completely.
 
#8 ·
If I was betting money, I would always bet on the 38. Bullet weight helps with the penetration and the 380 is a weak performer due to not going deep enough. Sometimes studies don't ever evaluate the 380 as the researcher begins with the 9mm. Also, the 38 Special is usually where defense begins for many with a revolver. When was an officer's primary exposed gun in the U.S. a 380? Of course the 38 Special was carried for many many years as such. Lay the two caliber rounds side by side and you will see which probably has the advantage.
 
#15 ·
I was under the distinct impression that .38 sp +p was bordering on .357 mag, and that .380 +p was somewhat lighter than 9mm. Or to simplify, from lightest to heaviest:
.380
.380 +p
9mm
9mm +p
.38 sp
.38 sp +p
.357 mag
feel free to correct me if I have those mixed up.
 
#12 ·
I would be more interested if the figures available were for three or four quickly placed shots. Are you are planning to meet a deadly threat with a single shot and then ponder your next move?
 
#14 ·
I read that article. The reason the 380 ranked slightly higher, in my opinion was that they had less incidents of one shot 380 shootings. There were a lot more 38 spl shootings. The 22 is what suprised me.
 
#18 ·
The 9mm wins on energy because of the higher velocity.

Energy = 1/2 x mass x (velocity squared)

The attached chart shows energy, speed, penetration, one shot %, etc with different calibers. The 380 one shot % is less (sometimes) than both the 38 (depending which ammo) and the 9mm.

Handgun Cartridge Power Chart - Condensed Version
 
#20 ·
Oy vey. Not this again...:twak: (just kidding)

In general, the .38 Spl has more penetration than the .380. A .380 loaded with JHPs will likely not meet the FBI minimum of 12" - probably more like 10". However, load the .380 with FMJ and you should have good penetration. This is why I alternate FMJ and JHPs in my wife's LCP.

It all depends on what you want. A .380 has more ammo capacity (typically 7 shots vs 5 in a snubbie revolver), a thinner profile, and a faster reload.

I do not subscribe to "one shot stops" with ANY firearm short of a grenade launcher.:hand5:

.38 revolver or .380 pistol? Pick the one you can shoot the best, put the most shots on target the fastest, and can carry concealed. All the rest is nonsense.:smile:
 
#24 ·
If you NEED to pocket carry, a Ruger LCP is better than not carrying anything at all, but if you have any choices about concealment I would recommend going with one of the excellent concealable 9mm in a IWB configuration. Firearms like the Kahr PM9 P9 or even Glock 26 offer superior ballistics and ammo capacity to either .380 or .38. My view is just say no to mouse guns and find a IWB or smart carry configuration that will allow 9mm or greater

In strict terms I think .38 is better than .380 in just about every circumstance and almost as concealable especially considering firearm choices like the Ruger LCR
 
#26 ·
.38 spl. vs. .380 ACP (9mm "short")

38 Special or 380 ACP

.38 sp. vs. standard 9mm

9mm vs

.38 spl. vs. .357 magnum

New Page 1

Longer barrels than come with small autos and snub revolvers will change the data considerably - although the value for self defense use of each round probably remains in the same order of preference.

i.e.
.357
9mm
.38 spl.
.380

I'd like to see data on .38spl.+p and 9mm compared when using, say, 6 inch barrels before saying catagorically that 9mm is superior in that format though.
 
#30 ·
380 vs 38

I am an engineer. we design, take data, and publish specs.
One of my projects was a small outdoor TV antenna (AKA flying saucer model).
I tested with a $55K test instrument. Compared the antenna to other comparible antennas. Marketing had me make a comparison chart, based on specs which I did and ours was slightly better. However, ya know what? The customer (end user) ain't got one of them thar $55K test units. He puts it on his TV and if the football is fuzzy on Sunday, you get the antenna back on Monday. I tested using a TV about 40 miles from the transmitters, and could not tell muck diffeence between brands.

Point is: the data from the different sources are well, different. One showed the 380 with hydrashoks as 12" penetration and mushrooming to .55", and the 38 with the same weight hydrashok at 13" . Another listed a 7" penitration. Some showed the ammo being close, some far.
Another thing is: most CARRY 380s have a 2.3-3" barrel. Most carry 38s are 2". However, the "testguns" for .38 are 4" barrels, and of course, you get more velocity.

The question is: would a BG actually know the difference between them if you shot him with a double tap square in the upper chest area? I think not.

I carry a .380 Colt Mustang, in stanless with the HS ammo mentioned. I am in Florida ( Or Floriduh, as you may) and we wear lighter clothes, and mainly shorts. ( What do you call a Floridian wearing walking shorts and a golf style shirt? Business casual dress) I am also only 5'7, and am small framed. The choise was not so much the ammo, but the size of the gun to be concealed. The revolver was thicher, due to the cylinder. With the IWB holster, it shows thru the shirt. The Colt Mustang was thinner and occupies less space. The above mentioned outfit and a good IWB holster, for me, is very concealed, and easy to put into action.
When I bought it, the mustang ws the sammest one, maybe now, I would go Kel-tec or the LCP, but still a .380.
If the PPK with 380 is good enough for James Bond, it good enough for me. (Tongue in cheek)
 
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