Would Banning Firearms Reduce Murder and Suicide?

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Thread: Would Banning Firearms Reduce Murder and Suicide?

  1. #16
    Senior Member Array tbrenke's Avatar
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    Would banning cars reduce the drinking problem?

    the answer to both is no.
    "I cannot undertake to lay my finger on that article of the Constitution, which granted a right to Congress of expending, on objects of benevolence, the money of their constituents." -1792, James Madison
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  3. #17
    Senior Member Array psychophipps's Avatar
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    One thing that gets skipped over a lot in the "violent crime rates" discussion in other countries than the US is the fact that they rarely, if ever, go into the true statistics that matter: crime rate per capita. You can toss out big numbers all you like, but if there isn't any context that makes any sense other than another media attempt to make you not miss your guns.

    On another board someone had posted that despite having approximately the same population as New York State, Australia has a lower crime rate. So I whipped out the stats from government of Australia and New York and proceeded to point out that there were more rapes and robberies, without any other violent crimes being counted, then there were violent crimes in New York across the entire violent crime spectrum. Something completely berserk like around 700,000 assaults (not counting the 100,000+ rapes and robberies) in the May 2004 to April 2005 compared to right around 90,000 violent crimes total in New York State.

    Shocking stats, but hardly surprising to me as I used to hang out with some Australian exchange students in college. Those boys would start a knock-down, drag-out brawl at the drop of a hat while saying how crazy we "Yanks" are because we allow our citizens to own firearms with such minimal legal controls.

  4. #18
    RKM
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    It would reduce the usage of firearms for suicide and murder. But as a whole........ very little, if any.

  5. #19
    Distinguished Member Array Ghettokracker71's Avatar
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    Which would kill more people? A car with a full tank of gas, or an assault magazine with a full high capacity magazine? .

    This is easy, a car. Even a small vehicle like a Mini Cooper or Honda Civic could easily plow WAY more people than even the most premium and high powered of rifles.

    Yet nobody wants to ban motor vehicles? In every country, last I checked cars kill WAY more than firearms do. Yet basically any 16 year old in the US is trusted with mommy or daddys Suburban or Expedition and let out to terrorize the streets. Don't make alot of sense to me?

    I'm glad folks mentioned Cain and Abel. I use this example all the time with "Christian" anti-gun folk. What about David and Goliath? David killed a "giant" with a SLINGSHOT.

    Murder, violent crimes and suicide are all human actions. Even if you don't believe in the Bible, or are a Christian. Its historically documented that war, murder and violent crimes happened long before firearms were invented, much less readily available.


    "To blame a gun for a mans decision is to foolishly attribute free will to an inanimate object"- Colion Noir.

  6. #20
    Member Array TomInJax's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HotGuns View Post
    Murder has been in the hearts of men since the days of Adam and Eve.

    Banning the tools to do it will only mean that a different tool will be used.
    I second that. Britain is banning swords and knives because murderers have resorted to the next weapon of choice.


    Tom

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  7. #21
    Distinguished Member Array alachner's Avatar
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    Would banning forks and spoons make people less fat? No! The same result would happen with banning guns to prevent murder and suicide. People will just use a different tool such as a knife, hammer, sword, rope, poison, brick, block, ax, etc.. Last time I checked murder was banned all over the World. Yes, murders still going on every day around the World. So no, banning firearms will not reduce murder and suicide. It will just make it easier for criminals to attack innocent men and women.
    "If you carry a gun, people will call you paranoid. That's ridiculous... If I have a gun, what in the hell do I have to be paranoid for?" [Clint Smith - Thunder Ranch]

  8. #22
    Member Array GhostRed7's Avatar
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    The only thing that banning firearms would reduce is the "murder" of criminals that stumble on to the legal carrying ppl such as ourselves.
    "Sir, could you please not bleed so much? I have to clean the store after they haul you off and I'd like the rest of my shift, to be, like, you know, better."

  9. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by psychophipps View Post
    One thing that gets skipped over a lot in the "violent crime rates" discussion in other countries than the US is the fact that they rarely, if ever, go into the true statistics that matter: crime rate per capita. You can toss out big numbers all you like, but if there isn't any context that makes any sense other than another media attempt to make you not miss your guns.

    On another board someone had posted that despite having approximately the same population as New York State, Australia has a lower crime rate. So I whipped out the stats from government of Australia and New York and proceeded to point out that there were more rapes and robberies, without any other violent crimes being counted, then there were violent crimes in New York across the entire violent crime spectrum. Something completely berserk like around 700,000 assaults (not counting the 100,000+ rapes and robberies) in the May 2004 to April 2005 compared to right around 90,000 violent crimes total in New York State.
    Maybe this will shed a little light on the subject--- Murders (per capita) statistics - countries compared - NationMaster

    We do have a higher murder rate than Australia.

    As for other violent crime --- rapes per capita, Rapes (per capita) by country. Definition, graph and map.

    Australia is in third place (3rd worst) and the US is in 9 th place. Of course definitions may vary and reporting may be more vigorous in one place than another.

    My impression from a couple of long visits and talk with relatives is that you are pretty helpless against a home invader there as compared to here, which perhaps accounts for the higher rape rate.

    Australia has a high burglary rate, is #1, v the US at 17th place. Burglaries (per capita) by country. Definition, graph and map.

    This is evident when you go about and look at how folks must cover their windows with steel awning to combat break ins. We don't see the sort of window coverings they have there, here. Not in our good neighborhoods.

    I think the high burglary and rape rates have to be a function of two aspects of life there. 1) gun prohibition; 2) laws against defending (harming) an intruder. Don't know if it is true or not but I was told that if someone breaks in you aren't even allowed to hit them.

    There is certainly a lot more risk to a home invader in a castle doctrine state than in a place where no one has weapons and you can't even strike out at the intruder.
    oneshot likes this.

  10. #24
    VIP Member Array glockman10mm's Avatar
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    Reduction of criminals who commit crime is the way to reduce murder. That is accomplished quite handiley with said firearms.
    oneshot likes this.
    Ignorance is a long way from stupid, but left unchecked, can get there real fast.

  11. #25
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    It's difficult to prove any type of correlation between banning firearms and the murder/suicide rate. There are just too many other variables that can influence the statistics. It's often reported that violent crime drops in areas where citizens are armed but there are other things that can influence those numbers also.

    I do feel however that if guns are banned, it will be very difficult to put the genie back in the bottle and lift the ban and I know for a fact that in a defensive situation, guns are the great equalizer that allow weaker individuals to defend themselves against someone far stronger. Prescription drug abuse and methamphetamine use in my state are totally out of control. Addicts are robbing people and businesses daily in an attempt to either get the drugs or the money to buy them.

    Murder and suicide will always be with us, but if guns are banned, it will be the law abiding citizens that are disarmed first. That will just increase the victim pool and, to me, that's not acceptable.

  12. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ric View Post
    Would banning forks and spoons, prevent people from being overweight ?
    I never thought of that. I think I will try and see.....HA

    I am pretty confident that taking guns and knives would make us all safe. As long as we are all in a rubber isolation bubble. Better idea is to ban morons who try to steal our rights. It is called vote them out!
    It's not a problem til they make it one!

  13. #27
    RKM
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    Quote Originally Posted by RockBottom View Post
    Addicts are robbing people and businesses daily in an attempt to either get the drugs or the money to buy them.
    The addicts should just rob the drugs from the people with the drugs.

  14. #28
    VIP Member Array Guns and more's Avatar
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    The fact that a culture would allow the ownership of a tool (such as a firearm) also speaks to the mindset of that society / culture.
    We allow ownership of guns, not because we fear our neighbors, but rather we fear our government. The founding fathers saw the probability of oppression, and made a provision for defense.

  15. #29
    Senior Member Array Chad Rogers's Avatar
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    I think it probably would. The reality is that firearms make it easier to kill people on a grander scale or kill somebody you otherwise might not be able to with other weapons.

    That being said, I don't care enough about the murder rate, with or without firearms, to want to pass on my ability to protect myself should crunch time ever come.

  16. #30
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    Ya know that saying about there's no such thing as a stupid question ...

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